To reiterate again,
I think your missing a critical point. CL max between the F-14A and the D will be largely the same. The aircraft’s corner speed will be similar.
The “D” has greater thrust which will slightly improve sustained turn rate, but is partially offset by increased weight. The AoA will be higher to generate the same amount of lift. At low level, both the “A” and the “D” are impacted by imposed structural G limit at higher speed. What you can see is, for example at Mach .8 FL 100 the F-14D has more Ps. But that right side of the envelope is G limited.
While the F110 has much greater thrust at sea level, we don’t know the dynamic thrust at different speeds and altitudes. One thing is for sure, the dry thrust of the F110 was far superior to the TF30.
Instantaneous turn rate won’t be much different because again, CL max and or load factor are the limits. What the E-M diagrams don’t show is the impact on acceleration, the F110 powered Tomcats were supposed to have far superior acceleration through much of the envelope (except approaching Mach 2 at higher altitudes) Perhaps the inlet was optimized for the TF30? IDK. The F110 powered F-14’s could regain energy faster, which was one major handicap of the TF30 powered F-14’s, they ran out of Ps and were dead ducks at high altitude after a few hard turns.
Besides, the much lower SFC in afterburner , greater dry thrust, and improved climb and acceleration (and the aforementioned less threat of compressor stalls) were enough to make the A+ and D superior to the early Tomcats.
Appreciate the input vans, please read above. Message the mods. I would prefer no referendum on members on thread. I just listed a few who generally stay above the fray of backbiting. General comments on suggestions to improve forum would be most helpful or specific addendums for suggestions on how to better police forum.
No offense meant to your opinion but I think a silent vote to mods via PM would be more helpful.
That Il-38 was landed without nose gear by a 73 year old test pilot BTW.
Karl Yeager-ski?
I would say that the significant improvements in performance of the F110 over the TF30 were more about improved throttle response ( less sensitivity, less risk of flameouts), much improved dry thrust, better SFC (especially in augmented thrust). Ironically, pilots stated the TF30 powered F-14 had better acceleration at the extreme right side of the envelope, and higher top speed.
On turn performance, three points:
The “D” was over a ton heavier.
The imposted structural limit of 6.5G limits both sustained and instantaneous G above Mach .8 (below 10,000 feet for sustained turns, instantaneous turn rate suffer significantly)
The wing gloves were disabled on the “D” with impeded Turning ability above Mach 1.
Frankly, FBW, this is the pot calling the kettle black.
All we have on western side is the declaration of the Pentagon that all of 104 missiles has hitten their objective and some picture taken well after the strike occurred.
?
Frankly, you should take you comments back to Russiadefense.net. I’m sure you buddies there can explain it all to you, i’ll not waste me time with someone who pretends objectivity.
As for lemmings, I would say that’s a very appropriate analogy. You and a few others have run off the cliff separating sceptical from delusional. Feel free not to respond to me or my posts.
Well it was bound to happen sooner or later. When you decide to shot at someone that actually can shot back.
Burst of bubble..
Annddd if it weren’t for ignorant comments like that above that are devoid of fact, threads probably wouldn’t degenerate into chest thumping stupidity and get erased.
BDA is not very useful in this case either. The missiles were programmed to strike in rapid sucession to incinerate any toxins present at those three sites. The large number of missiles striking a small target is the veritable “making rubble bounce”.
One, none, 76 shot down….I don’t think there is any chance of detailed analysis to accurately assess the success/failure of the Syria defense. All of this was shaping the message. US strikes three sites claimed to be chemical weapons related as a message. Russia makes noise, though they were probably in contact with US forces the whole time on targets, time, size of response. Syria claims success in “intercepting” cruise missiles. All white noise.
F-35 simply isn’t fit for CAS will be certainly a great DEAD/Strike platform (block4) with exceptional SA, but it is simply not nimble enough. I’ll give you a hint it is not a problem of roll rate, but close.
The issues for the F-35 would be the same for any fighter performing CAS. None have the ability the A-10 does for a tight roll in at low speed.
