Julian Assange

Tony, I believe, that the news yesterday, included the fact that if the Embassy didn’t give him up, they would,(The building) lose it’s Diplomatic status, and thus revert to being a British building, whereby he would be “Dead meat” for want of better words.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

In that case, what’s the point of giving anyone diplomatic status if it can be revoked at will?

Anybody here remember WPC Yvonne Fletcher?

I am not really sure how I feel about this one; I don’t really have anything against Julian Assange but I don’t really have anything for him either. It does seem that he only has respect for any law when it is of benefit to him; happy to be protected by UK law until extradition was likely and then breaks his bail conditions. And how much was that bail, who paid, and who has lost their money?

What about the US serviceman who went to jail for giving secrets? Does Assange not feel any responsibility there?

I don’t really have any sympathy for the US case either; yes the US (or the UK) has ‘secrets’ that they’d rather not become common knowledge but if they get out why does the US think they have any rights to punish Assange who is not a US citizen and who is not in the US.

The murder of PC Fletcher is one of the times when I would think it appropriate to go into an embassy and make arrests. Diplomatic immunity is a great idea, but it does not extend so far as to let anyone murder British Citizens with impunity. This crime, Libya shipping weapons to the IRA and the lockerbie bombing all add up to a completely justified casus belli imho, but that’s for another day.

As for Assange, I’m not sure what to make of the man. I do find it an odd state of affairs. The charges originally leveled against him of sexual assault were dropped, but then miraculously re-emerged after he had upset the US and other powers. Another point is that Sweden has never before asked for anyone to be extradited on these charges. Whether he is guilty or not, it seems clear to me that this is being politically motivated.

Bradly Manning, the US serviceman who released documents to Assange, is still being held almost two years after his arrest without receiving a trial, and there have been allegations that the treatment he is receiving is extremely harsh, intended to break his will and demoralise him.

I don’t personally believe that anyone has suffered injury (except to maybe reputation or pride) as a result of the wikileaks documents releases, and I think the US is yet to produce any evidence to substantiate their claims that it has. I understand the security forces need to keep some secrets, but it seems to me that even our democracies are getting too used to keeping things from their citizens, and more openness, not less, is what’s needed. I think that the real reason they are so angry with Assange and Manning is that they don’t want us, the citizens of the West, to know what our governments are really up to.

Just my 2cents

Matt he could leave as diplomatic baggage or even be issued with a diplomats credentials, you then cannot touch him as he departs, however the only flight to Equador are on US carriers or Iberia I believe. You then hVe to find someone that would transport him, a US carrier may wll end up Stateside leaving him one option, and as Spain abides to European laws one would suspect that might be a no no.

Tony, I believe, that the news yesterday, included the fact that if the Embassy didn’t give him up, they would,(The building) lose it’s Diplomatic status, and thus revert to being a British building, whereby he would be “Dead meat” for want of better words.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

Anybody here remember WPC Yvonne Fletcher?

I am not really sure how I feel about this one; I don’t really have anything against Julian Assange but I don’t really have anything for him either. It does seem that he only has respect for any law when it is of benefit to him; happy to be protected by UK law until extradition was likely and then breaks his bail conditions. And how much was that bail, who paid, and who has lost their money?

What about the US serviceman who went to jail for giving secrets? Does Assange not feel any responsibility there?

I don’t really have any sympathy for the US case either; yes the US (or the UK) has ‘secrets’ that they’d rather not become common knowledge but if they get out why does the US think they have any rights to punish Assange who is not a US citizen and who is not in the US.

One of the allegations from one of the women is that he didn’t use a condom when she had previously insisted he did – is that rape? The other claims he pressed ‘himself’ against her? Get a grip, so to speak – at the moment, they are only claims.
Ecuador is a democratic country, standing up for international diplomatic laws against embullient US and UK tactics.

Necessary when you are trying to keep out of the clutches of the US Government.

He has disseminated information to the peoples of the world. Freedom of information.

Planemike

Matt…..

I AM NOT IN ANY WAY SICK. Julian has not been convicted of any crime, not even parking his car on a yellow line, let alone any assault charges. Yes, I believe he should be given the Nobel Peace Prize.

Planemike

Again, he’s broken the conditions of his bail. That is a crime!

In what way do you think he has ever contributed to peace?

Julian has not been convicted of any crime

XD No wonder he’s not been convicted – he’s too busy hiding away!

