In view of what has happened to these, and indeed other School children, and many other incidents that have taken place, involving the use of Shotguns and Section 1 Firearms.do you think that any individual should be allowed to own seemingly as many weapons as they like?.in the U.S.A.
Personaly, I think the 2nd should be fine tuned, to allow anyone to own the minimum of weapons they REALY need, And all weapons be kept in a secure place within the owners property, or at a gun club, where they are secure.
Should they adopt the same rules and regs as we have here in the U.K.
The other week, I was watching a U.S.A. program where a family business purchased and sold, also traded weapons, and one chap brought to them a pristine GATLING gun he wanted to sell, need I say more?.
What are members views on gun ownership in the States?.
Jim.
Lincoln .7
By: ZRX61 - 22nd February 2013 at 20:13
I And does anyone seriously believe that in the 21st century the people may still need to rise up en masse and overthrow their government? Ridiculous.
I can almost hear the rustling of your Daily Telegraph from 6000 miles away 😉
& lets take a look at people who HAVE “risen up en masse” to over throw their govts shall we?
Palestine, Syria, Libya, Iraq, Egypt, Yemen, Georgia, Chechnya…..
By: ZRX61 - 22nd February 2013 at 20:06
I think, as ZRX has stated about Chicago, it’s rife with gun crime related offences, That’s Obamas home town, and he is trying to get magazines that hold only X rounds of ammo, and prohibit the ownership of certain firearms.It is this, that has made him the most hated President in American history.
Jim.
Lincoln .7
No it isn’t, it’s the fact that he hasn’t got any idea whatsoever about economics. If he were merely useless, it would be a vast improvement in his intelligence level.
As for Chicago, how do you explain the highest murder rate in the country, coupled with the tightest gun laws?
Obumble won’t be happy until he turns the entire US into Flint, Michigan or Gary, Indiana.
By: Lincoln 7 - 22nd February 2013 at 14:27
I agree entirely with what you have stated.
As an experiment, I posted the very same question on an American Gun Forum. Their replies were astounding to say the least.
One reply, was, “We don’t NEED so many, we just WANT them, because it’s our RIGHT whether we want to own just one or a thousand,and God help anyone who tries to take them away”.
I think, as ZRX has stated about Chicago, it’s rife with gun crime related offences, That’s Obamas home town, and he is trying to get magazines that hold only X rounds of ammo, and prohibit the ownership of certain firearms.It is this, that has made him the most hated President in American history.
On the other hand, he has the guts to try and get gun laws changed for the better, however, the hardliners of the NRA are doing their best to keep, their, “God given right”
Jim.
Lincoln .7
By: Mr Creosote - 22nd February 2013 at 12:45
I don’t think he’s paying very much attention to what anyone else has to say, Moggy. 😎
I think this is what so many people this side of the pond find so frustrating. There are simply too many firearms in circulation, and far too often they are falling into the wrong hands, with catastrophic consequences. As I’ve said here before, America as a whole seems to think these continual massacres like the one that prompted this thread are a price worth paying in order to keep their guns, and I’m still waiting for someone to refute that. And yet so many people just seem to duck the issue with spurious arguments that it’s anti-American, that their Creator gave them the right to have guns (eh? where does it say that in the Bible?) or even that if you banned guns then you should also ban anything else that can harm people (someone here even said swimming pools are “lethal weapons”) And does anyone seriously believe that in the 21st century the people may still need to rise up en masse and overthrow their government? Ridiculous. I do have some sympathy with people wanting to defend their homes and families, and with so many firearms already around I’m not sure what the answer is. But surely it’s time people at least admitted what is going on, and began to look for an answer, and it sure aint yet more guns.
By: Lincoln 7 - 22nd February 2013 at 09:01
Having watched the TV interviews that ZRX kindly posted, it seems the Militia, ie the U.S. Citizens are buying more guns and ammo, than ever before, The Federal Officers and Law Enforcement Officers are being supplied with millions of extra round of ammo, it seems from what was stated, that the Militia is preparing to go to War with it’s own Government.
