Just because the typhoon doesn’t have A2G right now does not mean it will make a bad air to ground platform F-15 springs to mind of how an airframe designed for A2A can also be a Quality A2G aircraft.

Also i may be mistake but is there no more A2G Munitions types planned to be integrated to the tiffy in the future.

Lots of military aircraft were at first, for a good number of years, quite basic in the A/G department.

Paveway IV is planned to be introduced into operational service early next year. Actually they were dropped during tests in 2009, although dummy IVs. From IPA 1 if I remember correctly. Storm Shadow and Taurus are more than likely to enter service with the Typhoon along with the likes of Brimstone. SDBs have been mentioned in various articles as well has an anti-radar A/G version of Meteor and a number of anti-ship missiles.

Theres likely to be other new types of munitions introduced over time, 20, 25 years ago, I’m sure the Tonka never thought it’d operate Storm Shadow & Brimstone.

hahaha, EADS and all the buzz, its Cassidian , cassidian has €5b turnover, Dassault aviation alone and i don’t talk about Dassault Group, its about 1billion less but 100% of Rafale, not 46% , as Rafale backing come from Thales, Safran,MDBA and EADS not Cassidian has 46% of Dassault aviation, means that they back Rafale More than tiny german defence budget could profit them!

nice try anyway..

Oh please for goodness sake, do pay attention. I said “compared to the likes of BAE Systems etc”…

Very nice, Eurofighter Typhoon’s backing comes from Alenia Aeronautica, BAE Systems, Cassidian, (EADS German and Spanish side) Finmeccanica and almost 400 other companies, oh and its governments. If the major ones move resources to India they’d make one hell of a fortune and not to mention, the likes of BAE Systems alone have ‘their fingers in more pies’ (as they say), so India would be involved in more projects than they would with Dassault Aviation. And more companies backing means India gets more industrial benefits, which happens to be what India wants and needs.

Sorry to burst your bubble and as much as I respect the Rafale nd its makers, but, industrial benefits alone, Eurofighter offer way more to India.

Here’s a question…. and it may be a stupid question.

The point of this contract is that India will set up a production line and licence build whichever aircraft they choose. Now we all know that things are expensive to build in Europe and cheap to build in India would this make the prices of the Indian built aircraft cheaper?

If this is the case would it be worthwhile the European country’s moving some of their own production over to the Indian production plant? Or say some of the orders for Brazil or japan if the respective bids are successful

Not at all, well actually, its a very good question you’re asking. Never thought of it myself.

I’m not too sure what Dassault Aviation will do since they seem to never be ar$ed to publish anything to do with the MMRCA competition, apart from them offering a comprehensive ToT package, I suspect with them being a small(ish) aerospace company – compared to the likes of BAE Systems, EADS etc, I doubt they’d want to move too many of their resources to India, I think they’ll be quite reluctant in fact. As another member mentioned before (C-seven), Dassault Aviation are more of a “family business” so they’ll probably want to keep it that way s much as they can. They’re not exactly looking for some kind of monopoly such as the likes of BAE Systems, LM, Boeing & all I believe. As much as they’re offering to India, I think they’d just be happy with offering the ToT and what not to India.

If the aircraft produced & built in India are cheaper, it must be come to think of it, it probably explains why the UK, German, Spainish and Italian governments & aerospace companies are so supportive and keen on getting this deal won for Eurofighter, or one of the reasons at least.

Cassidian have already opened up – or in the process of doing so – an engineering centre in Bangalore. Since September last year, as far as I’m aware of, the first 15 Indian engineers from the Cassidian engineering centre in Bangalore have been at Cassidian’s Manching site in Germany attending various technical training courses. They’re now trained up to work with the German boffins at Manching, they’re all trained to work with related aircraft systems, engineering IT and avionics etc, the Tiffy systems I guess.

Enzo Casolini had stated that; ‘For a customer industry working with Eurofighter’s four partner companies, this means opening the doors to a potential collaboration with a complex set of industries that total more than 120 billion dollars revenue and that have a product range that varies from the smallest of UAV’s to the world’s largest passenger aircraft as well as from satellites to submarines.’

So its not just indurstrial benefits from the Typhoon thats open to India, its a whole lot more projects. So if it is cheaper for Indian built, or partially built aircraft and other things then well, everyone involved are going to make a good few pennies.

@rayrubik, I’m not sure price per aircraft matters as of now since neither maker has mentioned anything in their publifications concerning the MMRCA competition, I wouldn’t be surprised if this deal will that of a ‘package deal’.

I also notice that the EF goes very rarely on exercice against the Rafale, UAE and Solensara were the exception, and it seems that it’s against the AdA wishes. In other words: it looks like they avoid the Rafale.

Rafales were in the UK with RAF Typhoons late last year, not 100% sure exactly when, but from around September for a couple of months. I believe they were here earlier at the beginning of last year too also. Oh eh, the AdA were invited by the RAF to take part with their Typhoons, too. Like to avoid? I think not!

