Pardon! The Harriers vertical landing (and take-off) was it’s whole success in the Falklands, especially with the transits from container ship to carriers.
Used again when the sick Sea Harrier landed on a Spanish container ship.
As this is mainly a ship based discussion, probably pointless pointing out its vertical landing uses in Germany and UK excercises.

If something like this were to happen with an F-35B, it would probably burn a big hole in the freighter’s deck.
on a slight tangent
i found this story quite impressive. it makes the concept of getting anything but the f35 even less plausible to me…
Is that IR detection system specific to the F-35, or is it capable of being used in other aircraft in the future?
Of course not, any more than the Harrier’s vertical landing capability has been used.
The Harrier’s vertical landing capability is always used for landing on the Invincibles, but it seems that the F-35B will be using a rolling landing technique on the CVFs, so it will effectively be a STOL rather than a STOVL aircraft.
The F-35B was designed to be a STOVL aircraft, but will its vertical landing capability be used in practice by the RAF or RN (other than at airshows)?
The F-35B’s STOVL capability derives from its lift fan, which is big lump of heavy metal that has to be carried around ALL of the time.

If all that’s required is a STOL capability, rather than STOVL or VTOL, could a more elegant and efficient engine(s) design have been produced?
Maybe a VIP-conversion option for one of the RAF’s new A330s? Would that work?
Perhaps when you look at Madrat’s figures it is easy to forget that Europe is not one nation. Each nation will only deploy a part of its fighters (if any at all, certain European countries have the annoying habit of not fighting when others are) which means of those thousands of fighters only a few can be deployed at once and is entirely dependent on each individual nation.
You want a strong “EU” force deployed, you have to convince the British and the French to fight (usually the most willing deploy and the 2 largest military forces and the only to be able to carry out the full spectrum of operations), then the small scrappy nations (Denmark and Estonia for example), then you have to drag others in who either can’t or won’t deploy much (Italy, Germany being 2 of the more obvious won’t’s, although the Germans have been trying harder recently). Even after all that you still have a country or 2 in the EU that would rather annoy all the big nations that also happen to be their neighbours rather than lose their neutrality (yes Ireland i’m looking at you).
In short, you asked the Eu to fight tomorrow and you’d not get the response you need unless someone is actually rolling tanks into the Rhineland. Integration won’t change that because they have to go out of the way to satisfy the neutral countries and those who don’t want to fight.
Irish troops have just completed a series of deployments to Chad, initially under EU auspices, later as a UN mission. This was but the latest in a series of international peacekeeping operations Ireland has been involved in since the 1960s. Irish soldiers will be deploying with their vehicles and equipment to Sweden in the next few months to prepare to form part of one of the EU battlegroups.
Ireland is pretty committed to Europe and the EU – much more so than Britain – but not to NATO, which is seen as a US-dominated alliance, the need for which disappeared with the end of the Cold War. Nor does Ireland have the imperial/colonial history and consequential mindset of Britain, France and some other European countries, a culture that encourages questionable international military interventions.
Sarko is getting an A330 to fly him around, replacing his current A319. Maybe Dave could get to share it, as part of the new aircraft pooling arrangement with the French. π
As part of the cutbacks in Defence expenditure, the RAF has introduced new, more cost-effective flight simulators π

If Britain is going to pool its A400M resources with France, would it not make sense to involve the Germans also, as the other major A400M customer? All three countries are in the process of reducing defence expenditure, so the motivation to co-operate should be there.
…..
Finally I wonder if there would be as much resistance if Boeing and BAE had worked together to produce a supersonic Harrier III
Agreed that a US/UK Harrier III might have been the better way to go, but is supersonic worth the price? Most attack aircraft are not supersonic – A-4, A-6, A-7, A-10 – and the non-supersonic Sea Harrier did a good job of fleet air defence in the Falklands.
Isn’t there already some pooling of airlift resources through NATO? There’s a Movement Coordination Centre in the Netherlands, a project to jointly charter Antonov An-124s, and NATO has also bought three C-17s, which are based in Hungary.
I really liked how they designed the ski-ramp to helicopter operations the least amount possible. Rear elevator configuration has a lot to be desired though. Wastes a lot of space.
Agreed, but the Spanish must like it: the BPE seems to follow the design of their light aircraft carrier ‘Principe de Asturias’ in that respect (which by the way was in turn based on the USN ‘Sea Control Ship’ design).

LHD with ski jump (Spanish BPE Juan Carlos I)

If we don’t get the software, we shouldn’t buy the aircraft. Period.
Negotiate a deal on Rafales- joint spares, training etc.
Just my 2 cents.
Or BAe to licence-build the Gripen NG, possibly with an uprated EJ200 engine to replace the F414…. and the Sea Gripen version for the Navy….
(sorry, got carried away day-dreaming there :))
The Merlins go naval but stay Utility platforms. There’s no capability gap created by such a move, and the Commandos would get a far better platform at the same time. The choppers, after all, will be used how and when they are needed, so being RAF or Navy manned won’t affect that too much. Once the HC3 are navalized, they’ll be a lot more flexible, being able to operate from ships as well. And being the Merlins merely 28, yes, all must go to the navy and possible be centered on RNAS Culdrose, with the possible closure of RAF Benson or its use for Chinooks if they really are to become 70: Odhinam would have trouble taking all of them.
The air tankers are the A330 of the FSTA contract. I don’t see true changes happening to that with the first two planes about to be handed to the RAF. The agreement will possibly involve selling hours of usage of the air tankers of the RAF to the ArmeΓ¨ de l’Air, which will postpone its own buy of new A330, possibly as many as 14. A larger “pooling” of air tankers may be obtained with time as cooperation expands and the french get their new planes, but that is a future development yet to be seen.
I doubt the little Bae 146 and Bae 125 are at serious risk, also. In future, to replace them, but this is only an idea of mine for a future that is quite far if they retire in 2022, it may be interesting to replace them all with a small cargo plane like the C235 or C27J which could have wider use for military ops as well as VIP transport and such, and also offer lower fuel cost and major survivability.
1. Maybe he meant the Merlins, based on the rumour that the Marines are moving over to the Army, and therefore there was no need for the Jungly replacement to be a Navy helicopter.
2. Sharing the A330s tankers with the French, or even in a wider NATO grouping, would make sense.
3. The few BAe146s and BAe125s are for VIP and Royal Family transport, so maybe they are not regarded as part of the military transport fleet? Agreed that the eventual acquisition of a smaller, twin-turboprop tactical transport aircraft would make a lot of sense, from the point of view of operational flexibility and cost effectiveness. Remember the Andover?