Thats the way it came across to me.
Just my opinion.
Jim.
Lincoln .7
By: Grey Area - 22nd February 2013 at 08:33
I don’t think he’s paying very much attention to what anyone else has to say, Moggy. 😎
By: Moggy C - 21st February 2013 at 22:58
Whatever.
But you seem to be ignoring the fact that you posted something, presumably in support of your case that current US firearms law is hunky-dory, that totally misrepresented the facts.
Should we just ignore that?
Moggy
By: ZRX61 - 21st February 2013 at 22:45
We just had the Vice-Imbecile suggest that unlawful discharge of a firearm within city limits is the way to deter criminals…..
By: Moggy C - 21st February 2013 at 13:07
There’s statistics, and there’s facts.
“Since the firearms training program started in 66 and ended in 67, we should compare 65 (last complete pre-training year) with 68 (first complete post-training year).
Results? Three less rapes. In the whole period 61-72 the year with the closest rate to 65 is 68. In any case, the rate in 69 was 25% higher than in 65.”
The actual figures for the period 1958-1972 can be found in Kleck & Bordua, Law & Policy Quarterly 5, pp 271-298
Moggy
By: Grey Area - 21st February 2013 at 12:41
For the record, I’m going to buy another SKS here in a few weeks. I hope those of you on the other side of the pond aren’t too disappointed that your arguments haven’t changed my thought process. I promise to only shoot terrorist cardboard and zombie targets. 🙂
It’s your own money, so how you choose to spend it is your own business.
Why do you think that strangers thousands of miles away care what you buy?
By: Lincoln 7 - 21st February 2013 at 09:57
W.A.D.R You can move on, no one is holding a gun to your head forcing your opinions on this forum.Others seemingly WANT to put their point of view across, on both sides of the pond.
Jim.
Lincoln .7
By: PhantomII - 21st February 2013 at 07:29
What if we just agree to disagree? This thread has gone on far longer than I ever thought it would.
United States citizens – like guns
U.K. citizens – don’t like guns
Can we move on? 🙂
For the record, I’m going to buy another SKS here in a few weeks. I hope those of you on the other side of the pond aren’t too disappointed that your arguments haven’t changed my thought process. I promise to only shoot terrorist cardboard and zombie targets. 🙂
By: Grey Area - 21st February 2013 at 06:27
An experiment in cause and effect.
Let’s roll a pair of dice to simulate the annual rate of a given crime – let’s say burglary.
If the rate gets into double figures then the community is outraged and
demands that something be done to reduce it.
Every time this happens, I’ll say “Abracadabra”.
Let’s go…..
4 9 7 9 9 5 11 (Oh no! Crime has skyrocketed! Abracadabra!!)
6(Phew! Got it back down.) 7 10 (Oh no! It wore off! Abracadabra!!)
6 6 10 (Abracadabra!!)
4 (Wow! reduced it 60%!) 7 8 etc etc.
Note that every time I said “Abracadabra” the burglary rate went down.
I now have irrefuitable proof that saying ‘Abracadabra’ will reduce the incidence of burglary.
By: ZRX61 - 21st February 2013 at 05:12
By: RpR - 19th February 2013 at 19:03
[QUOTE=Lincoln 7;1992445]
OBAMA told Cameron to do the other week.
“Don’t leave the E.U. as it will affect our relationship with Russia”, that’s Your leader telling the whole of the U..K. what we should, and should not do.Is he wrong in telling an entire Nation what to do and what not to do?.Thats Obamas opinion, this post is just mine.
Lincoln .7
Obama is a cheap self-centered Chicago thug and operates in that manner.
He was a Chicago community organizer.
A journalist went to Chicago and asked people in the community he was organizer for how good of a job he did. They said at best he did nothing, so I hope your government told him not let the door hit him on the way out.:cool:
By: ZRX61 - 19th February 2013 at 18:08
Personaly I don’t give a damn about how many guns Americans hold or can purchase
Could have fooled me 😉
By: Lincoln 7 - 19th February 2013 at 09:26
[QUOTE=RpR;1992377]
Why Brits, or at least you, are infatuated with finding a supposed NEEDm is of zero importance by U.S. law.
