Yeah all good. I’m as disappointed as you about what has happened to the aircraft.
Don’t blame me for this utter catastrophe, l.garey.
I just came across an earlier one again. From the AUCKLAND STAR, 30 MARCH 1940
RIGGER RIDES ON ‘PLANE BAREBACK.
NOVEL FLIGHT.
Taken Aloft On Spitfire Fighter.
SITS ASTRIDE FUSELAGE.
British Official Wireless. (Received 12.30 p.m.) RUGBY. March 20.
A young aircraftsman, working as a rigger at an R.A.F. Fighter Command station, had the unique experience of “riding bareback” on a Spitfire machine, sitting astride the fuselage and facing tailwards.
The pilot, after taking off, was puzzled by the weight and the unresponsive behaviour of the tail of the aircraft, and made a circuit of the aerodrome. His passenger, gripping tight with his knees and arms, hung on grimly. Meanwhile, the ground staff, gravely anxious, summoned the medical officer and the emergency staff with equipment, including a fire engine. The pilot landed smoothly, the aircraftsman being none the worse.
Look at the size of that General Melchert-level moustache!!
Superb thread, thanks to all those who are sharing these fantastic images.
I wish the RNZAF or at least some of our major museums in New Zealand had developed a similar philosophy at that time. Sadly nothing was done to start preservation here till the mid-late 1960’s and that was only down to private individuals, and collectively by members of the amateur group the Aviation Historical Society of New Zealand (AHSNZ) on behalf of the fledgling collection of the Museum of Transport And Technology. It was not till the very late 1970’s that the AHSNZ convinced the RNZAF to start preserving airframes, and that became the basis of their now excellent museum which opened properly in 1987. So we in NZ were well behind the curve.
The RNZAF had a Seafire XV that had been left behind by the Fleet Air Arm in 1946 having been damaged during exercises here, and they used it as an instructional airframe for Aircraft Finishers at the Technical Training School. Recently a December 1954 article was posted to the Wings Over New Zealand Forum about its impending destruction by the scrapper and a chap called Owen Shaw was trying to raise awareness that it should be saved and preserved. Well. it did not get saved, and was melted down along with so many other aeroplanes. This was just months before Sir Keith Park arranged for a Spitfire XVIe to be brought to NZ for display in the Auckland War Memorial Museum. I commented about how silly it was they were scrapping a Seafire in Auckland but bringing a Spitfire all the way from Britain.
Responses that my comments got included:
“Trouble was Dave, that in those days, surplus aircraft were not generally seen as suitable museum acquisitions for most collections. It was probably late 50s, more likely 60s that the preservation of potentially historic aircraft became fashionable.”
And:
“Also, folks had probably had enough of war after experiencing two huge global conflicts during the first half of the 20th century. So back then, old war aeroplanes would have represented something that many people would have preferred to forget.”
Well I was a bit angry and replied thus:
“It does not really matter what the “general population” thought at the time, museums are duty bound to preserve history and tell its story – that is their sole purpose, and there has been nothing more historic in terms of national involvement, expenditure and upheaval than WWII. So even as early as 1946 most museums SHOULD have recognised that they had just been through the most significant period in the nation’s history. It had completely changed the entire nation, far more than WWI had. And they SHOULD have been working right from that time to ensure the history of those times, or at least some of it, was preserved and not lost forever – that is their job.
The Government should have also been doing what they could to assist this, providing storage, allocating airframes, vehicles and anything else that was surplus to go to preservation.
After all, in 1919 the museums and other organisations, even whole towns across New Zealand were all allocated war prizes brought back from Europe by the shipload because it was recognised that the items would mean something in the future to those who’d served and younger generations. By 1946 the likes of Auckland War Memorial Museum, which was a fully established war museum, and the Dominion Museum, Canterbury Museum, Otago Museum and others should have been lining up for war prizes, decommissioned items, booty, the lot. And that includes aeroplanes.
Even in 1956 when Sir Keith managed to acquire the Spitfire from the RAF and the RNZAF allocated the Zero to Auckland War Memorial Museum, they should not have stopped there. They should have realised the huge gap in their collection and gone after a Corsair and a P-40, a Hudson and a Ventura from Rukuhia as well as other important types – they had more than ten years to do so before all the Rukuhia aircraft were scrapped, and they were not expensive.
