French posters , don ‘t let Jacko getting on your nerves for no good reason . 😎

Let ‘s go back to facts :
In cannon dogfight , it seems that the F-22 beats the Rafale , the F-22 beats the Typhoon and the Rafale beats the Typhoon .
This is what we know so far …

Cheers .

@Scorpion & DJ :

I agree with both of you . Geolocation and ranging is most probably approximative at 200km and gets better as the signal or the aircraft is closing in .

Cheers .

JSR :

RWR at 200km is in effective against long range search radars that likely to see bomb laden or ET Rafale from 400 to 500km. and those radars will alert other mobile radars and sam tels to move around or deploy dummy tels.

That doesn ‘t change anything with regard to the safety of the SAM systems and the safety of Rafale(s) . There are at least 2 ways to hunt for SAMs , if you have dedicated weapons you can “show yourself” on purpose to make the SAMs goes “live” then you fire at them . The second way is more “discret” and has been explained by Nic .
When a SAM site goes “live” , it is detected , geolocated and can be dealt with .

Now , regarding the picture you posted , you said :

6 AASM cannot knock out even a single mobile TEL with experianced crew let alone a a sam site.

Obviously , you have no idea of the destruction power of a AASM , even the 125 version .
3 direct hits like that :

and everything is out .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMpBDgnP6QM

Cheers .

JSR :

There is promotional video. watch after 2minute for BUk-M2. there is self protection vehicles that misdirect or shot down incoming HARMs and missile loader vehicle are completely separate from Radar and command posts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GcAUaLrPNU

Any external bomb laden Rafale will be detected from considerable distance making all these vehicles move.
how far Rafale can lock on moving target?.

Wrt the video , there is very little an opponent can do , with or without Rafale .
I know that the Russians like to protect their ground systems and they are Masters at it . I think about the active protections for main battle tanks like Drozd , then Shtora , then ARENA .
So , a Rafale has very little chance to score a direct hit even if it’s using a dedicated weapon (ALARM , HARM , etc) .
In this kind of situation , the best is to avoid the detection thanks to the RWR . If the system goes “live” when you ‘re already inside the SAM bubble , the best is to jam the bloody thing while diving belly on the ground ASAP , then to jam the missile itself (if one makes it close enough) .
Nothing magic or special . SPECTRA is very good at it it seems .

Cheers .

TR1 :

From what I can see, even with Rafale dropping an AASM at very high altitude, it still won’t be able to outrange the latest Buk

?? :confused:
Buk detection range is up to 160km . Spectra will immediatly warn the crew , giving probable coordinates and propose a course of action if the flight plan is threatened .
Buk engagement range is up to 40-45km . AASMs have been fired at more than that and they scored .

So , I don ‘t understand your point TR1 . Enlight me .

Cheers .

Mercurius :

The consensus of most of the books and unclassified technical papers on stealth written over the last quarter century is that for RCS reduction to have a significant military effect, it has to of several orders of magnitude.

Yes I know but as soon as I started to talk about RCS , you very quickly and very intelligently responded with (I quote you) :

The only area in which a small RCS reduction is useful is in electronic warfare. Reducing the RCS by a factor of 10 or 100 will make a significant difference to the amount of energy that the jammer must radiate in order to screen the aircraft.

Which goes perfectly well with what I said :

Now , if we include the RWR and the ECMs , this small difference can turn into a decisive difference .

We all know that Dassault never wanted to design a VLO aircraft with the Rafale . They never said “LO” either but they used “Discret” . They have been honest from day one . While the true RCS is classified , they worked hard to reduce it to the best they could and I believe the effort is a good effort , and the result is better than with all actual multirole fighter .
While the RCS difference with fighters like the Eurofighter , Gripen or the SH is not very big , not big enough to be a real game changer , the difference has been archived because the plan was to ease SPECTRA ‘s task and this is what Chaltiel said .
Lower the RCS is , less EM spikes you have to deal with . In our electronic age , powerfull CPUs ran by top notch algorythms , linked to very sensitive passive antennas and active antennas can do marvels .

Against some systems , Rafale is truely LO thanks to SPECTRA .
For years on , I have been trying to explain that a “normal” defensive suite is not tailored to map an electronic battlefield but to help the aircraft to stay alive when threatened . It ‘s reacting to the detection/threat at hand and is trying to deal with it to protect the aircraft .
SPECTRA does far more than that and its job begins in the planning room . While most ECM suites are indeed prepared before the flight , from the data gathered with various kind of intels , SPECTRA can propose its computed flight plan during the planning , giving to the planners a usefull tool .
During the flight , the ELINT/SIGINT capabilities of the system help the pilot(s) in the way in and in the way out . The Rafale is a very good “listener” and the sensor fusion always give to the pilot(s) what he/she/they need to know to avoid confrontation or to look for the confrontation .
Now , the active jamming modes are classified and we can ‘t talk about it without taking the risk to end up nowhere .

What I want to show is the fusion in between the Rafale airframe (RCS) and SPECTRA . One without the other and the Rafale is not the Rafale anymore , this has to be understood .

Cheers .

xman :

Should I understand thus that assuming an RCS of 1 Sqm detectable at a range of 100 Km , an RCS of 0,1 Sqm could be projected to be detectable at a range of 56 Km

That ‘s correct for the numbers you used but the equation gives different numbers when the range changes , it is exponential . At twice the distance , you need more than twice the power to reach the same result .

Now , @Mercurius , a factor of 10 to 20 does make a small difference indeed but this small difference is big enough to be exploited . ie : a 20 seconds lead in detection gives you enough time to prepare an attack or to avoid the confrontation . At supersonic speed , 20 seconds represent quite few nautic miles , giving you enough time to gain altitude and/or speed , or to loose altitude and hide within the background noise , or (…) , etc .
Since the first caveman , we know that who has the first look (even if he doesn ‘t have the first shot) has the advantage .

Now , if we include the RWR and the ECMs , this small difference can turn into a decisive difference .

Cheers .

mrmalaya :

Why are there no images on the net of Rafale with an A2G load of anything but SCALP OR AASM?

???:confused:

I don ‘t want to post hundreds of pictures here but I can assure you that you can find the Rafale with various LGBs , nuclear missile (ASMP-A) , Exocet , dumb bombs , AS-30L .

Cheers .