If when your leaders say crap, you automatically drop your pants and squat, that is your problem, not ours.
Guns and ammo sales have gone through the roof, since the last shooting outburst, why?. Personaly I don’t give a damn about how many guns Americans hold or can purchase, you must be very insecure, knowing that you have to have SO MANY.Your Law regarding the 2nd, I am sure was not written to let any single person have sh*t loads of weapone, perhaps two, maybe 3. I myself wouldn’t feel the need for any more, At least over here, we don’t have to sleep with a gun under our pillows at night.
And as regards our “Leaders, as you call them to drop our pants and squat, I don’t give a squat, no one forces us to do what they say, we do mass protests, sign petitions etc, and in the main it works, we don’t need guns to get our points over. OBAMA told Cameron to do the other week.
“Don’t leave the E.U. as it will affect our relationship with Russia”, that’s Your leader telling the whole of the U..K. what we should, and should not do.Is he wrong in telling an entire Nation what to do and what not to do?.Thats Obamas opinion, this post is just mine.
I am sad that this Post has turned into a slanging match, you have a serious problem, and it’s out of hand.and because of the 2nd, you can’t even begin to solve it. Interestingly, there has only been two or three members from the States who have contributed to this Post.
I understand the 2nd better than you think I do.I am a member of an American Gun Forum, and what is said by some of it;s members is frightning, to say the least.
And on that note. Cheers, may you never run out of ammo.
It’s been a very educating Post.and I have learned a lot more than you may think.
Thanks, and goodbye.:)
Jim.
Lincoln .7
By: RpR - 19th February 2013 at 05:04
I didn’t insult her, per sey, it’s what was posted on here that didn’t make sense at the time.
As for everything I read, inane remarks like you have posted yourself, have led me to the way I think about the 2nd, turns out, I was right. As I stated prior, the only people you need to fear, are yourselves, and it’s all of your own making, and I guess your ignorant also, as you don’t, or can’t be bothered to find out how Brits think, on this issue.
When are you going to get the message?. WHY DO SOME PEOPLE NEED SO MANY WEAPONS????
And why can’t anyone answer that very simple question.
Lincoln .7
I would say your rhetoric is inane but since it is asinine because it is based on an opinion based on ignorance, I will stay with what I previously said.
To some ignorance is bliss but to you it seems to be something to base your rhetoric on, no matter how ignorant it is.
Why Brits, or at least you, are infatuated with finding a supposed NEEDm is of zero importance by U.S. law.
When the U.S. Constitution was written the writers did their best to make sure citizens did not have to drop on their knees to the government, to prove their need for, or to do, anything.
If when your leaders say crap, you automatically drop your pants and squat, that is your problem, not ours.
I said it before NEED, thanks to our founding fathers, does not enter into the calculationm at allm whether practical or legal. Our Constitution makes sure it stays that way.
Some state and local wannabe dictators have tried to change that but the courts are now slowly rectifying this illegal situation.
If that bothers you, you will just have to live with it.
By: ZRX61 - 19th February 2013 at 02:15
When are you going to get the message?. WHY DO SOME PEOPLE NEED SO MANY WEAPONS????
And why can’t anyone answer that very simple question.
Lincoln .7
I can answer that, to protect us from the criminals who elect the libtards who want to take our guns away. Like in Chicago for instance.. which is a *gun free zone*, no one there needs a gun for self defense because guns are illegal to own there… so the criminals can’t possibly have any… can they?
THIS is what happens when you take away legally owned guns….
By: Lincoln 7 - 19th February 2013 at 00:42
RpR and Dave.
Just a snippet from the Washington Post, dated Dec 14th, 2012,
The USA had 12.000 gun related homicides, compared to Japan, which “Only had ” ELEVEN. in 2012.
Food for thought.
Jim.
Lincoln .7
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