The Saudis have always been in the thread matrix, as has the UAE, lets not forget who the Funders LET and SEJ and the rest of the out fits are..
But i always thought Surya would only be used it absolutely needed , and that it was modification of the PSLV
Originally posted by PLA
I doubt that India survives any Chinese attack… So arming with these missiles is probably a gesture towards Pakistan. Political agenda’s are not that mch Chinese oriented as some posters sugest.
Do you even know where pakistan is located in relation to India and or the world?
was Surya ever shelved?
Agni 3’s range wont be that much higher then Agni 2 the main target is China and 3000KM would most likely cover that. As for Saudi Arabia, the scorpenes with a few LACB’s should cover that ..but it would be very risky and India cannot at all rest on its laurels , it either takes out pakistan now..or it waits and lets the situation worsen (with regards to itself ofcourse).
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Arrow Missile Defense System Posts Another Test Success
Israel’s Arrow ballistic missile defense system successfully intercepted a ballistic missile in a high altitude test of the complete system on December 16, 2003. Similar to the test conducted in 2000, an Israeli F-15 off the Mediterranean coast launched a Black Sparrow missile at high altitude to simulate an inbound Scud B ballistic missile. December’s test verified the Arrow 2 interceptor’s ability to engage ballistic missile threats at higher altitudes.
Arrow 2 interceptor at launch.
The Black Sparrow, built by the Israeli government owned company Rafael, is about one-tenth the size of the previously used target missile, the Coleman Aerospace Hera. The tests success demonstrates the Arrow system’s capability to track and engage smaller targets. It was the eleventh test of the Arrow system and only the sixth complete system test since 1995.
In the 2000 test, a Black Sparrow was launched towards Israel at a distance of 100km and was successfully tracked by radar for approximately five minutes before the Arrow 2 missile was launched and intercepted the Black Sparrow 30 seconds later. The Arrow system consists of the Elta Electronics Industries-built Green Pine radar for acquisition and tracking of targets up to 300km away, Citron Tree battle management system designed by the Israeli electronics form Tadiran, and the Israeli Aircraft Industries (IAI)-built Arrow 2 interceptor missile.
The Arrow is a joint development project between Israel and the United States. The U.S. has provided about 65 percent of the roughly $2 billion price tag through the Pentagon’s Ballistic Missile Defense Organization. However, selling the Arrow system to interested parties including the UK, Turkey, Japan, and India would greatly reduce costs for both countries considerably. Israel currently possesses two fully operational Arrow systems – both of which were on alert during Operation Iraqi Freedom (OIF).
Israel Launches 2nd-Gen Communications Satellite
In other news, after several years funding delay, Israel launched its newest, second generation communications satellite, AMOS 2, on December 27, 2003. The launch itself came after a nine-day delay due to the detection of helium in the pipeline system of the French-built Ariane 5 lift vehicle.
AMOS 2 Satellite
The AMOS 2 was designed and built by the MBT-Space Division of Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI). It is equipped with twenty eight 36 Mhz Ku-Band high power channels. AMOS 2 will be co-located with AMOS 1 at 4 degrees west longitude.
After the Ariane failure, the satellite was lifted into orbit on top of a Russian Soyuz rocket operated by Starsem, the European-Russian organization that sells launch services and is comprised of the key players involved in the production and operation of the Soyuz lift vehicles. The launch took place at the Baikonur Cosmodrome in Kazakhstan. Starsem is a joint venture comprised of four space organizations: EADS, Arianespace, the Russian Aviation and Space Agency, and the Samara Space Center.
Spacecom Ltd., the marketer and service provider of the AMOS 1 and AMOS 2 satellites, which deliver broadcasting and communications services to Europe, the Middle East, and the east coast of the United States, is owned in four equal parts by IAI, Eurocom, Tel Aviv-based General Satellite Service Co. and the Mer services Group Ltd., also of Tel Aviv.
