Dave HomewoodAll I can say is it will certainly be a really interesting Classic Fighters next Easter for their film-themed airshow if they have six Lancasters sitting on the airfield, eh!
Dave HomewoodTests of the bouncing bombs were carried out by a Wellington
Dave HomewoodThank God they arnt going to re do the Dambusters..Look at the mess they have made of some great great oldies the latest and perhaps the best example of a muck up being ” Flight of the phoenix “…there too many others to bore you with a list…LEAVE IT ALONE !
Well personally I think Peter Jackson’s remake of King Kong is by far and away thousands of times better than the orignal. Some said the 1933 version was a classic that shouldn’t be remade too… but there you go. I like old films but some people get stuck in the mud. If a remake comes along it doesn’t mean you can’t watch the original anymore. It’s just like a reprint of a classic book that has been updated. You can still find the first editions if you want to,
Dambusters could certainly be remade well and much better than the original in the right hands.
I don’t know what to believe at all with all the rumours, conflicting news reports, and information from respected people like Beaufighter VI who have had info first hand. I just hope this project does go ahead with Mr Jackson as the director. The film needs a remake by someone sympathetic towards history and the brains to make it cinemagraphically better, to get the facts straightened out and upgrade the poor special effects.
Dave HomewoodThese rumours just get better and better though, eh!
Out of interest while on the subject of Lancasters replicas, what became of the replica Lancaster that was being built in Canada last year, at that place where they have a Bf109? Did it get finished?
The Mosquito flying is a probability. Two Lancs flying a possibiity. A flying Wellington? About as likely as seeing it in formation with the Chinese Stirling I’d think.
Dave HomewoodIt never ceases to amaze me when aircraft like this are up for scrap, and everyone seems to sigh and say oh well, can’t be helped. Surely there must be some rich Arabs who’d have the money to take thelikes of these Shackletons or the now dead BA collection on. The Sultan of Brunei collects cars (biggest collection in the world) so may be iinterested in planes. The point is, someone, somewhere will have the interest and the money but just may not be aware of the situation of aircraft under threat.
Surviving in the Middle East or somewhere like that would be better than not at all.
Dave HomewoodI know you aren’t trying to be inflammatory Dave. However it’s important to put such remarks in context, which was what I was trying to do.
In your own post you’ve acknowledged that RNZAF friendly fire happened, yet also state in the following paragraph that the marking on RNZAF aircraft were to prevent US attacks – which may be true of the documentation, but I’m sure they were appreciative that their fellow Kiwis (or Aussies, Dutch or Poms) wouldn’t be attacking as well.
Back to the subject of the thread, however, the USAAF P-40L. Points to the Italians for an excellent and thoughtful display of an ultra-rare aircraft. While it looks simple, it’s evident that a good deal of expensive, awkward and easily overlooked museum quality conservation work has been done on the airframe, to preserve it, and it’s interesting how a number of people have posted to say they appreciate the display.
Big thumbs up all around.
Groan. As far as I am aware the RAAF, RAF and Dutch did not operate fighters in the same area as the RNZAF, hence the reason they did not get any mention. I have never seen any reports of the RNZAF Fighter Wing operating with anyone other than the USAAF, USMC and USN. As stated, one of the cases of an RNZAF vs RNZAF shoot down was in NZ during training, I have not checked yet to see where the other was. I’m not certain that it was in the combat area. You’re making far too much of what I said and seemigly trying to stir it up. All I was doing was adding a little reasoning behind the different style of roundel seen on our combat aircraft, for the many who won’t know.
I agree with your last paragraph wholeheartedly however. The preservation of this aircraft is incredible. I’m amazed to see how well the paint survived.
Dave HomewoodI’m not trying to be inflammatory at all. I’m just going by the combat reports that RNZAF pilots made of aircraft such as P-38’s and Corsairs bouncing them and shooting at them, and the actions taken afterwards by the chain of command when it was realised that many US pilots mistook our aircraft as being Japanese Tony’s, and that the red in the roundel didn’t help these matters.
It’s all in Chris Rudge’s book ‘Air To Air’ as well as other books about our air combat in the Pacific about these friendly fire incidents. I’m not laying blame nor saying it didn’t happen between other air forces at all. Of course it did and still does. At least two RNZAF P-40 pilots shot down other RNZAF P-40’s (one over NZ!). It happens.
The fact remains, those unique style roundels were developed because of the identification problems US pilots were having. The US and NZ were operating in the same sectors all the time but not always aware of who was where. It’s all perfectly understandable. Today with the masses of technology it would not be acceptable, but then I can uinderstand.
No doubt now though someone here will still accuse me of being “anti-American” as they always seem to.Yawn.
As for the P-40F/Corsair deal, sure there are probably details of the deal we may not be privy to, and never will be, and it’s not any of my business. It just seemed as a casual observation to be less than balanced and I wondered if Wigram had actually acquired something more for the collection than just the P-40. Any acquisition/donated item is interesting. To me anyway.
I agree if the two F’s were Spitfires they’d be flying, and both P-40’s could have been made to fly too. I just doubt the Wigram one would be much less a new item than the P-40E is. It is, as it happens, being rebuilt to airworthy standards. This is standard policy in case they ever decide to trade an aircraft it’s much more valuable an item if it can fly. They just won’t fly it while in their possession.
