Dave HomewoodI’m well aware that the original Airtourer design was Australian – it was also designed by a Britsih-trained Pole and was made from wood and highly underpowered compared to NZ produced metal versions.
Your link claiming that the Airtrainer was a New Zealand version of the Aircruiser is yet another perpetuation of the total rubbish Aussie myth. The CT/4 is structurally a totally new design, despite resembling the Airtourer and Aircruiser from a distance. Ask people who’ve worked on them. The Airtrainer is far stronger and more aerobatic. The Kiwi team took a good design, stripped it back, reworked everything, and made it a much better design with whole new original ideas. It just looks similar on the outside, that’s all.
Saying a CT/4 is an Australian design, like many books do (I know you were not) is as bad as saying a Wirraway or Boomerang or CA-15 were designed by North American, because a few parts were interchangable or they look similar to a Harvard or Mustang.
As for the Fletcher, I also knew that was originally an American concept, designed as a military COIN aircraft, where it failed to impress. The New Zealanders redeveloped the aircraft into a successful role of topdressing. (As it happens New Zealanders invented topdressing by the way.)
Anyway the question was never about who “designed” what, it asks about what the best aircraft “produced” are. As military trainers go the CT/4 has proven to be excellent. The RAAF is again considering buying a new fleet of them! And they continue to served in new Zealand, Thailand, Indonesia, etc. But I think the best NZ-designed aircraft for its role has to be the Cresco, who’s lineage harks back in looks to that American Fletcher design but the design work in between is far removed and is strictly a native of these shores.
Designer of the CT/4 and the Cresco, among many other types? The late Pat Monk, a British New Zealander, and thoroughly bloody nice chap.
Dave HomewoodNew Zealand’s CT/4 Airtrainer has done very well, and there are few country’s less significant militarily than us. The same company has also produced Airtourers and Fletchers and Crescos and PAC750XL’s in quantity too.
Dave HomewoodIsn’t the hangar at RAF hendon with their WWI collection named after Graheme-White?
Gustaf Hamel did a long distance flight in a Bleriot XI which later became New Zealand’s first military aircraft. The Bleirot became known as Britannia. The flight Hamel did was flown a distance of 347km non-stop from Dover to Cologne taking 4 hours 18 minutes on April 17, 1913.
Dave HomewoodGloster Grebe
Short Singapore
DH4
DH50A
Fairey IIIF
Fairey Gordon
Blackburn Baffin
Vickers Vincent
Sunderland Mk III
Short Stirling
Dave HomewoodWith all these WWII films Tom Cruise has been linked to or has stated he wants to make, I can’t help thinking he has been re-reading his collection of old Commando Comics whilst looking for inspiration to resurrect his dying career.
Dave HomewoodDave Phillips did an incredibly low and perfectly flown display in his Tiger Moth at Whenuapai’s Open Day a motnh before the Omaka show too. Superb to see his display twice within a month. The only other time ‘ve seen him fly (to my knowledge) is in the Hunter, quite a contrast.
We are very fortunate indeed to have such superb Tiger Moth display pilots as Dave and Ryan in New Zealand, especially as the Tiger Moth aerobatic display is somewhat rare to see at Kiwi shows these days. When we do see them, they are world class.
Dave HomewoodI too remember ‘Tales of the Gold Monkey’ not a bad show which I feel totally preempted the Indiana Jones concept.
Despite it not making its debut till a year after Raiders of the Lost Ark?
Dave HomewoodAdditionally, all the obituaries for Ray Hanna state he lead a team of four Hunters in 1957. Does anyone know what the team was called, or which Squadron operated it? And any details of the displays they did?
Also in 1963 and 1964 he was a member of the College of Air Warfare aerobatic display team flying Meteors. Again, any details? His position in the team, where and when they displayed, etc?
Thanks.
Dave HomewoodThanks chaps. Does anyone have a copy of the book that Thunderbird mentions?