The launch is estimated to cost $35 million while the satellite has an estimated $150 million price tag. AMOS 2 will provide a wide range of broadcast and communication services including Direct To Home (DTH) television distribution, TV distribution to cable companies, distribution of Internet services, and data transmission to communication networks to the east coast of the United States, Europe and the Persian Gulf region. Spacecom has already reported the sale of approximately 70 percent of the satellite’s broadcasting capacity to cable television companies in Europe and Israel.
Israel Digs C2 Bunker
Additional measures taken by Israel to defend against the ballistic missile threat includes the construction of a new command and control bunker outside of Jerusalem. Unnamed Israeli officials said the bunker would be able to withstand a nuclear, chemical, and biological attack, according to the Associated Press, December 8, 2003. The command center would provide a secure location for Israel’s government leaders in the event of an attack.
This would be Israel’s second such bunker. The first underground facility, reportedly operational since 1973, is located beneath the Tel Aviv headquarters of the Israel Defense Forces. The bunker project is estimated to take several years and tunnel excavation alone is estimated to cost more than $100 million.
Israeli Technology Aids U.S. Forces Combating IEDs
Soon after the commencement of the War on Terrorism, Israel transferred secret electronic equipment to the U.S. designed to detonate, at a safe distance, improvised explosive devices (IEDs) placed by terrorists along roadsides, unnamed sources told the Washington Times, November 21, 2003. U.S. forces operating in Afghanistan and Iraq have used the newly developed equipment successfully.
While much of the technology remains secret, sources told the Washington Times that the Israelis perfected a truck-mounted electronic suite that emits pulsed radio waves to detonate the hidden explosive device well ahead of a convoy. IEDs are often detonated using remote control devices such as cell phones. While the electronic pulse emitting technology is not fool proof, Israeli officials have used the technology to detonate the explosives carried by suicide bombers in the past, the Times reported.
While the Pentagon has acknowledged Israel’s counter IED contribution to the war on terrorism, officials at the Defense Department refuse to comment on the use and deployment of electronic equipment to coalition forces in Afghanistan and Iraq where IEDs continue to kill and wound U.S. forces.
Anti-IED Technology Thwarts Musharraf Assassination
The recent attempt to assassinate Pakistani President Perez Musharraf was thwarted by anti-IED technology embedded in his limousine, the Jerusalem Post reported, December 17, 2003. Unlike the Israeli technology that actively detonates bombs at safe distances, the anti-IED equipment used by dignitaries around the world jams the signals sent to trigger the explosives.
While traveling through Rawalpindi, an Islamabad suburb home to President Musharraf and most senior Pakistani military officers, a massive explosion detonated 30 seconds after Musharraf’s motorcade crossed a large concrete bridge that had been blocked off to the public. The delayed detonation was credited to the similar anti-IED technology currently used by U.S. forces in Iraq. The bomb contained both a remote control and timing device to trigger the explosive. The electronic signals emanating from Musharraf’s motorcade stopped the electronic timing device for approximately 30 seconds allowing a safe bridge crossing. The same signals prevented terrorists from manually detonating the bomb using a cell phone.
by JINSA Editorial Assistant Jonathan Howland
well the first time i heard this i was told it by my lecturer who is supposed to have been at sandhurst..and aparently he heard from some one or he was in greece at the time, then it was publised in AFM some years ago as a joke (fact but a joke at the guy who was hanging of it)
i am not suprised , i am just suprised that they have gotten that far.. oh hum doesnt matter
the oil isnt going to last for ever, then theyll have a extensive nuclear program with no way to support it.. 🙂 should be an interesting 100 years.
your kidding aint you?
lmao.. ..hmm makes things a bit more interesting if it is true.
you got them crossed havent you burger?
O_o
Probably had more to do with any slots or extendable flaps it had, and greater stability during landing.. the wings might also be stracturally relaxed and laden with fuel. so the gear their would stop the wings from hitting the runway..