Dave HomewoodYes, that’s the beauty. Complete with correct RNZAF Paciic roundel and white stripes designed to try to prevent the USAAF and USN from shooting our aircraft doiwn. Luckily on most occasions when our fighters were fired on they were bad shots and missed.The green/blue camouflage colours are also uniquely NZ too.
Dave HomewoodThe other was traded to the RNZAF museum who are configuring it as the more common P-40E – I have to say a strange decision, as, given the spares support for Merlin engines, a trade for a more appropriate model would be possible and wouldn’t involve spaying a perfectly good P-40F into an E model. However, it’s their aircraft.
James, did you see the state of the two aircraft when they were recovered from the swamp? They were not that great at that stage, The term wreck seems rather mild. And then when it was decided to ‘rebuild’ one to fly, all the useful components that might help the project -F model-wise were apparently stripped from the second airframe, according to what i was told by the Pioneer Aero guys, who’ve been watching the projects closely.
What was left was a very stripped down, very wrecked second airframe. The RNZAF Museum went for that because it was an option that they could take to gain a representative type. They could in no way afford to buy a P-40E, and no-one would donate one, so they did a swap for their Corsair and got an airframe to rebuild. On arrival it could not really be considered an F model anymore as all the F parts were taken off, so I’m told.
The term rebuild for this is also too strong. The airframe is really only a reference point for a new bulld. The wings are totally new built, and I think much of the fuselage is too. There is certainly very little of the P-40F aircraft in their new P-40E.
That P-40F would not have been a viable project for flight or static without such treatment, a complete new-build of most bits. So, why build a P-40F when we never used them? Someone else could just as easily build a brand ne F and buy the data plates from the RNZAF Museum I guess.
The swap of these two airframes seems odd – the Corsair was virtually complete and in reasonably good condition. I’m surprised it’s not already flying. The P-40F however was not in any state close to the Corsair when it arrived, and a virtually new aircraft has had to be built and continues to be built. I wonder if there was more to the deal than a straight swap, and maybe something extra came along with the P-40. I hope so otherwise it seems like a rip-off, getting a plane you have to build from scratch for a complete airframe.
Perhaps if they’d started from scratch with a P-40E new build they’d be not too much worse off and still have a Corsair which they at one stage planned to backdate to the correct mark. Oh well, at least it should fly again someday which it wouldn’t have done at Wigram.
And they cannot complain about the cost of the Crsair I guess as it was donated by Disney Corporation.
Dave HomewoodCrikey, it took 86 hours to fly it from Ardmore to the UK? I wouldn’t want to be a passenger on that one.
This is as much a piece of NZ heritage as it is part of Britain’s, but I doubt we’ll see it return to this country. Mind you we have loads preserved here in museums even if none are flying.
Dave HomewoodThere is also an Australian owned Rapide flying in NZ, and won’t be leaving the country like the owner thought as the Govt has said it’s too important a piece of history to NZ to go abroad.
I have not seen the riginal film with Peter Finch but I have seen the remake starring Bryan Brown many years ago. It was superb, from memory. But I was a teen at the time.
Dave HomewoodPat Monk did some of the test flying of the CT-4 Airtrainer which he designed, as well as ground testing (including the canopy jettison test where the prototype was tethered behind a C-130 Hercules with engines running full tilt to simulate airspeed).
However, I don’t believe Pat was actually a pilot, ie with a licence. I’m not certain, but I think he didn’t have a licence, but he went up on some of the test flights with a test pilot and did some flying himself to test the limits of his design work from what I recall him telling me over the years. I cannot ask him again now, sadly he has Parkinsons disease and doesn’t remember anything.
Oh, and yes the Airtrainer did serve in numbers with the military in New Zealand, Australia, Thailand and Indonesia, plus some Asian police forces. It was built in a factory with a large staff, which continues today to produce aircraft (NZAI/PAC have produced Flectchers, Crescos and PAC-750’s as well as Airtrainers. Pat also designed the Cresco and did much improvement design work on the Fletcher family and the Airtourer family)
Dave HomewoodNot only a nice sight but it would be nice to hear as well. I reckon the Napier Sabre would certainly sound different to your run of the muill Merlins and Griffons.
Nice for some to think that the sound of Merlins and Griffons is run of the mill. All I get to hear round here are Fletcher topdressers and the occasional turboprop airliner… bah!
Dave HomewoodJames, I was thinking more in terms of likeable personalities like Yoda. Cruise is getting so wierd he’s nearing the level of wacko Jacko as far as I’m concerned, so i certainly won’t be going to see the threequel to another bad remake with him in.
Temuera Morrison who starred as Bobba Fett in the latest round of Star Wars movies had/has his own talk show here called The Tem Show. In one episode he talked about the making of the films he was in, and showed a clip which had several variations of him in it. Rememebr, he was cloned… Anyway, he pointed to one and said that was him, he did the acting. He then pointed to others, just as lifelike, and said they were CGI. You cannot tell the difference. They were all animated too, not just static.
I reckon CGI Lancasters would look pretty impressive these days.
Dave HomewoodJohn, my comments were not pointed towards your knowledge but towards the usually narrow-thinking film industry who would automatically make a night raid, if you see what I mean.
There are so, many options out there. You’re right, the Mitchell would be a good option, but it would also be good to see perhaps Mosquitoes, Blenheims or more especialy Wellingtons and Lancasters on a low level daylight raid in a film. Good CGI could do it, I’m confident of that. We’re now seeing completely generated humans on screen and you don’t notice, so why not a plane?
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