troungYou did leave out the TNI-AU’s 2 Su-30MKs and 2 Su-27SKs along with the ErAF’s 8 Su-27S/UBs…. oh yeah and the RSAF’s 72 F-15S and the IDF/AFs 25 F-15A/Bs. And the RSAF should have around 80 F-15C/Ds.
troung“I too don’t see much other than Russian a/c been purchased by Vietnam in the near-to-medium term future at least.”
Tragically I agree.
Of course I don’t see Russia having a real low cost lightweight fighter (like FC-1 or LCA) that could be used to replace the MiG-21bis fleet.
I would not mind some sort of new trainers like the Yak-130 and MiG-AT to replace the L-39 as well provided the money does not take away from more important social programs.
troungI’m the Mirage man… :rolleyes:
Mirage 5BA from the FACH, Mirage 50CN on the FACH, Mirage 50EV of the FAV, Mirage COA of the FAC, Mirage IIIEA of the FAA…
troung“Also I dont think the Vietnamese are going to sour their relation with the US anytime soon. If they wanna be ‘one of the fastest growing economies’ in the area they have to do business with the US…just like China.”
Well we don’t want to rely on the USA for engines and that’s a fact. Hell I doubt the USA would sell engines in the first place.
“If Tejas is sold with the Kaveri engine, Vietnamese acceptance would be easier.”
It would also depend on how testing goes in India and if any problems show up.
“I don’t think Vietnam would accept Tejas with GE F404 engine, as it may make it vulnerable to a US embargo.”
Same.
“Radar choices should be customizable for the customer: MMR, Elta M 2032, Kopyo, RC-400. A Tejas with RD-93 or M88-2 + Kopyo or Thales RC-400 would be interesting in the sales point.”
Yeah it would. Be similar to the FC-1 in buying the airframe and then picking out the radars.
“RD-93 engine for the FC-1 is a good selling point for the Vietnamese.”
That and the ability to use Russian weapons could be a nice selling point.
“Even if relations with China turned sour again (quite unlikely at this point with a superhighway being built between Vietnam and Guandong), Vietnam can always source the parts directly from Russia. Plane can be fitted with Russian radars like Kopyo to suit Vietnamese needs, and spares can be provided from Russia directly. The plane is med tech enough for the Vietnamese to be able to maintain the plane on their own, or even duplicate the parts.”
Yeah the VPAF could get engine and radar parts from Russia but no spare landing gears. I think any sale would have to come with some sort of ToT just to grease the wheels along.
“NOOOOOOO!!!!!! AUSTRALIA IS DOOMED! DOOMED I TELL YA!!!!”
Its over time for either the RAAF to get the F/A-22A and A-12 or the whole population will have to go back to Europe as hordes of Asians and our Flankers will invade…
troungThanks for all the pictures. The first one hunting hawk posted was it. Apparently I remembered it wrong.
And I would think the LCA would have 3 wet points and not 2.
troungHe is not that crazy YET…give him a couple more years…more like an Indonesian regional airliner gets some new tires for a WW-2 vintage C-47 and thus the RAAF needs 20 B-2s supported by 48 F-117s to counter this new threat. We all know well that 71 F/A-18A/Bs and 30 or so F-111s are not capable to handle the threat posed by CN-235s much less an F-5E/F MACAN or worse still…the A-4E Skyhawk!!!!!!!! I mean god, what if they use the N-22s sold to them by the Aussies to ram RAN warships…The RAAF needs to stop it by striking their airbases now using F/B-22s and B-1Bs!!!!!!!!!!! Costs and politics be damned!
Who needs operational realities when you are to dumb to write anything past the words Flanker and the letter/number combo of F/B-22?
Don’t get me started on what he will say once the most lethal AF in SE Asia…Cambodia gets the ultra tricked out Su-30MKC…it will give him a heart attack…
So we all need to get more and more Flankers to keep him in work (that includes you too Philippines!!!! I know you guys are slacking…and Singapore, Burma, Thailand and Cambodia)…what is he going to write about…FC-1s and LCAs or Flankers, “Super” Flankers and “Ultra-Ober” Flankers…
Plus the second…and even worse…third hand Toyotas make the Enterprise obsolete thus the need for more….
troung“how about replacing those 100 plus Mig 21’s with approx 60 FC-1 & 40 Su 30 MK”V”. there’s a good hi-low mix & vietnam AF will pack a good punch”
The FC-1 would pack a good punch and so would LCAs with either operating as a lower cost multi role plane backing up the Flankers. The issue is of course money. While you could maybe get two FC-1s for the price of a Flanker the Flankers have the needed range and payload to show off…Personally I tempted to say even more Flankers are needed then planned for to actually make the air force able to have some deterrent. Maybe 32 Su-27SK/UBKs and 24 Su-30MKs. Now that could show the flag and cost an arm and a leg…I can think of better things to spend money on then planes, ships, tanks, artillery or other military things…
Carlo Kopp would not write an article on the thread of FC-1s but he would no Flankers…he’s not that much of a joke yet…for the time being…
troung“Why didn’t you thank the Chinese for the SKs too?”
I don’t know, I really don’t…
“Off the cuff, somewhere down I wouldnt be too surprised to see. Su-30MKV (MKI customized for Vietnam) with Brahmos-A as the tip of the spear with some LCA’s making the body.”
I doubt we would get the LCA. I have no idea what will replace the MiG-21but I tend to doubt we would purchase the LCA. I’m not saying the LCA is not a more the capable MiG-21bis replacement. It would be nice to replace the MiG-21bis and add some multi role capability to the fleet but I do so doubt it.
troung“I don’t see why it wouldn’t be better to upgrade the Su-27s to the SMK, I mean why buy a different plane for different missions when you can upgrade your existing one to do the same missions(now that was a statement).”