Area rule is a good idea but if u have a look at the aircraft..they could have put the gear on the fusalage and still have a nice curve from front to back.
Sorry my bad.. So the Mig 21 wasnt designed as in interceptor of USAF/CIA/NASA/NSA planes?
sorry hmm ill go read up a lil more i think.
Originally posted by phrozenflame
he said on TV that Israel never planned to attack Pak Nuke Facilities or assets….we know that was a lie now..‘All you have done is proven to be more of a Liability in the eyes of the very peole you want to be safe against, giving them greater conviction to disarm Pakistan.’
nay, we’ve told them that its not going to be a easy win as in 80s or 70s..they missed there chance..they dont better take 2nd chance.. or there are very very limited chances they’ll have a 3rd chance…so dont take peace away and you’ll get peace. Simple, Pakistan is not hostile to Israel, i dont know why it is to Pakistan.
Pak supports Palestinian state, so does Israeli Gov, US Gov, EU and rest of the world.
Arrows 2 dont provide 100% security, not even against Scuds, Shaheen is a different story. Pak is also already working on features to penetrate ABM bkoz then know indians will be getting Arrow 2s anytime, so they’re working on it already ;), you cant checkmate Pak in that good ol 4-move checkmate…
Peace out.
hey dude nice to talk without flames on either side eh? makes a nice change..
oki .. I dont think the arrow 2 was used then, i dont think it was even in service, have you kept up with the Israeli defence news? they have worked on a lot of antimissile systems after GW1 (erm thats gulf war 1 not george w 1).
You do realise ill have to ask you for sources on the Anti Anti ABM that pakistan is supposed to develope.
I also have to ask if you realise that it might mean a redesign of the re entry stage and might also mean a bigger missile. unless pakistan has managed to get the size of its nukes down.
When did peres say Israel didnt plan to attack PA nuke facilities? just s question, if it was post 1998 then he might not have been lying and might have only been refering to the rumours in pakistani press that India Israel and USA were going to send in comando units to take away pakistani nukes.
and you do remember Israel does had boats with popeye ? so it might not be a bright idea on either side..
with what happened in Spain this week, you might well get some men in black coats knocking at your doors to take you away..:eek:
Russian missile on an F4?? cool… Hmm but its Russian so i guess the world should be worried..
so is the c 803 a variant of the Styx?
http://www.global-defence.com/2003/anti_ship.htm
ANTI-SHIP MISSILES have changed the nature of naval warfare because small, fast attack craft and aircraft have the same lethal punch as large ships. In addition, anti-ship missiles increase the range of engagements, multiply the number of platforms capable of offensive operations and decrease the warning time available to defenders. Ships as small as the 3,500-ton Indian Navy Khukri corvette carry a powerful armament of 16 100km-range Kh-35 Uran anti-ship missiles. The Russian Kursk-class Antyey type 949A submarine is armed with 24 supersonic 500km-range anti-ship missiles.
In recent actions fixed and rotary-wing aircraft armed with anti-ship missiles have demonstrated operational advantages over ship, submarine and land-based systems because they allow greater employment flexibility and superior sensor range. Over 70 nations field anti-ship missiles and despite major investment in naval missile-defence systems, engagements overwhelmingly favour attackers. Dozens of warships and nearly 200 civilian vessels have been sunk or damaged by anti-ship missiles during the past 30 years, the largest percentage of successful ship strikes coming from aircraft. Some ships are known to have evaded missiles through the use of decoys, ECM and tactics but only a small number of missiles have been shot down.
Current missiles The Harpoon – over 6,000 sold to 24 customers – and Exocet – over 3,300 sold to 32 customers – are the most widely deployed western anti-ship missiles; Russian and Chinese variants of the obsolete Styx probably hold first place. Firms in over a dozen nations produce anti-ship missiles including the USA, France, Norway, the Peoples’ Republic of China, Taiwan, Japan, Russia, Sweden and Italy being the largest producers.