He’s sexually assaulted women and you want to give him the nobel peace prize? What kind of sick … are you?

Matt…..

I AM NOT IN ANY WAY SICK. Julian has not been convicted of any crime, not even parking his car on a yellow line, let alone any assault charges. Yes, I believe he should be given the Nobel Peace Prize.

Planemike

Whoo back up Matt not been proved yet,There are some anomalies in the case from what I have read, and I agree it could well be a USA plot to get hold of him, but I can also understand the USA’s point of view, let one get away with it and you open the flood gates.. but I do tend agree with you, if he has done the crime, he should pay the time…

What have the US government got to do with this? This is about extraditing him to Sweden.

Sweden (along with the UK) do not extradite anyone to the US – if they believe that in doing so the defendant will face the death penalty… So, Assange doesn’t have that to fear.

If someone’s performed a crime – they shouldn’t be allowed to get away with it. Excuse me while I just rape some Swedish women, hack into secret government computers then post it all online and get away with it…

Matt……….

You are incredibly naive, thats what all this is about. The US government wants to get it’s hands on him and the US would use the death penalty if it suited their book.

The charges in Sweeden are just trumped up charges, so he can be sent there and then on to the US.

Planemike

He’s sexually assaulted women and you want to give him the nobel peace prize? What kind of sick … are you?

He is Hero of the People. The US goverment is out ” to get him”, totally and absolutely wrong. We need to do everything we can to defend him. Just a great shame that Bill Hague does not have the balls to stand and tell the Americans he can have free passage and go to Ecuador. Rather than having him extradited the Swedes should be giving him the Nobel Peace Prize.

Planemike

Matt he could leave as diplomatic baggage or even be issued with a diplomats credentials, you then cannot touch him as he departs, however the only flight to Equador are on US carriers or Iberia I believe. You then hVe to find someone that would transport him, a US carrier may wll end up Stateside leaving him one option, and as Spain abides to European laws one would suspect that might be a no no.

Trouble is we will cow-tow to the US government instead of recognising Julian for what he is… a Hero of the People.

What have the US government got to do with this? This is about extraditing him to Sweden.

Sweden (along with the UK) do not extradite anyone to the US – if they believe that in doing so the defendant will face the death penalty… So, Assange doesn’t have that to fear.

If someone’s performed a crime – they shouldn’t be allowed to get away with it. Excuse me while I just rape some Swedish women, hack into secret government computers then post it all online and get away with it…

Let’s face it, the crimes he has to face in Sweden may be local news, but certainly wouldn’t be of worldwide interest. He hasn’t been charged with a crime, and even the Swedish government has said they have no legitimate reason to seek Assange’s extradition. It’s just an excuse to ‘get him’ on something.
It’s very easy to call him a coward, but what are the alternatives? Hand himself in so that the full might of some miffed American court can imprison him for life, or execute him?
The UK government will do anything to ingratiate themselves to the US – and even go so far as to violate international diplomatic laws and conventions, which could have much more serious implications worldwide.
My best wishes to Mr Assange…

He has broken the conditions of his bail, so he will be arrested. Or should people be allowed to pick and choose the laws they obey?

He may be a hero of yours, but he is certainly not a hero of the people. I don’t know anyone who likes him. How is he any different from people who share confidential information, such as bank details?

Telling someone’s secrets, and then running away when it’s time to face the consequences IS NOT courageous!

I’m all for freedom of information, but be realistic, there are many things that are kept from the general public for very good reason. He isn’t even American, what business does he have sharing their secrets?

We were VERY reasonable with him, and he’s repaid us by breaking our laws when it suits him.

Dishonest and dishonourable.

He is a Hero of the People. We need more openness, very easy for governments to hide behind secrecy. Why should we be kept in ignorance? “Freedom of information”…..when it suits.

If it takes a non American to bust it open, so be it !!! Good on yer Julian !!!

Planemike

Exactly so, that is why he should be given free passage so he can take up the asylum he has been offered by the Ecudorians. Trouble is we will cow-tow to the US government instead of recognising Julian for what he is… a Hero of the People.

Planemike

Assange can’t stay in the Ecuadorian Embassy forever… I mean, who would want to spend the rest of your life confined within the 4 walls of a building? You might as well just serve your time in prison.

So, when Assange finally does emerge from the embassy, he’ll be stepping back onto British soil – where he is then under British law, and he can be arrested.