It is planned to bring the Su-27SK to the Su-27SMK model just to make sure we are on the same page or at least planet. :rolleyes:
But as we all know two heads/seats/crew members are better then one on longer ranged patrols (especially strike ones) and the Su-30MK would have advantages in the strike mission just from being able to share the workload. The Su-30MK is arguably more mature in the strike role as well as more equipment has been tested and adapted (got to thank the Chinese for that). And of course it fits nicely with the Su-27SKs doing air defense/superiority and escort and the Su-30MKs doing strike with Su-22M-4Ks and MiG-21s playing AD.
Two seats are also better then one for flying over Philippine held islands to show off…then they can sell it to their congress that the PhAF needs new planes and then the VPAF can do the same…we all win!!!!! 😀 😀
troung“I swear I hate all these countries that bitch about all kinds of aircraft and their capabilities when they don’t upgrade them with newer avionics and weapons.”
I swear I hate all these people who hate all these countries that bitch about all kinds of aircraft and their capabilities… :rolleyes:
I would generally be curious to know why you even wrote that, but that would give you an excuse to ramble on more about who knows what…
“Prime examples are all the Mig-29 users which still use the 1980s Mig-29s instead of upgrading them.”
Cry me a river…
We have no MiG-29s to upgrade so that does not even belong on the thread…
“Why doesn’t just Vietnam upgrade it’s Su-27s the same way Russians are?”
You’re one of those guys who really should not offer opinions on threads and just stick to asking questions. Had you asked a question and not made a statement ending with a question mark already having make an assumption it would not have looked so bad…You maybe should have asked if the VPAF is planning to upgrade the Flankers and not why they are not…
Vietnam does plan to upgrade the Su-27SK/UBKs to the Su-27SMK model and has on order already 4 Su-30MKs with a total plan for 24 Su-30MKs (similar to the Chinese model). So there is a plan to upgrade these planes and get more.
So other then showing a knack for very opinionatedly responding to topics with out knowing much you don’t offer much in the way of anything else…
To edit my last post before this one I am very sure VPAF Flankers could also make use of unguided free flight rockets as well…
troung“Well for once I agree with truong, besides VPAF needs something better than Mig-29M1/M2 to match hordes of Malaysian, Chinese, Indonesian and Singaporean fighters.”
There is not threat from Indonesia or Singapore at all. We have no conflicting claims on EEZs or the like.
And I personally doubt the Spratlys would ever turn into more then what it really is which is a p-i-s-s-i-n-g match over fishing rights. No one would want to ruin relations and damage economies for the Spratlys. The Spratly “dispute” is nice ways to get more money into the military budgets of the nations involved and keep peoples minds elsewhere.
I mean come on would the PhAF be able to beg for a new fighter to hunt the ASG?
That aside the Flanker gives the best “p-i-s-s-ing” ability we can logically get from Russia. Hell at least they can reach the area…
“Truong, what kind of anti-shipping missiles do VPAF’s Flanker’s carry?”
None. As of today they carry around the R-27 and R-73E. And of course if the air force wanted to, dumb bombs could be fitted…
edit; **** is not a bad word :rolleyes:
troung“Maybe they should look at MiG-29M1/M2. I cannot emphasize enough how much I hope for the success of this aircraft.”
Would be a waste of money. First off the MiG-29M1/M2 are not cheap and do not offer much over the longer ranged Flankers. The Flanker has what we need, range and payload. Vietnam is not a small nation and the Air Force need planes with a good unrefueled range and payload to operate near the Spratlys as a show of force if need be.
I think more Su-27SKs and Su-30MKs are what the air force needs…
troung“I’ve heard that the US deleted some system that is used to deliver nuclear bombs is this true and is it possible that the Saudi’s got hold of a similar system or created it themselves?”
Every F-15 that has been exported had its nuke delivery systems removed.
troung“I doubt it will be the MIIIs facing Mig-21s, Su-30MKIs will sweep in first and establish Air Superiority easily by knocking out any F-16s, F-7s and MIIIs from the sky, then Mig-29s and Mirage-2000s might come in then the mig-21 after them but mig-21 flying in first is unlikely in India’s case”
So all 20 or so Su-30MKIs will knock out the entire PAF (well over 350 combat planes) on their own in the first few minutes of the war? Wow that would give them all over 15 kills each plus bonuses! Shocking…
“in any indo-pak flareup. bisons on point defence will meet Mirage-IIIs on strike.”
Well to give my opinion to your question, the Mirage 5EF ROSE II which I think we are talking about would try and fly very low and very fast to try and keep away from the short legged MiG-21UPG which I imagine would be defending. The MiG-21UPG would be in range to shoot much sooner and its weapons are longer ranged then the R-550 Mk.2 and AIM-9P-4/Ls on Mirage 5EF ROSE IIs or even the Griffo M equipped Mirage IIIO ROSE Is (currently limited to short range missiles). So if the MiG-21UPG gets in range it would be lethal, the best tactic for the Mirage 5EF would be to fly very low and very fast to try and flee from the short legged MiG-21. I would have to give the MiG-21UPG the edge in the fight with its BVR weapons (R-77E) and off bore-site missiles (R-73E).
Of course one can never count out luck, skill and being in the right place at the right time.
troung“Hmm, any guesses as to whether the designation pod of LGBs will be Chinese, or Russian, or French?”
Very likely the ATLIS II which is already in use on two PAF types of planes (at least).
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