Teer, the first batch of JF-17 on order (50 machines) was to be made of 8 LSP and 42 SP machines. If memorey serves me, the second squadron came on line around April 2011. IMO, the third active squadron should have been up by now, but it might have been delayed a little for some reason…may be because the next batch of 50 will consist of 50 Block II machines. As for the numbers per squadron, I might be wrong, but I think PAF squadron normally have 16 or 16+2.

As for J-10, my personal opinion is that it has more to do with the economy of the state than anything else. Besides that, in the near future PAF might get a few more old F-16s from US and put them through MLU, but that’s about it…till J-31 comes along.

That works out to $54 million for 99 engines..that’s a LOT cheaper than reports in the past that put the F-414 engine price at around $1 million + apiece..and this with ToT for maintaining the engines in India.

You might have a zero missing there, i.e. $540 million?

One of the most useless threads ever. Not because there is anything wrong with the topic.

Recently I came across a programme on JF-17 (from Farnborough 2010), where a wing commander from PAF talks about JF-17. It seems that a variety of A2G munitions had already been integrated with the aircraft by that time, and A2A missile testing had already taken place. Although, he didn’t give any details, I assume he was referring to pl-5EII WVRAAM, and A2G munitions of Pakistani might include equivalents of Mk-82/3/4, RPB1 (Runway Penetration Bomb), and possibly H2/H4 (stand off munitions). He also spoke of some ECM pod other than that of chinese origin (WMD-7) that had already been integrated, though as of now I have no further details on that.

Just an update regarding JF-17.

According to a recent statement by a PAC official, they have produced 26 JF-17 so far. If so, there should be at least 36 of these machines in PAF service now (01-08 were SBP machines, while the first one to roll off PAC line was number 11, meaning that 09-10 also came from CAC, and were only lightly assembled at PAC). Current production levels seem to be around 2 a month, and at this rate PAF should have all 50 machines of the first batch by the start of 2012. Since the contract of the next batch of 50 already appears to have been signed, current production rate is unlikely to be affected, considering that PAF wants to induct first 150 machines ASAP.

Regarding production/assemble, although majority of JF-17 stuff comes from CAC as CKD, PAC produces around 20% of the aircraft locally from raw material. This share of work, i.e. production from raw materials, is expected to be considerably higher (I dont remember the exact % though) by the time the last aircraft from the first batch (Number 50) rolls off PAC line…though the exact % would be determined by how quickly PAC is able to absorb the technology and the production rate.

Regarding the avionics, assembly/production lines are already being worked on at PAC, which in turn plans to assemble/produce all the avionics at home.

Every nation has its own interests.

US cannot abandon Pakistan because NATO forces are dependent on supplies through Pakistan, for the present at least.

Sure, US can make a grand bargain with the Russians, and supply its forces through that route in spite of it being more expensive. But for that to happen, US would have to sacrifice its missile defence plans in eastern europe, and somehow PROVE to the russians that NATO expansion in the region is not about Russian encirclement. And I dont think the US is willing to do so for the moment at least.

Pakistan does not want to crack down on Haqqanis in their tribal belt, because they do not want a hostile government/population on their western border, once US leaves Afghanistan. Rightly or wrongly, based on their previous experiences with the US, they simply do not trust the US.

All in all, this whole thing is about TRUST DEFICIT. Each side is trying to protect their own interests, and everyone has their own grievances with others.

Afghanistan can become a stable country, and given chance, has the potential to prosper. Unfortunately, too many countries have their own vested interests in that country, and none of them is willing to do the right thing, because no one is willing to make the sacrifices required to do the right thing.

What big ticket items Pakistan desires to buy from France, Germany and UK presently?

I can think of few reports mentioning PN looking for a sub possibly from Germany or China in last couple years.

The desire has to be both ways for a sale to occur 😉

UK…possibly second hand frigates??? Unless Im mistaken the desire was there a few years ago.
France…Avionics/weapons for JF-17. The talk of a new sub design (after Agosta-90) didn’t go beyond a certain stage.
Germany…U-214.

None of these deals materialised for one reason or another. Whatever the reason, however, it seems that Pakistanis are now increasingly entering the chinese orbit. Chinese have supplied them with frigates, avionics/weapons for JF-17, and now there is a talk of chinese subs of 041 design for them.

IMO, a few years back Pakistanis did not want to become totally dependent on anyone-be it the chinese or the west-for their defence needs. Rather they wanted to operate a mix from both. For a variety of reasons, however, it appears they didn’t have much choice left, but to go to their chinese friends. Their legitimate defence needs were there, and while the chinese equipment might not be as advanced or as mature as its western counterparts as of yet, it does meet these needs to some extent, and would increasingly keep doing so.

ps. Why, how etc. is a different discussion, not relevant to this thread.