Did I say it was going to happen. Infact I said its unlikely now. I just said its what I would like to happen.

F 35 will be operated by India one day but possibly by the IN not IAF.

Well you seem to be narrow-minded about it. Even if India did chose the F-35 it will not suite their industrial & strategic benefits. Yeah you just said if they did it would not destroy their aviation industry, maybe true but on the other hand it ain’t going to help it ‘at all’ what so ever. As I said, the MMRCA is much more than just purchasing aircraft, and if I wanted a MMRCA I certainly wouldn’t go for the F-35 with an unknown price. It’s bonkers to even suggest that.

And don’t bet on the IN getting any F-35s in the future. I’d be very surprised if that ever is even thought of.

Perhaps this is related to building up Typhoon pilot skill-set in A2G role?

They would most certainly get that from Tonka GR4 pilots & navs during training, know how from Afghanistan and while working with them over Libya. A good few of Typhoon pilots will be up to speed in A/G now anyway & its just the usual matter of passing on their know-how to other Tiffy pilots.

It’s very good news that both air forces/navy are sharing training & what not. Good start if they’re going to be working together for the next 50+ years, obviously.

The final winner of MMRCA shall be decided in this or next month, and the AESA radar that IAF wants you to offer is just near the first stage of development, while your opponent’s AESA radar will enter service next year ?? ~ It really sounds not like a good news for Eurofighter to me……..

All very nice that it’ll enter service next year(?), but the simple fact of the matter is is that the MMRCA ain’t going to be in service with the IAF next year.

Surprised you know how a woman works, obligatory.

Simone Macchia, I thought the red bomb markings indicated that they were ‘lasered’ by a Buccaneer or another Tornado GR1 until I noticed two of them were ‘dumb bombs’. However, I believe it’s something else because the red bomb markings are counted at every 10th, so every 10th sortie or bomb dropped is marked red.

However, ‘Mig Eaters’ bomb markings were all marked red so I’m not 100% sure why.

Note: The first 3 markings under the Mig symbol are JP233.

The symbol you question are recce markings. Initially I thought they might have been JP233 markings but I’ve just remembered that they were different. They look like cameras.

Hope this helps.

If the ‘B’ variant goes then Italy and Spain have got a little bit of a problem. If the ‘C’ variant goes then the FAA/RAF are in the same position unless they go back to the much less capable, flying oink-oink ‘B’ variant. Desicions-desicions. Some poor sods going to lose out…

Your average RAF pilot might actually have inferior foreign language skills, compared a previous generation of RAF officer (but I’m only guessing). The French officer’s English language ability would certainly have improved during the same period.

Well if the superior speaking French can speak English then theres no need for the British to speak French then, ain’t there. You’d be quite suprised how many RAF personell can speak different languages, same goes for other air force’s personell, too.

Why Germany with India given the past deals and history would the Brits not have been in a better position to negotiate ?

Why not Germany and EADS instead of the UK and BAE Systems?

Another simple reason being is, is that theres 3 huge parts of the world that EADS has and wants to be established in. The first 2 are the US and obviously Europe where EADS has a significant foot print in. The 3rd part of the world EADS wants to have a significant part in is booming India. EADS call these the so-called “three pilars”. BAE Systems might be a much bigger company than EADS (in Europe anyway) but it makes perfect sense for EADS and Germany to lead the way in India for Eurofighter GmbH’s bid. However, recent reports suggest that BAE Systems and Alenia Aeronautica/Finmeccanica have a significant amount of influence too. Italian officials are flying out to India next week(?) to hold talks about the Typhoon amonst other topics. BAE Systems are leading Typhoon’s bid in the likes of Japan, Malaysia etc.

Despite BAE Systems’ presence in India already, EADS leading the way was and is the right and better way to go IMO. Dassault have got more than a fight on it’s hands with EADS in India let alone with the other makers of the Typhoon involved.

Someone mentioned price and operating costs regarding both aircraft. I’ve just been looking around for some numbers for the Typhoon and just this moment came across a thread via f-16.net, usually one of the last places I would look but hey. Ironically I came across a source posted by a certain member that seems to have a certain type of hatred for the Typhoon and attempting to point out that the Typhoon is an expensive waste of something or another, blaaaah more than an F-22, but only to be proved otherwise by a couple of members. One of which our very own Scorpion82 with, as usual, the patience of a saint.

It doesn’t go into great detail but probably enough to get something of idea of how much the operating costs roughtly are: These are for British Typhoons so the figures for the Germans, Spanish, Italians, Austrians & Saudis will vary;

From November 2010;

“The MoD calculates the full cost of aircraft per flying hour; the current rates for our fast jets are shown below. These figures include forward and depth servicing, fuel costs, crew costs, training costs, cost of capital charge, depreciation and amortisation. The Typhoon cost per flying hour reflects the build-up of the fleet with small numbers of aircraft currently in service. This cost will comparatively reduce as the fleet builds and is expected to be similar to our other fast jet fleets when we reach a steady state position.“

Put simply, cost per flight should be between £35,000 and £40,000 with whats stated above taken into consideration.

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201011/ldhansrd/text/101125w0001.htm

Theres so much more to take into consideration but the above gives a rough idea. Is there any similar figures going for the Rafale?

Would be interesting to see how they stack up against Typhoon’s.

Nevermind Italy & Spain looking for a plan ‘B’…

The SDSR criticised the £20 billion carrier plan that it had inherited for two new carriers and around 150 JSFs as ‘crowding out other important investment in the Armed Forces’. But it has since committed itself to a further investment of around £1 billion in converting one of the two new carriers to operate in a catapult and arrestor gear configuration. No decision has yet been announced on how many JSFs, UAVs and/or helicopters will be purchased for deployment on the new carrier.

The government has confirmed that it now envisages routinely deploying only twelve JSF aircraft on the carrier for operations, compared to the original thirty-six. And the requirement for daily sortie generation has been reduced from seventy-two to twenty. This suggests that the government could now be envisaging a total JSF buy of no more than fifty aircraft. But this could still mean procurement costs amounting to around £5 billion, in addition to more than £2 billion already spent or committed for the development and demonstration phases.

Plans for initial deployment of the new Queen Elizabeth-class aircraft carrier in 2020 suggest that the first tranche of JSF aircraft will have to enter service on, or around, the same date. It is far from clear, however, whether the MoD will be able to afford to buy as many as fifty aircraft by that date. Because the F-35 is not being produced domestically (like new submarines), or through a rigid collaborative structure (like Typhoon), the MoD has greater flexibility to vary the size and pace of procurement as unit costs, operational requirements and availability of funds alter. The projected sharp increase in deterrent production spending from 2021, together with the costs involved in bringing a new and sophisticated capability (the aircraft carrier) into service around the same time, could mean that there simply are not the funds to buy even the fifty or so JSF aircraft that at present seem realistic. A reduction in the number is especially likely if the price that the UK is asked to pay for the F-35C continues to rise.

http://www.rusi.org/downloads/assets/RUSIBriefingPaperSept2011.pdf

Hmmm….