Air-launched anti-ship missiles in service range from Russian nuclear armed supersonic missiles to Hellfires on helicopters. The Russian Zvezda Kh-31 is one of the most capable missiles in service. An advanced Mach 2 rocket ramjet with a range of 50-70km, it can be fired from MiG-29, Su-27, and now the F-4. Boeing and Zvezda have teamed-up to export the Kh-31 to the USN as a supersonic target. Russia also has a number of other highly capable airborne anti-ship missiles including the Raduga Kh-41 Moskit with a 135km range and supersonic performance.
The Soviet Union, unable to match the US and allied superiority in aircraft carriers and surface combatants, turned to fast attack craft armed with tactical anti-ship missiles with high- explosive warheads only, such as the P-15-27 (SS-2-N Styx) widely exported and produced in China. Some Russian fast-attack craft and Charlie II-class submarines were armed with the more advanced P-50 (SS-N-9 Siren). Russia still fields the widest array of anti-ship missiles, the 4,800kg P-500 Bazal (SS-N-12 Sandbox) and upgraded P-700 Granit (SS-N-19 Shipwreck) remain in service on major naval combatants. Another advanced Russian system is the supersonic Raduga 3M-80 (SS-N-22 Sunburn) that can hit targets up to a range of 120km and has Mach 2 at low altitude. It was fielded in 1984 on the Sovremenny-class destroyers, and supplied to China. The 3K-60 Uran that is similar to the US Harpoon, is replacing the Styx and other old systems. It has been exported to many nations including India and Algeria.
The only western system similar in capability to Russian strategic missiles was the US Navy UGM/RGM-109B Tomahawk anti-ship missiles (TASM). The subsonic TASM that could be fired from ships and submarines, had a Harpoon active radar seeker, an ESM system for target detection and four times the range and twice the warhead weight of the Harpoon. However, the Tomahawk ASM version was replaced on US ships in the 1990s by land-attack variants of the Tomahawk as mission requirements shifted.
In contrast to large Russian anti-ship missiles, most western navies opt for smaller subsonic systems such as Harpoon and Exocet. The Harpoon is a good example of modern, anti-ship missiles’ evolution. Incorporation of new technology has enhanced tactical capability and mission performance allowing the system to grow to meet the threat. In 1995, the long Harpoon Block IG that featured an improved seeker and additional mission flexibility including the ability to re-attack a target if it were missed on the first pass, was introduced.
By 1990 the US Navy fielded the stand off land attack missile (SLAM) that combined the imaging infrared seeker from the Maverick missile, datalink from the Walleye glide bomb and Harpoon airframe, engine and warhead to create an air-launched, man-in-the-loop precision strike weapon.
Air-launched missiles A number of specialised anti-ship missiles were fielded during the 1970s and 1980s that were designed to be fired from aircraft against ship targets. The rocket-powered German MBB AS34 Komoran armed the Tornado. This 30km range missile had a radar seeker and a 165kg warhead with a fragmentation pattern designed to be lethal to ships. The UK funded the development of the turbojet-powered Sea Eagle that armed its Tornado and Sea Harriers in the anti-ship role, more than 800 of these 110km-range missiles bought by the UK, Saudi Arabia and India are now being phased out of service.
Norway fielded an air-launched version of the infrared-guided Penguin anti-ship missile for its F-16A/B fighters and an improved version has been sold to arm US Navy SH-60 Seahawk helicopters. Israeli Phantoms and Skyhawks were armed with the Gabriel Mk 3, an active radar-seeking variant of the Israeli developed anti-ship missile. The AGM-65F/G Maverick air-to-ground missile has been fitted with a passive IR seeker and a 136kg blast warhead with delay-option fuse for use against ship targets. This 12km range missile can be carried by F/A-18s, P-3C MPA and helicopters.