I´m pretty sure that Eurofighter is not a technology transfer club.
Rolls Royce isn´t giving out it´s engine knowledge, Selex isn´t giving out it´s AESA experience.
All parter companies cover their areas of expertise… With alot of wasteful overlap in production, etc.

I think it´s absurd to on one hand rave about the ever-almost-ready AESA radar, and then claim that India will get so much more tech transfer out of this than a Rafale deal because of co-development. The tech transfer will essentially need to be ironed out thru bilateral deals with each Eurofighter company, though it´s highly likely that partner countries have delegated to Eurofighter to authorize sharing what they are willing to part with… The partnership process is such a mess, that India will not realistically use it when negotiating all of it´s requirements, but negotiate with a unitary Eurofighter GmbH representative. If it actually behaved like a partner, that would mean negotiations working like already seen in Europe, and needing to wait for every partner country to sign up on the contract themselves.

Fair points but theres no evidence to suggest that Eurofighter is not a technology transfer club, actually quite the opposite going by they’ve already published. They stated back in October last year that ‘its partner companies and the four nation members of the European consortium Germany, the UK, Italy and Spain, are fully committed to deepening the strategic partnership with India.’

Bernhard Gerwert had stated that: “The Eurofighter Supervisory Board is meeting in New Delhi to underline the importance we attach to integrating India into the programme as a true and equal industrial partner. Even ahead of any contract, we are ready to engage India’s defence and aerospace industry in joint production and research & development (R&D) for Eurofighter Typhoon.”

Then Enzo Casolini stated that: “We have the potential to elevate Indo-European political, industrial and technological relations to a completely new level. All Eurofighter partner countries are supporting the Eurofighter campaign in India. Four nations, four air forces and Europe’s leading aerospace and defence companies want to increase their industrial cooperation with Indian defence companies for mutual benefit through the most advanced multi role fighter available on the market.”

Pretty much answers ones’ questions. Sadly for us minion aviation fans though, we don’t know the whole gist of things.

With India becoming the 5th consortium member of the programme then I think it’ll be safe to say that they’ll have just as much to do with the programme as much as the UK, Germany, Italy and Spain do. It’d be rather odd otherwise. And in this day & age of the not so running too smoothly economy I think ones would welcome a 5th member with open arms. I certainly would. Also, this competition has been going for donkeys years so its not like they’ve just got until ‘yesterday’ to sort things out. Be asured they’ve carefully thought this through.

My lass & myself were at work, (no closing early or a day off for us) she popped in the store I work in, she works in one a few doors up, on her lunch & mentioned there was a fly past of various aircraft, knowing that I how a keen interest in avition. We’re both not realy interested in this nonsense and the fly past was the only thing that caught my attention. Basically, couldn’t give a monkey’s toss about it.

Anyway, nice to see them though, the aircraft that is.

I wonder if Willy wondered how often he’ll spend “in the RAF” after seeing those flay past. Like his kid brother, he seems to spend more time on leave than he actually does in the in Granny’s armed forces…Waste of time IMO.

As you can see I’m not a Royalist.:D

Might be time to stop calling referring to the MMRCA purchase as a “$10 billion fighter aircaft deal”. $20 billion would be more accurate.

If I may kindly ask; why $20 billion?

With a race between just the Typhoon and the Rafale now what will probably tip the scale in either’s favour is probably technology transfer. Both have already mentioned rather substantial deference of technology to India and HAL but I wonder between between the Eurofighter consortium or Dassault will up the ante with even more promises to work with the Indian aviation industry?

Its going to be interesting for sure. I suspect that if Dassault ought to up their ante if they really want this deal. I’m not being anti-Dassault or anything but I really do believe that they can offer more than they have/are & I just don’t think they’re promoting their product as well as they should be doing. As I more or less said before, I’m getting the impression that they’re saying; ‘Heres our bid, take it or leave it.’ It seems like in this competition and like others in the past, its, we want more than just a deal in our favour. IMO I sense some amount of greed going on from the French side. I still didn’t or don’t understand why they haven’t offered some sort of partnership in the Rafale programme. Its obviously a big and attractive selling point & it seems to be working for EADS.

As for EADS’ Eurofighter, I still believe they’re offering the better deal going by what they’ve published. They just seem to be, if you like, that much more up for it, they’re enthusiastic, confident, excited, willing & supportive and as a seller, no matter if you’re selling a microwave oven or a multi-million dollar fighter, you need these things, it makes the buyer that whole lot more comfortable. And I must stress, I’m not getting the same exciting “buzz” from Dassault like I am from EADS. Put yourself in India’s shoes & have a little think about it, being biased put aside.

Also, its four countries against one and don’t be mistaken that those four aren’t that bothered or supportive. Be asured they are.

Great a builder only able to point a indian press article as basement for a deal where they are themselves actors !

how credible! :diablo:

Yeah, like they’re going to shout about what they’re REALLY offering to India so their competitors, well, competitor, can hear, okie dokie, that’d be wise wouldn’t it. Better to keep their cards close to their chest on this one.

But hey, at least they’re reporting something and seem to be the more confident of the two, which, sadly can’t really be said for Dassault.