actually, the “all time low” is also the case in europe, which is easy to understand, since the US alone have a way bigger defense budget than all european countries put together.

Difference is, you say things and think using the caps lock key makes you correct. I’ve proven my argument with sources, you have not, you’ve just given us your opinion under the false impression it is a fact.

what facts?
you posted your opinion (zero facts), I gave facts that have happened and were documented (and talked about on this very board)

anyway, it’s not about which one is better (at least for everybody except you, obviously), but simply showing that your claim “rafale=rubbish” is pure nonsense

as for europe keeping up, it will as long as political leaders keep thinking about stuff like “sovereignity, independance, etc…” they’ll keep it working, this way or another (at least those that have an aeronautical industry)

None of which actually proves anything. As for what I do and do not know, thats for me to know. QRT to being qualified to talk about EW systems, being “in the air force” doesn’t really prove anything. Now if you were a senior engineer working on the algorithms or electronics for the SPECTRA system, then that would be proof, but you’d have to be able to prove you were said person as anyone could make such a claim. Such people of course have nice jobs and are unlikely to risk them by telling all on a public aviation forum. Furthermore, anyone connected with the Rafale or the AdA is hardly an objective source for information about Typhoon.

Most EW suites can lock onto SAMs, this is nothing special, so stop acting as if it is.
With regards to using “exercises” as proof of any classified electronics, its completely pointless, and proves nothing. The fact that large numbers of equally stupid people repeat equally inaccurate rumours, does not make the inaccuate accurate.

except that the rafales were the only ones to lock on them (others, including f-16s whose job it is to treat them did not. after that, it was said that the F-16s didn’t lock because they didn’t cary their “specific” pod for that role…

so, it seems that “most” ECM suites don’t do it.. what’ smore, SPECTRA not only detected the sites, but also provided firing solutions so that the threat could be destroyed

Yet they are pretty much giving Rafale away, yet still nobody is taking them up on their offer, which proves my point. Typhoon is selling very, very well however 😀

As for Typhoon flying, it most certainly does, and is less dangerous to fly than Rafale too! It also flies with a helmet mounted sight, a proper ECM system (or is Rafale’s towed decoy one of them invisible ones?) and an IRST system. As for Rafale doing SEAD, it doesn’t have an anti-radiation missile, it has an anti-surface missile filling the role because there is nothing else. Rafale also lacks any dedicated short range missile, again using a kind of bodge missile that does short and long range, and you know what they say about a jack of all trades, he’s a master of none (and BVR/WVR operate very differently). The Typhoons CAPTOR also completely outclasses the Rafale’s RBE2, when comparing tracking range to tracking range or detection range to detection range or scan angle to scan angle.

ROFL… 😀

rafale uses an integrated ECM suit (ever heard of SPECTRA?), they considered a towed decoy unnecessary. For SEAD, as it can locate a “radiation” target precisely and treat it with a weapon that the enemy can’t fool by stopping his emissions,

one last thing, the captor may sound nice on paper, but from what I’ve read not so long ago, without fundings the typhoon won’t get any like that in near future

sorry to burst your bubble, but what you talk about is mostly “marketing talk” and as for the “sales argument”, its easier to sell when you pay your customer to take some (like that austrian guy sitting in jail for corruption, or saudis who made pressure on blair government to stop investigation by british department of justice – it was talked over on BBC ad nauseum not so long ago)

keep dreaming if you like, but for now, the one doing his job, and well, in various roles is the rafale.

frunny how everybody likes to point out “the french”…

UK does the same (wants a leadership in any similar program)

The major problem with the European Air Force idea, as with European Union (nice name), is that you have a lot of countries which have centuries of history and tradition, culture and identity, that don’t want to loose all that.. and try to pull things their way.

There’s no real union, everybody considers himself as french, german, polish, etc… way before considering himself european. In such circumstances, saying “the next fighter will include all european aircraft makers” is at least optimistic, if not plain naive.

Every nation has its own goals, its own agenda, and there’s little to no chance at all that they all meet together in a single set of requirements, simply because the ones having lesser requirements will refuse to finance somebody else’s requirements, and as in a development you can’t make a clear separation, they’ll simply split away, again…

And, considering the “there’s no money” argument, from what I’ve read, the typhoon costs the participating nations more than the rafale costs france… not exactly an argument in favor of “doing stuff together, don’t you think? 😉

ok, now it’s official, scooter can’t read… 😀

thing is, nobody has no information whatsoever about how the F-35 would perform against anyone… but some prefer to believe LMs claims rather than simply say “it is expected to do this and that but nobody knows really”

when the rafale program had been started (not even called “rafale” at the time), nobody had anything even approcahing “5th gen”. The F-16 barely entered service and the mirage 2000 as well.

It was the normal cold war rythm: when one fighter starts getting into service, its replacement is already developed.

What mostly delayed the rafale was the lack of fundings after 1989 (end of cold war), so, instead of having it in service for some 20 years or so, by now, it is still just entering service and in reduced numbers.

Had the fundings been present, it is quite possible that the rafale would have been built faster, in greater numbers (cheaper), and, what’s more, its replacement would have been in the works for some 10-15 years by now.

The only country who could afford to develop something lik ethe F-22 was a country that had an almost unlimited budget (not caring about debt and capable to print more money if need arises without caring about its exchange rate: the USA.

That’s the major difference that allowed the F-22 to exist (or even the F-35 with its huge development costs)