Exec :

But saying that the F-35 is a dog is funny and only shows your anti-f35 fanboy attitude.

With due respect , it is true that I don ‘t like the F-35 and so far I don ‘t rate it highly but I don ‘t think that I have a “fanboy” attitude . I ‘m too old for this s*** 😮
Maybe the F-34A will not be a dog but I have strong doubts with the B and C versions . This is my own belief .

When I spoke about “dogfight” , I thought canon dogfight . My bad as I didn ‘t make myself clear , sorry . I should have talked about manoeuvrability instead .
If we take the word of some US pilots who say that the F-35 is about as good as the Viper Blk 30 and just under the F-22 , you can understand that I rate the Rafale higher .
If one Rafale has been shot down “virtually” by a F-22 out of six meetings , I guess that the USAF pilot was the better pilot in the engagement or the French pilot made a mistake . Both aircraft seems to be on the par in manoeuvrability .

The F-35 was designed to be cheaper than Raptor.

I note the “”was designed to“” but I bet that it is not going to be the case . Furthermore , if the GAO start to stir s*** , who knows what ‘s gonna happen …

This is where you are completely wrong.

Maybe I am underestimating the overall F-35 ‘ RCS but I bet that a good radar can get a lock on it from the side at 40-50km , which is in the range of most BVR missiles . Future will tell if I am right or wrong .
At that distance , a good radar + IRST + TV and an “optimistic” pilot could try to launch from the hip a BVR IR missile , just to get a tactical advantage by forcing the F-35 driver to take evasive actions . In doing so , he could get a positional advantage . That ‘s a “maybe” but it is sound .

There is no need to drop SDBs from low altitude. If you’re armed with SDBs why would you fly low?

I agree .
The point I wanted to make is that the AASM (like the Rafale) is good for multitasking : it can be launch from all aspects which is not the case for the SDB . One have to understand the reason why France is trying her best to field “omnirole” aircraft and weaponry : the DGA don ‘t get enough money for everything so we have to build true multirole stuff .

Well, it seems that the F-35 has a little better weapons. Sure – MICA is a fine missile, but while Sidewinder is probably comparable ‘dogfighter’ – AMRAAM is clearly better ‘medium-ranger’.

I disagree strongly .
I don ‘t want to repeat what has been said already but the Mica has a better off the rail turning capability (obviously) but it also has a better end-game than the Amraam . The only thing lacking with Mica is the very long range .

Cheers .

Ok , I drop the Rafale/F-35 “contest” since the latest is still in testing and is far away to be operational .

Now , being sarcastic like Jessmo doesn ‘t help much .

Like I said before regarding the Rafale: Poor acceleration, poor time to climd for a twin engine aircraft, out dated weapons,
less turning ability than a F-35, No stealth with a HUGE blow torch of a butt lighting up the night sky. Cant even Do over 30+ degrees AOA. No Aesa with a Hodgepodge of unintergrated systems.

Rafale ‘s acceleration is very good , both in subsonic and supersonic . I have to ask where did you get that silly comment . :confused:

Rafale ‘s climb rate is 305m/s (280m/s for the Typhoon , 280m/s for the F-16 with the F100 , 270m/s for the Fulcrum , 300m/s for the SU-35 , 250m/s for the SH) .

During testing , Rafale reached 100 degrees AOA without loss of control .

Out dated weapons ? :confused: Are you off your mind ?

Unintegrated systems ? :confused: Are you again off your mind ?

lacks the integration of the F-35.

System integration and MMI is one of the Rafale ‘s main point .

I mean out dated weapons by not having a a SDB equivalent I didn’t stutter, you know what I mean. Couple that with no ability to drop JDAM and SDB from range and the Rafale starts to look ancient.

I say again , try to drop a SDB at 2000ft and lets see what the range is :diablo: (3km or so , what a feast !)

JDAM has a 25km range from high altitude launch , AASM about 55km .

Jessmo , I provide data and you can check what I am saying . Google is your friend . 😉

Cheers .

Turning at the higher Gs and higher speed portions of the flight envelope, the F-35 will “almost exactly match a clean Block 50 F-16 and comes very close to the Raptor”, Beesley said.

Bull !!! 😡 I call Beesley a liar .

A Blk 50 will get smacked by a Rafale while the latest is on the par with the F-22 !
How could the F-35 even compete ? 😮

Cheers .

Jessmo , you should be a bit more careful about what you say , really . :rolleyes:

1. Wrong and irrelevant .
2. Wrong . It is rather pathetic to compare Rafale in full combat configuration with F-35 with internal load and 50% fuel load . I already told you that a F-35 with full external load is a dog .
3. Rafale will blow the F-35 in dogfight .
4. True for now , at least on paper since the F-35 is years away to be operational .
5. lol ! Futur will tell :diablo:
6. Wrong . Only from up front .
7. Try to drop SDBs at low altitude :D:diablo: AASM can gain altitude , what about the SDBs 😀
8. almost true .
9. IR missiles don ‘t need to see the plume to have a lock , hot airframes is enough .

The quoted performance of Rafale ‘s turning capability is in dry thrust .

Cheers .