Such aeroplanes would be far more significant to the nation’s history than a lot of the items in display in their museum, and especially as the museum had been dedicated specifically as a War Memorial Museum.
Just saying “people were not interested” means nothing. Most people are not interested in their 1800’s lace doilies, or their old furniture, or their stuffed birds or ancient Pacific artworks. Some people are, but most people aren’t. But they collected all those items and tens of thousands of other ephemeral things though, because they knew they were significant to “some people”.
And collecting those aeroplanes would have saved and preserved vastly more relevant items than most of the items in their galleries now. They actually could have taken a truck down to Rukuhia and actually saved Wairarapa Wildcat. And Corsair ‘Tutae Wera’. And that Seafire. They didn’t, and frankly I think that is a massive fail by the museums in those early decades after the war.”
And I am unanimous in that!
So were letters like this sent to all station commanders and squadron commanders, etc, across the whole RAF?
And was this the beginnings of the RAF Museum at Hendon?
I wonder if any photos or drawings exist of Barnes Wallis’s boat as described by Bill.
You’re right there John. Like how so many armchair experts talk about the Short Stirling, Fairey Fulmar, Fairey Albacore and other types with great disdain and yet when you speak with the people who actually flew them operationally you get a whole different perspective because they loved them.
Thanks Tony, I was just going by what Bill said. I’d never heard of Hook, to be honest.
Good stuff. That is an impressive piece of kit, that brake press. Thanks for posting Matt.
We also lost one of the greatest rugby players of all time and a truly great New Zealander yesterday with the death of Sir Colin Meads, aged 81.
Pinetree Meads had been suffering from pancreatic cancer for the past year.
Does anyone know when the last time a Spitfire landed on a beach was, before this filming took place?
I seriously loved that beach landing scene. There may have been a little licence employed in the glide path, but it matters not a bit. Seeing it on the beach at Dunkirk and knowing that two of the Mk 1 Spitfires now flying were rescued from the French beaches and are flying again was pretty damned special I thought. Also I knew that Alan Deere had been forced to put down on the Dunkirk beach in similar fashion, luckily he was not captured.
My memory from the film is the Spitfire landing on the beach seemed to be flying from left (west) to right (east) along the beach. But all the photos and footage show it going the other direction. Confused. Is my memory of the actual film sequence wrong? I’ve only seen it once.
I thought the film was brilliant. Beautifully shot, an understated script that showed the bleak, cold reality of war and defeat perfectly. No heroics, blood and guts, stupid love triangles or other nonsense that the Hollywood blockbusters insist on including. Just fear, terror, and the unknown.
The aerial footage was fantastic. I love the fact they had the cast members in the cockpit of real aeroplanes rather than the usual studio green screen. And the model work with the German aircraft was incredibly realistic. The only disappointing things for me were the Blenheim’s cameo was all too fleeting, and the fact they used that way too modern railway carriage at the end that broke the reality for me. Surely they could have at least fitted some old leather seats.
Despite earlier comments on this thread from last year, no they didn’t CGI the nose of the Buchon as some reckoned they would to make it into a Bf109. And no they didn’t add the Spitfire code letters in post production either, as some said they would. Did that matter? Not at all.
The Spitfire ditching scene was fantastic, incredibly realistic. Is there any behind the scenes clips showing how that was achieved?
The final scene with the Spitfire landing on the beach and then being burned out was so wonderfully done, such an emotional moment to watch that Spitfire land there knowing it really had come down on that beach during the real Battle and had laid there for decades before its rebuild. A perfect piece of film making. Seeing it burning (the replica) was very sad but extremely powerful.
One puzzle, IMDb states “Christopher Nolan and Warner Bros reputedly bought a vintage WWII Lufttwaffe bomber for use in this movie, at a cost of $5 million.” Can anyone explain this please? Or was it erroneous?
I hope Ridley Scott’s upcoming Battle of Britain film follows on with the same level of excellence as seen in the aerial footage for Dunkirk.