Lightweight and relatively inexpensive anti-ship missiles developed by western companies include the British Sea Skua and AS15TT that use radar guidance, while the US Hellfire employs laser guidance. Although the range of these systems is only 10-20km and the warheads are small (10-30kg), they have proven to be effective in attacks on small naval vessels.
Upgraded second-generation anti-ship missiles can tackle almost any open-ocean conflict where an adversary is in open battle formation. Advanced mission planning systems and waypoint turns enable missiles to fly around islands or other obstructions to attack potential targets among known shipping. However, even advanced second-generation anti-ship missiles have limitations engaging vessels close to land and cannot hit ships at a pier nor threaten shore targets such as a missile or gun battery or radar site.
Littoral operations Following a shift in focus from open ocean to littoral or coastal operations, navies are calling for missile systems that can engage surface threats at sea and small vessels in congested coastal waters or even ships in port. And future systems must be able to deal with increasing levels of deception and active defences. To meet evolving tactical challenges missile producers are developing new systems to improve the capabilities of current models in the littoral arena and new-generation missiles with subsonic and supersonic performance are in advanced development.
The Boeing Harpoon Block II integrates a global positioning system (GPS) receiver developed for the loint direct attack munitions programme with modern inertial navigation systems to eliminate missile-position uncertainty. This allows for smaller seeker search patterns and helps to ensure that the designated target is found and struck. The new guidance system also facilitates the Harpoon Block II attacking vessels near the coast or at pier and for it to hit land targets with 10m accuracy.
The Saab RBS 15 Mk 3 also is undergoing a major upgrade that will enhance the weapon’s anti-ship performance and allow for the future addition of GPS, a dual-mode seeker and two-way data link to enhance littoral and land- attack performance. A new version of the Exocet with turbojet power for longer range, a more capable seeker and reliability upgrades is now in development. The Kongsberg Aerospace NSM, developed in co-operation with Aerospatiale, is a subsonic turbojet-powered low-observability missile intended for launch from Norwegian frigates and fast attack craft. Designed as a replacement for the Penguin, this 450kg missile includes GPS and an advanced infrared seeker allowing for the attack of ship and land targets.
The future The 200km-range, ramjet-powered French-German Anti-Navire Futur (ANF) was to be the first western supersonic anti-ship missile. However, funding problems led to Germany’s withdrawal from the programme that Aerospatiale is maintaining to prove the concept. Advancements in technology are leading to a new generation of missiles that will be faster, smarter and able to engage targets at sea and on land. The American Harpoon Block II, SLAM ER, plus Norwegian/French NSM and Swedish RBS 15 Mk 3 are examples of anti-ship missiles that have been upgraded and enhanced to expand their utility against multiple types of target.
It is expected that guidance systems using advanced computer technology will be able to detect and identify targets automatically. Several cruise missiles (SLAM ER and JASSM) already have this capability against land targets. Missiles are also expected to get much faster. Russian company NPO Mashinostroeniya has demonstrated an advanced supersonic Yakhont missile with a solid rocket booster and a liquid-fuel ramjet with a range of over 200km to replace the Sunburn in air and surface-launch variants. The USN and DARPA, with potential funding from the UK, have awarded several study contracts to meet the goal of rapidly developing and fielding a 2,000lb (907kg), 680-mile(1,100km) hypersonic (Mach 3.5-7) missile capable of launch from the F/A-18 E/F, F-35 JSF, ships and submarines to be fielded by 2015.
___sorry i had sniped it, but its really interesting and it might help others like me to know a bit more. how much is truth i dont know__
aaah but the bear is propeller driven it cant be of any threat i mean its got propellers..
but seriously why redsign an aircraft that was ment to catch YF-12(?? is that correct soc?) and CIA spy planes over Russia so that it could catch up with a bear? i dont see the logic in that.
The other types you mentioned maybe, bout any know how successful it would have been?