But that is but one subset of close air support. If strafing or high angle bombing runs at low speed were all that mattered, then the F-35 would be Ill suited. But that would be true if every other fighter the US has used for CAS. TBH, the gun accuracy leaves something to be desired anyway as of right now.
Probably a source, maybe. And you? Do you know anyone in aeronautics apart from F-16.net chest bumping asshole teens?
Do you see me on there often? I’ve read your comments there. Have to be honest, I don’t see much difference between you and the most bias of them. With one exception, they don’t edit poorly sourced hit pieces on the Rafale for an online aviation blog, I can’t say the same thing about you in regards to the F-35.
And no, I am aware you were a JTAC, does that make you an expert on fighter performance? And yes, in the 2000’s I did have contact with engineers with P&W, Boeing. Careers change.
Us vs US exercises… Don’t spoil the broth 😉
The mighty F-15 was NOT helped by an awacs (conversely F-35 was)
Lets wait or a really operational F-35 vs an AESA equipped Typhoon or Rafale. Another story.k.
Sure and even if the exercise yields a 5-1 kill ratio, that one HUD shot will find its way to YouTube for some Gallic chest puffing.
Please…. wait for what? They are all very capable aircraft, what exactly do you expect to glean from when US F-35 train with Typhoon and Rafale? That they all very capable within different regimes? Sure, but I’ll put money Hallow will have a “source” claiming how wonderful the Rafale was.
Like to ask the mods if they can restore the Su-57 thread, cleaned up of whatever got it axed in the first place.
It was one of the more active and interesting threads.
Which is why a conversion of F-35A or F-35C makes far more sense. I’d think an F-35C, being the bigger wing would certainly help add substantial lift for high altitude performance. Sure, it also has more drag in the lower altitudes. But the lift generated makes the angle of attack and deflection angle of the control surfaces work less hard therefore improving drag at high altitude. Add in ADVENT technologies to give it the thrust up there and you have a win-win situation.
The F.35C is a case study on why adding wing area to an airframe is a terrible idea, The entire aircraft has to be designed with a specific.planform and area, The “C” suffers from massive wave drag hefting around those wings on a compact fuselage. It is not worth slightly improved sustained turn performance and stall speed for compromised performance in every other metric.
This whole exercise is a save face for Japan to kill the X-2 project. L-M will offer what does not exist and in the end, Japan will deem any X-3 cost prohibitive and order more F-35. Sadly, based on the current situation those F-35 will cost considerably more just to save their national aerospace industry. They would be better served modifying the F-35 to Japan specific needs with input from Mitsubishi. If they are gong to pay millions more to make the aircraft in Japan, get something out of it.
Close-up of the TVC nozzle.
That look familiar to anyone? Industrial espionage or cooperation?
Titanium.. Yeah who supply US with over 40% Titanium?
Oh thats right, Morder in the East.
Anyone wonder why US is hard at work trying to divercify their Titanium demand
? I’m not following your logic here?
There is a difference between top producers and reserves. Why buy titanium from Russia? It’s cheap, that’s how the global marketplace works. Not exactly a rare resource that gives strategic leverage.
Anyway, somewhat irrelevant to the conversation here, no?
While there’s no doubt that the RB199 was a handicap in high altitude performance, it was actually a decent engine given the F.3’s intended role (especially over water patrol of G-I-UK gap and North sea).
The choice of a high bypass turbofan was critical to provide range and endurance, but those early turbofans had comparatively poor performance at higher altitude (not exactly an issue considering the RB199 was initially fitted to a low level strike aircraft). The F100 is really the first turbofan I can think of that provided a decent mix of endurance and high altitude performance, and it experienced significant teething troubles.
I would say it was similar to the F-14A in that the engines, which at the time enabled the aircraft to be a long range interceptor, were a handicap as a fighter.
already posted above by OP-the Hushkit interview gives a very fair overview of the aircraft:
https://hushkit.net/2016/05/01/interceptor-how-how-to-fight-survive-in-phantom-and-tornado/