IMHO Generations are all marketing hype.. I imagine Lockheed will not be too keen on calling the F-22 5th generation fighter when 7th Generation UAV’s are being marketed, BTW 6th generation aircraft are early UAV’s, pilots are sooo 2005 ish.. lol
Cheers
Could it be a pod such as LITENING or LANTIRN, but I was wondering the same thing myself.. interesting read that…
What does the green graphic represent on the left side??
IIRC the Aim 9L were taken from UK NATO stocks the US supplied the UK with rounds to replenish that UK NATO stock..
At least I think thats what happened!!!
Merry Christmas..
IIRC
UK Labour got wind of a possible Argentinian assault on the falklands before 1982, they leaked that a couple of RN subs were lying in wait for the attack, and they got put off the idea.
In 1982 There was talk of a Nuclear capable missile being dropped on their capital (without the warhead) as a strong message, and then if there wasn’t a change of attitude then a real one elsewhere in the country.
So while airpower can give you a graduated response, there are other alternatives, but they tend to be more of a sledgehammer.
The Typhoon has similar combat radii as an F.3 and would certainly be a hurdle to any attack.
They would not stop an attack on its own though, neither would an F-22 or f-35 or A10’s.
Cheers
How many American weapons on the EF2000 ?
Well theres the Sidewinder on some countries models
AMRAAM. ( to be replaced by Meteor.)
bomb guidance kits.
Others could include the Brimstone as a derivative of the Hellfire, but as derivatives go its really only a couple of bolts they have in common.
Thats about it, and theres a reason why there are few, and those which are on there then alternatives exist….
The reason – In the unlikely event of the US using its leverage to knobble the Typhoon in foreign fighter competitions.. ( I know they would never stoop so low as to deny exports to a third party for this reason ;-))
Cheers
No I have no more info on the Captor thats relevent, obviously CAPTOR has its limitations in that area as CAESAR is being produced..
OMNI role sounds good though, even if it means the same thing as swing..
Cheers
The captor mechanical radar has an interesting function:-
Even though CAPTOR features a mechanically steered array, BAE Systems have indicated that the low inertia non-counterbalanced antenna coupled with four high torque, high precision samarium-cobalt drive motors allows extremely high scanning speeds. As a consequence of this the radar can interleave different operations such as air and ground mapping. This is quite an achievement for a non-phased array system.
Now why would they need such a function for an aircraft that isn’t capable of doing two things at once?.
Now the Rafale may be able to do three things at once!, but I guess the workload will require the second crew member.
Personal opinion – I would regard “Swing role” and Omni role” as virtually the same, but I’d love to know the real definition.
Has anyone actually asked Dassault what differentiates ‘omni’ from ‘swing’ in their minds?, the only thing a quick search found was this
The Rafale is a highly agile French twin-engined delta-wing multi-role fighter aircraft designed and built by Dassault Aviation. Dassault use ‘Omni Role’ as a marketing term in an effort to differentiate the aircraft from other ‘multi-role’ fighters which have primary and secondary roles. Dassault also use the term to indicate the ability to switch from one role to another during a single sortie – a ‘Swing Role’ capability first seen in the F/A-18 hornet.
but can’t find anything on dassaults site, perhaps theres something in IIRC ‘fox three’
Regards”
You could argue that for the same money theres 2 possibly even 3 Typhoons ;-).
As good as the F-22 is it can be in two or three places at once.
The Typhoon does restrict its emissions when needs be, it can do an emission free attack, and twothree verses one is always an advantage.
you can all argue till your blue in the face about detection ranges of the APG-77 vs the Captor/Caesar/pirate combo, made more complex by the Meteors extra range.
Who sees who first?, who has the best DASS/decoys/ESM its all part and parcel, its no good the raptor firing the first shot if the Towed decoy or crosseye works as advertised!!, its no good having the Meteor if the Typhoon is getting swamped by Amraams… theres loads of possible combinations other than sensor ranges..
But the odds of seeing a typhoon vs raptor fight for real is pretty remote, how about JSF vs F-22, they should in stealth theory be equals and both get killed by aim 9x’s when they stumble across each other WVR. ;-).
Funny that a supposedly cheap jsf can do that to a F-22.. funny indeed!.
Cheers
http://www.eurofighter.com/Typhoon/Airframe/
Click on “Masses”. It gives an MTOW of 23,500 kg and an empty weight of 11,000 kg.
ISTR 11,150kg for the single seater, The 11,150kg figure is quoted here.
http://www.eurofighter.com/Documents/General/2002.1.PublicFolder.pdf
I also remember a Eurofighter news item where it weighed in at 11,150kg as a production aircraft!!
The twin seater is IIRC ~11,700kg
cheers
hiya
Thanks for that, Hmmm I was under the impression the JSF avarage price is now US$61M, as per last months report to congresss…
its interesting if you compare it to the prices quoted for the F-22 during its development As you may know that started out at US$25M.
If you plot them both the JSF is going to cost around $120M, but I’m sure that will be the upper end of the figures ;-).. If it comes in at US$50M i’ll buy you a beer.. well have to wait n see…
My personal estimation is US$92M -/+ $3M if there are no capability changes.
John, nice to chat with you again.
For those briliant minds that have concluded JSF is better at flying off carriers than Typhoon, duh.
There both capable of flying off carriers, its the landings that are the difficult bit!!
Cheers
Jacko,
Firstly I repeat the $50m not because it is the lowest available because it is the ONLY official forecast for the JSF flyaway price. That is the price forecast being shared with everyone in the program.
Secondly, I submitted a FOI request about the Typhoon £64.8 m unit price asking why the increase from 2004 to 2005. Here is the answer from the MoD:
“The Unit Production Cost (UPC) for Typhoon has increased due to a change in the basis of calculation. The UPC quoted in the Major Projects Report 2005 (MPR05) is based on the production costs only for 144 Tranche 1 and Tranche 2 aircraft that are currently on contract and this change was introduced to better reflect the cost of aircraft being delivered to the RAF. Previous MPR UPCs have been calculated on 232 aircraft which is the full Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) commitment.”
So no new RAB that wasn’t there before and no unexpected charges or any other Jacko baloney, they just re-calculated the number for the first 2 tranches. Now deal with it.
So is the JSF price the avarage for the full number of aircraft of circa 2600????, and its not the flyaway price for the first 1300 ish?, so shouldn’t you compare that with the Typhoons full 638+ for all partners (remember the UK version is the more expensive as it has additional equipment fit to the other partners).
I know the flyaway price thing is frightfully difficult… 😮
Cheers
Inferior technology!!… that would also apply to the F-22 wouldn’t it, seeing as technology from the JSF program is being retrofitted to the F-22.
remember the JSf isn’t due for a while, the typhoon is operating now, in terms of operational effectivness the Typhoon is streets ahead right now…;-)
Now I guess you want to argue the JSF’s capability when its in service!!, so compare the future JSF to the future Typhoon capability, Caesar etc…. please remember the Typhoons capability will not stand still.(BTW the Caesar is performing beyond expectations)
Lets wait till the JSF is fielded before we guess at its capabilities (remember the F-22 IRST, thrust reversers etc.)
As a matter if interest what do people think – will the JSF’s 360 deg IR sensors match the resolution/accuracy of the Forward looking IRST of the Typhoon???.
What is the blacked out square bit Hiding? G being pulled?? what?
Thats not a production representative aircraft:-) its one of the ‘heavy’ ones, a production rep plane won’t be in the air before low rate production starts in 2007… Risky??
cheers