EELightningHAWX said:
Rafale is many, many years behind the competition.
BW said:
Exagerated . India will get the HMD in 2018 . Dunno about France yet …
And…
I would say it is .
Correct me if I’m wrong, you’re both on about aircraft having and not having HMD integrated? Just to make it clear, we’re talking about other competition?
If so, then, well. To be fair, the Rafale is behind in this regard. HEA has been in frontline operational service with the RAF since October ’11 on their Typhoons. The JHMCS for the likes of the RAAF has been in frontline operational service much longer than HEA. The HMD on Rafale…Hasn’t. So its no exaggeration that it is behind. Thats like saying it’s an exggeration the Typhoon is behind the Tornado in operating with Storm Shadow.
EELightningSpitfire, Witcha. Kinda missed the point. But aye… :rolleyes:
TooCool_12f, Typhoon users depend on the US for BVR, but for how long? That isn’t really much of a hold up since Meteor will be ready by 2015 so that arguement isn’t really valid, is it.
About Brimstone, SDB. What do they do, well, just as well or if not better than what Rafale currently has, no? Wasn’t Brimstone considered one of, if not the more effective weapon in Libya and Afghanistan? No other fast jet could field such a weapon better for busy built up areas than Tornado GR4’s Brimstone.
Back at advantages & disadvantages* *sigh*
EELightning* UK and German:
1. Doing their best to get rid of Tranche I ASAP.
2. Declaring repeatedly that they don’t want Tranche IIIB.
3. Ultra-slow pace of upgrading because of lacking of fund, and keep declaring: “We are very happy for this !!!”.
No, more like:
‘We want them just like everything else in our armed forces including personell. We just don’t want to pay for them.’
In the UK wrt armed forces, the two words, ‘Spending’ and ‘Money’ don’t go down together. Ask any British soldier thats had his arms & legs blown off in Afghanistan & paid compensation. Government* ‘Sorry about what happened to you, but you’ve served this country well, we’re all proud of you! Heres some compensation….Actually, can we have that money back please, we need to give it as aid to a country with it’s own space programme. Thanks awfully.’
EELightningRelax, Dave. Your string of words are slightly muddled up & make little sense, take a deep breath. Take it easy, you’ll live longer.
As I more or less stated a couple of posts ago in reply to Obligatory. The RAF & RSAF, at least, are pushing ahead for enhancements & upgrades, in some cases the RSAF more than the RAF going by more recent reports. Late coming? Of course, I wouldn’t state otherwise. Will they come? Again, of course & I wouldn’t state otherwise. Other Typhoon users? Well it depends on their requirements, if theres something they don’t feel the need to intgrate then they’re obviously not going to. However, P1E is due any time now which is quite a major step up in capabilities/enhancements, the Luftwaffe, or Diehl, seem to be in the early process of intgrating Pilum in the not to distant future, integration of Meteor onto Typhoon will be before Rafale and we’re likely to see Small Diameter Bomb & Brimstone integrated before too (if the latter ever gets them anyway) by the RAF at least and likely by the RSAF also, who knows maybe even before the RAF.
Its not all as one sided as so many think it is.
EELightningAt the end of the day it comes down to what one think is more credible. We’re all big enough to make up our own minds so, what else is there to be said.
In fact please find us a single real life evaluation where the Typhoon showed us it was the more capable plane! That’s all. ONE.
UK, Germany, Italy, Spain, Saudi Arabia, Austria (could’ve easily gone the other way) and the UAE wanted a more capable version! :diablo:
EELightningOn EF: i don’t think EF will ever have a diverse A2G selection, if the euro countries ever see the need for more extensive A2G, they will produce UAV
The RAF & RSAF at least would disagree with you.
