Loke :
I am sorry but to me the most disconcerting thing about the Swiss evaluation is how little edge both the modern Rafale and Typhoon got, compared to the old, old Hornet…!!!
What a sad state of affair in Europe…
This is trolling , Sir .
First , the “old , old” Swiss Hornet is not to be messed around with . Did you check the aircraft first ?
Then here is where the Swiss Hornet stands overall (the yellow line) :
I said overall because the Hornet does NOT follow the “6” rating in each bar in reality . Keep that in mind Mr Loke 😎
As Obligatory said …
Cheers .
Nic :
Stop the personal attacks damnit!
+1
Mildave :
It’s like Bluewings saying how this pissing contest is boring a few pages back and then jumping straight into it
Mildave , keep cool . What I said is not part of the ongoing pissing contest .
I merely commented one point of the Swiss eval (the air policing factor) and with or without me , the numbers stand .
At the contrary , posting official papers tend to kill the pissing contest , which is the goal . 🙂
Unfortunatly , we still see post like (from Jackonicko) :
I find it frankly remarkable that Typhoon came so close to Rafale in SA, Detection, Identification and Data Dissemination, and am amazed that it didn’t do worse in Acquisition, CNI and EW.
And it’s nice to see Typhoon ahead in engagement (that’s not just BVR, you realise)
The last phrase being the sherry on the cake . But the sherry is rotten and the cake sour .
Let ‘s cut through the crap , step by step :
-1) being “so close” doesn ‘t mean near parity . Far from it . In some case , the Rafale will archive SA , detection , Identification where the Typhoon wil not . This is what the chart means Mr Jackonicko .
-2) Engagement IS MOSTLY BVR . You might not be aware of the air forces ‘s “slang” but I am .
In fact Mr Jackonicko , let me help you because the proof is in the pudding as you like to say in the UK .
Check the Detection bar , the Identification bar and the Aquisition bar . Without them , no Engagement is possible , right ? Good .
There , the Rafale is well ahead and I commented the reasons why .
I post again the graph for clarity :
“Engagement” starts when the detection is made and not before , when the identification is made and not before and just before the acquisition .
Do you understand ? 😎
So , stop twisting things and keep it down to facts and numbers . Thank you .
Cheers .
While looking through my doc (Scorpion ;)) , I digged out some rather nice pics .
Did you know that the Rafale A was wired for this kind of load :
I don ‘t know if the wiring changed since . Good question .
On a different matter , this diagram from the Swiss eval is telling a lot more than some think :
As expected , the Typhoon is ahead wrt A/C performances (air policing is made at high altitudes) . It is also ahead in Engagement thanks to the Amraam and the Captor-M .
Being also ahead in pilot workload came as a surprise to me wrt air policing .
Even today , I still don ‘t understand why such rating . I probably missed something … But let ‘s move on .
Let ‘s have a quick look at each parameter .
-1) Better mission preparation implicates better and easier mission upload into the main computer airframe and better databank .
-2) better SA/force coordination means better data sharing/real time infos . It also involve sensor fusion .
-3) Better endurance , well , no need to say more . The Rafale has very long legs .
-4) Better detection . There , the RBE2-AA/Spectra/OSF/IR Mica are giving an advantage . Not surprising .
-5) Better identification . Down to the OSF/Spectra combo .
-6) Better acquisition , thanks again to the combo OSF/Spectra/IR Mica + RBE2-AA .
-7) Data dissemination are more or less on the par and could be way better but it works .
-8) Better CNI , Comms , Navs , IDs which was expected thanks again to the superior sensor fusion and mission computer as well as a better databank management .
-9) Better EW (much better) which shows how Spectra is ahead of DASS .
-10) Better QRA . There , the Swiss know what they are talking about 😎
The difference in between fighters is enormous .
Now , biaised posters like Jacko & Co (and Cook I should say) are trying their best to twist the facts to fit their agenda when they are in no way capable to provide better numbers because they are not part of anything official , in the know .
More later . Time to sleep and I still have to explore one more hard disk …
See you all 2moro .
Cheers .
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