I don’t intend to start a debate on the morals of flying vintage aircraft, but I’ve often heard it said that there have been more aircraft lost in museum fires in the last decade than their have in crashes.
Where were these fires, and roughly how many aircraft have been destroyed in them?
I can think of the Canadian Warplane Heritage fire, where the Hurricane and Spitfire were destroyed…
I think there was also one in France?
(re-posted with less worrying title!)
By: Der - 26th October 2003 at 18:18
Better, but not as better as four Lancs!:D
By: Rob Mears - 26th October 2003 at 17:26
It makes me ill every time I think about how beautiful Kee Bird was, and how she was lost. However I may feel, I’m sure it can’t amount to how Greemeyer feels after 7+ years of hard work in the arctic, only to see the plane burn just prior to takeoff – not to mention knowing that the entire warbird community was surely going to cast him out like a red-headed step child! 😉 He also lost a friend and fellow worker during the escapade.
On the bright side though, we still stand the chance of seeing three operational B-29’s doing formation fly-overs during our lifetimes (CAF, Kermit Weeks, United States Air Museum). Of course a diamond-four would have been even better!
By: Der - 21st October 2003 at 20:41
Dunno about great T.V viewing. I just found the whole thing very depressing, and difficult to watch.
I dont suppose there will ever be another opportunity like that.
By: duxfordhawk - 21st October 2003 at 20:24
I remember
thinking at the time it was odd to try and fly anything that had been sitting in such conditions for so long,didnt they see it as reckless?it worse than going to one of our musuems and trying to fly something that has been sitting there for years without doing restoration mental!
By: trumper - 21st October 2003 at 18:39
If it had got into the air how on earth did they know how it would react when in flight or the stresses on the airframe involved when landing,what a gamble. :rolleyes:
By: Arabella-Cox - 21st October 2003 at 18:30
Although SpitfireMK has quite rightly corrected me about the ‘sitting on her wheels’ bit. I didn’t realise she’d bellied in back in 49. Makes Greenamayers plan to fly her out even more irresponsible if you ask me…
By: warbirdnerd - 21st October 2003 at 17:00
Transcrpit
You can find the complete transcript for the documentery at this website. The Kee bird story is also covered in the book Hunting Warbirds….
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/transcripts/2303b29.html
By: SpitfireMK - 21st October 2003 at 14:46
The engines were not recovered because all material to do it was returned to thule AFB.
And the aircraft where they hauled the heavy equipment with was out of action at Thule AFB.
They returned with a twin otter.
And that plane can’t carry engines.
There’s a documantary made of the recovery
It’s worth buying it with great footage of the b-29 startups etc.
By: Flat 12x2 - 21st October 2003 at 14:17
Another recovery team is coming back to the site to recover the wrecked items. Like the valuable engines props etc tailplane and wings.
I vaguely remember that the engines were recovered soon after the fire ?
By: DazDaMan - 21st October 2003 at 14:06
Originally posted by SteveYoung
SpitfireMK’s second shot shows Kee Bird as she was found. She’d landed intact, and was sitting on her gear, which is hidden by water in this shot.
Ah, I wasn’t sure at first – thought this was how the plane ended up after the fire, but could remember it breaking in two mid-fuselage in the pictures, hence the confusion. Thanks.
By: Mark V - 21st October 2003 at 14:04
It did make great TV viewing though 😉
By: SpitfireMK - 21st October 2003 at 13:50
It was 270 miles from the nearest airbase a distance that’s too far and to expensive also note that recovery team got a low budget.
By: trumper - 21st October 2003 at 13:48
:confused: I ‘m puzzled,doesn’t take alot i know,but why couldnt they break her down into sections over a longer period of time then crate her out with large helicopters when they could.I would imagine that the replacement props and engines alone would’ve cost a fortune.
Possibly the logistics were too much but surely to fly her would’ve been a real long shot.
By: Arabella-Cox - 21st October 2003 at 13:45
Only 2 metres? I thought it was a lot deeper than that.
Good luck to the recovery team. Just for God’s sake don’t let Greenamayer anywhere near it again…
By: SpitfireMK - 21st October 2003 at 13:43
The wrecked b-29 is still visable as it lies in 2 meters of deep water.
Another recovery team is coming back to the site to recover the wrecked items.
Like the valuable engines props etc tailplane and wings.
The aircraft crashed and was jacked on his wheels.
Because it had made a wheels up landing.
Picture of the aircraft in 1947
By: Arabella-Cox - 21st October 2003 at 13:40
Originally posted by DazDaMan
SpitfireMK – Which aircraft is the one in your second photo?
SpitfireMK’s second shot shows Kee Bird as she was found. She’d landed intact, and was sitting on her gear, which is hidden by water in this shot.
A remarkably well preserved airframe which now lies in charred pieces at the bottom of a lake through negligence.
By: JDK - 21st October 2003 at 13:39
It’s also worth noting that museums are often able to ensure a partial news blackout and also to refuse to provide information. The Musee de L’Air et L’Espace at Le Bourget, where one of the store areas was destoyed by fire, refused to comment on losses. Most ‘lost aircraft’ lists were compiled by enthusiats as the Museum refused to provide one, certainly initially, or (perhaps) at all.
Another (UK national collection) had a Tiger Moth destroyed before the museum was formally opened. It was burned by someone mentally disturbed. The collection were able to put a replacement Tiger in place, and no-one was the wiser. No problem here Gov…
Cheers
By: SpitfireMK - 21st October 2003 at 13:37
It’s the same aircraft before being recovered.
The recovery crew pulled it out of the lake lowered the wheels.
And new engines and props (hamilton standard) where put on.
Also the tires where changed and the rudders where recovered.
the recovery was one by the Air Pirates.
And the restoration was done by Darryl Greenmayer and his team.
By: Arabella-Cox - 21st October 2003 at 13:35
Originally posted by SpitfireMK
It’s very sad that it happened.
The b-29 also claimed the life of one of the recovery crew.
Who worked himself literaly to death!
Channel four covered this a few years ago in a documentary, called (I think) The Treasure of the Humboldt Glacier. Rick Kriege was the engineer who passed away during the first phase of work. The project then spilled over into a second (originally unplanned and unbudgetted) year.
People within the industry have widely criticised the way it was attempted, as it all appeared to have been a bit of a botch job. Leaving an open and half full fuel can next to the hot APU while you’re taxiing out for departure gives you some idea of the standards involved…
Like everyone else, I’d have loved to have seen the B29 make it to Thule, but I doubt very much that she’d have remained in the air even if she’d have taken off without incident. The ‘restoration’, and I use the term very loosely, consisted of putting new control surfaces on, new engines, new props, new tyres, and then just fixing the leaks and cracked dials. No checks on the sructural integrity of a fifty year old airframe which had been subjected to some of the harshest conditions known to man. A disaster waiting to happen.
As for the fire, well personally I’m glad the APU caught fire when it did – can you imagine the carnage if Kee Bird had jolted the thing around on the take off roll? I shudder….
By: trumper - 21st October 2003 at 13:34
Did’nt Kee bird catch fire because of a container of inflammable liquid in the plane,maybe my memory is playing me up:(
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October 20, 2003 at 9:11 am