By the way, my web database on NZ aerobatics teams starts here
http://www.cambridgeairforce.org.nz/Airshow_Display_Teams%20Home.htm
The Kiwis in foreign teams page is not yet online, but I know so far of a number of New Zealand pilots who have served or are still serving in foreign teams:
Arthur Clouston = 25 Squadron Team, Hendon, 1933
Edgar Kain = 73 Squadron Team, 1930’s
Dereck Kain = 73 Squadron Team, 1930’s
Trevor Bland = Blue Diamonds, 1960’s
Red Arrows
Ray Hanna
Ian Dick
Ross Boyens
Andrew Keith
Simon Rea (2008)
RAAF Roulettes
Derek Singer
Brietling Fighters
Ray Hanna
Keith Skilling
Is anyone here aware of other New Zealanders who have taken part in flying with non-NZ-based aerobatic display teams?
Thanks
Dave HomewoodI can think of several places I’d very much like to go back in time and be present to witness and take a video camera.
31st of March 1903, Waitohi, South Canterbury, NZ, to witness what really occurred on the road through that small community. Did Richard Pearse really take off and fly?
17th of March 1928, Wigram Aerodrome, Christchurch, NZ, to witness the Southern Cross with Charles Kingsford Smith and his crew arrive after the first ever successful crossing by flight of the Tasman Sea.
1944 – RNZAF Station Ardmore, to watch the Kittyhawks, Corsairs and harvards among other things training in the circuit, just as my father and grandparents did from their farm at the end of the runway.
Early 1940, RNZAF Woodbourne, to see the Vickers Vincents and Vildebeestes training pilots who’d soon be flying Spitfires and Hrricanes in the Battle of britain, etc, and the Baffins and Gordons of the Wellington GR Squadron defending the Cook Strait region.
Suva in Fiji, early 1942. The RNZAF’s Singapore flying boats and Vincents and Hudsons, and the USN’s Catalinas and USAAF P-39’s in the skies above. Awesome.
There are too many more to write really…
Dave HomewoodI understand that a lot of wartime Ansons had the Oxford cowls fitted to them, which explains this.
Interesting to see it in D Day stripes indeed.
Dave HomewoodI would be willing to bet that exteriors with the lancasters will be shot on this now closed base (since 1995) which features
three large WW2 era hangars with open fields and concrete
apron / taxiways all in good condition and not utlilize by
any regular airftraffic.
??? Three hangars? There were seven large WWII hangars there when I was last there. Have they demolished four of them recently? I hope not.
Its the only part of the country with such a location, all
other RNZAF bases are either to small, modernised or
closed down.
Whenuapai and Ohakea are larger than Wigram was, and Woodbourne is around a similar size. There are no other RNZAF bases.
The hangars would easily hold a Lancaster replica.
But do any hangars in NZ look like those at Scampton? I’m not convinced that anywhere in NZ would make a suitable location to double for RAF Scampton in its present condition in terms of buildings, and either an elaborate set would have to be created or they’d be better off filming on location in the UK.
Although, RNZAF Ohakea might also be a consideration as
it still active with a local work force and remote from
media cameras etc.
State Hghway One runs alongside the base, so it’s not that remote for media who might want to stop and spy over the fence. The public stop and view the aircraft there all the time. Wigram for that matter is also very public.
It will be interesting to see what develops.
I agree with you, but as we – the public – are not yet aware of what the filming schedule and locations will be, speculation about the use of RNZAF bases is a bit academic. The production is top secret, they have even made the IMDb page for the film sign-in only so we are not even aware of who the cast are yet. Early speculation on this and any other Weta/Wingnut-related film will probably just become scuttlebuck till the facts are revealed when the filmmakers are ready.
I am looking forward to it, but am not getting too anxious to hear news. We’ll hear when they tell us.
Dave HomewoodI just recall the documenatry vividly for that line about the kids all over England looking up and saying “It’s a Spit”. Whenever I see a Spitfire I hear that line in my head.
The first piece of film Mark refers to is certainly neat.
Dave HomewoodThat could well be the ones.
I recall the Spitfire doco opening scene was from inside a hangar where the doors opened revealling a silouetted Spitfire Mk IX which was rolled out and you hear the sound of a Merlin scream past. Great stuff.
Dave HomewoodI know that documentary, it was from the early 1980’s I believe. My Dad had a copy of it. I think it was called The Spitfire Story but I’m not certain. I think I made a copy of it for my collection and will see if I can find it. It went right through the development of the type from Schneider Trophy till the end of the war.
There was another done I think by the same compnay on the Lancaster too.
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