Not everything is on the net.
And I can vouch for the veracity of Vikas’s post, infact it (the participation) is much more extensive than what Vikas posted. Like I said in another thread, PAFs role here is congruent to the one in the K-8 programme where it was involved from scratch to finish, though plans for local manufacture were scrapped due to cost prohibitions. Believing us or not is your perrogerrative, I’m secure in the knowledge that what has been posted is true.

Au contraire, the F-104 was in PAF service before the Mig-21 was in the IAF. Also the pschycological effect of the F-104 in 65 was tremendous, after all it was not the PAF jocks who were frequently heard exclaiming, ”run it’s a 104!” on open channel in 65.
For CASSargodha’s info, PAF in the late 70s and early 80s actually seriously wanted to acquire the Mirage F1 in numbers with tot. Sadly other events during that time forced the abandonment of these plans.

I personally preffer OpenFalcon and allied force over red viper. For any hardcore modern combat flight simer Falcon4 is an addiction. Look for Jane’s combat sims series(they are a mix of study rims and simlites) by EA on Ebay but only if u still have a pc with win98.

Good old Generation1 transformers!(wither thou went childhood of mine!)
They should have left him as an Eagle.
Wonder what Wingsabre turns into in the movie?

I felt sorry for the lance corporal 3 years ago and still do. But I never thought I’d feel sorry for the pilots. Watched the whole video online and have heard discussions about it on both cnn and bbc world service news. What is clear to me is that it is the bloody jarhead facs who should be held responsible. The hog drivers repeatedly asked for confirmation of friendlies and every time they got a negative from the marine FACs. Hearing the wingman cry on the video well it just was sad.:(

Why would the mounting of two new hardpoints near the intakes on the Mirage 5 have any affect on the outboard pylons?

Not under the intakes but approximately where the wing joins with the fuselage center barrell. They are not hardpoints per se but more like store stations flush with the fuselage. I got to know this as a kid from reading my first book about fighters(Bill Gunston’s work). Plus I showed the entry to my aunt’s husband who at that time was a PAF Mirage driver and he confirmed what Gunston had written(about 15 years ago). Hell even I’ve not seen any such pics showing the full seven stores stations occupied but the word of one Mirage driver was/is good enough for me.

True, there is not a single proven reference of any JF-17 subsystem being designed & developed by Pakistan. Nor on this forum, so asking rayr. to use the search function is meaningless. :confused:
There are some references to Pakistan sending a handful of PAF engineers, and a few flight test crew to China- but this is done by most AF’s worldwide for any new induction being developed in another country.

So anybody know the answer,?

I do to some extent, as well a few other members on Pakdef.info. Why we have choosen not to post this info plus a hell of a lot more is due to our own discretion. We regularly discuss what goes on amongst ourselves privately and all of us have decided that it is better for us not to post these things in public without permission from our individual sources or even pm them to people whom we don’t know.
An example an Indian member here called Golden arrow used to get on the case of the K-8 and Pakistan’s contribution in it. Truth being we were involved in it as well as the Thunder to a very large extent than is either known or divulged publicly. Hell my own chacha was involved in the K-8’s design team from PAF’s side along with many other PAF personnel and is now working on the Thunder design team. But whatever I get to know from him or other sources wrt Pakistan’s role is kept to me myself and the other people I’ve mentioned in my post. It’s only after we discuss among ourselves and consult with our sources that we decide what we ought to put forward for public consumption. And so far we have decided to post zilch details of our contributions in both the K-8 and JF-17 programmes. Just because it ain’t on the net does not meant that it does not exist.

Same as were before in the 80s and 90s.
Yeah these are the conditions which were agreed upon on Monday, I confirmed these about an hr ago.