Without getting too deep into this obviously emotive issue I can say that when illegals are picked up they are sent back if they can’t put up a good case for being here, such as danger of death on return, that sort of thing. My daughter works for the UK Border Agency and they send plane loads back each week to various places around the world. Mind you, there’s nothing to stop them turning around and making their way back here once they are sent home.

I can also personally vouch for the fact that Germany, and hear second hand but without verification that France also has a far worse problem than we do, so it’s not a case Jim of them passing through all the other countries to get here because we are a soft touch.

There’s also the fact that has already been pointed out that it’s perfectly legal for EU citizens to come here, whether you agree with the law or not is another matter.

You can’t blame anyone for wanting to better themselves; I live in Lincoln which over the last ten years has had a massive influx of East European nationals. Most of them are OK, some are a pain. Just like white, British born and bred people. In fact, just like people.

My son is an immigrant, he went to Oz with his family seven years ago for a better life, which he has achieved in every way possible. I have no problem with people wanting to come here to better their lives; in fact I’m quite proud of the fact that they would want to come here.

I had a bizarre conversation in a pub not so long ago. A well known local work shy chappie was holding forth that most of the jobs that had been taken at a new business had gone to foreigners and they were the reason he couldn’t get work. I asked him if they had replied to his application. ‘Oh I didn’t bother applying, not worth it is it’ was his rather amusing reply. So these foreigners had taken the job that he hadn’t applied for.

Foreign nationals are a very convenient scapegoat for the indigenous population who have never worked and have never any intention of working.

Nail on head as they say.

Whoever was at fault is by the by; I’m just thankful that everyone survived. The finger pointing can start later.

I have it on very good authority Jim that the biggest threat is the cyber one rather than large scale disruption due to EMP’s, although they are obviously a major concern. The people who live in a very large country in Asia could shut this country down completely without a shot being fired, this is not some future threat perception, they could do it right now. As usual we are waking up to this threat rather slowly….

You could start here http://works.bepress.com/george_h_baker/. This guy knows his stuff.

I believe radar, when it was developed in the 1930’s was originally devised as an EMP device. It was supposed to disrupt the ignition systems etc of enemy aircraft. It wasn’t powerful enough but they found out to our lasting gratitude that they could see the reflected waves, and thus the BofB was won.

The efforts of various nations to protect their assets against EMP are of course of the highest classification. EMP’s are immensely powerful. In the Starfish tests in the 60’s the US detonated a hydrogen bomb above the atmosphere in the Pacific region, it blew out the street lights in Hawaii a thousand miles away.

I think perhaps the OP has a point when he asks are we really giving up stuff. If I desired to play golf more than I desire to fly then I suppose I would be playing golf. Unless you are a multi millionaire then life does come down to choices as to what you spend your money on. I’m not poverty stricken, don’t get me wrong but I have had the odd comment when it crops up in conversation that I fly of ‘rich men’s toys.’ Not in a malicious way it has to be said.

I once had a conversation with a guy at work I know, I work for the county music service by the way. He was interested in the fact that I had a PPL and often made the comment that he would like to do it but couldn’t afford it and he didn’t know where I got the money from. I sat him down and worked out he could easily afford it (he’s on the same pay grade as me) if he gave up xy and z. Most people don’t actually know how much they spend on a night out at the restaurant followed by the pub followed by the taxi. When you do that once a week or maybe more then it soon adds up. As you say Moggy, I would rather be at FL90 exercising mind and spirit than peeing it up against a wall.

Being situated where I am, most interesting things happening are an hour away or less. Old Buck, Duxford, Shuttleworth, Elvington, Bruntingthorpe are all well under an hour. Take a couple of cost sharing mates/pilots to a fly in/wings n wheels and it soon becomes a not as expensive as you think day out. Old Buck next Sunday will be about 45 minutes away and around £60 each for three of us. Less than a night on the town.