EELightningRE: Jon Lake & Typhoon. If so many that criticise him for being biased in Typhoon’s favour, should really do more research on what he’s written about Typhoon in the past and what he’s most recently stated on Starstreak (Eagle1, you’re one of those that need to take a look!). For what he’s written about Typhoon in the past via AFM for example, his views have varied on many topics, for example; shortly after the campaign in Libya kicked off he done a four or five page piece in AFM (Or AI?) about Typhoon’s capabilities and he really did give it a good going over about it’s lack of A/G capabilities. Biased? Like hell he was on that occasion and it’s not the first time he’s expressed such displeasures, and has on many occasions praised the Rafale just as much he has Typhoon.
On many things he’s written negative about Typhoon, I certainly agree with as much as I do about what he’s written positive about Rafale. And I also agree that Rafale is (at the moment) the more versatile, multi-role aircraft. It is a more finished product but it’s not without it’s faults which many Rafale fan-boys don’t want to think and because of which, just because it is the more finished product I get the strong impression by them that it is the perfect aircraft and there for nothing, not one little bit about it is at fault. Hence when why the likes of Jon Lake or any other professional military analyst state anything that may sound like the merest criticism, most Rafale fan-boys’ superior complex sets in and end up throwing a hissy fit but are ignorant of the bigger picture.
It does no harm to look up both aircraft’s weaknesses.
EELightning8.59mm? .338″?
Yeah. 8.6mm is often used but actual, real, measurements state it’s 8.59mm – .338″. I have a Lapua .338 round on my set of home keys as a key ring (real shell casing, real bullet but of course not live) & it’s a hefty old thing, much bigger than a 7.62mm.
EELightningBut then we’ll have to kick your ass.
Theres a first time for everything! But still, keep those white bed sheets handy just in case, eh! :diablo:
Is it really worth discussing why some Brits have been called up on such short notice? It’s routine, quite normal. And if there is something brewing for real then lets keep our thoughts to ourselves & hope nothing bad happens, shalt we not?
EELightningthe hopelessly outdated Eurofighter needs a new radar and a slew of weapons integration, etc.
Oh, I didn’t know the lack of weapons integration defines an aircraft to be hopelessly outdated! (*Sarcasim*) :rolleyes:
If you’ve done your homework you’d learn that it has recieved a lot of upgrades & enhancements over the past few years. You can’t notice them just by looking at it or claim that just because it hasn’t had more weapons integrated, doesn’t mean it hasn’t been improved. It’s recieved more than most think & thats before P1E is due to be introduced anytime now.
EELightningWB556, it’s most probably just a routine call up. When my Uncle was serving in the Royal Marines he got a phone call on a few occasions at such notice when he was on leave – he once got a call when he was at school with his kid & wife in Ireland (parents day), he had to leave half way through. Of course, we at home didn’t know what he was up to and a few times he later said it was just routine for training purposes, he said that all the time but on a few occasions he came back a few months later with a beard…Usually with a bundle of 8.59mm shell casings (don’t ask). 😉
Its probably nothing to worry about, WB556. But my thoughts are with them & their families.
EELightningD. Cameron :
Clearly , he doesn ‘t have a clue and he should stick to what he does best : protecting The City .
Cleary, you’re showing yourself to be a hypocrite once again. How many times have you yourself claimed the same regarding Rafale vs Typhoon, only to be proved wrong (mostly by Scorpion82 on many occasions) about various systems found on both aircraft? xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
EELightningI have to say EELightning that you comment about Dassault bolloxing up the final contract might be seen as sore losing.
Really? Something they seem to be good at in past competitions isn’t anything to do with sore losing. Thats their problem, not mine, and I’m not the only one that thinks this.
I’m rather keen on military aviation and military aviation only, I don’t share the same amount of interest in civil or space aviation, so in general, it’s just something I follow in my spare time and my heart lays in many other interests than this that I find way, way more interesting. I’m not like some of those we come across on here and other forums that seem to live to be sore and troll no matter what the outcome is. And as a keen chap interested in Typhoon, well hard luck for it in India. It doesn’t affect me nor my life style and I’m most certainly not going lose my appetite, go into depression or lose any sleep over the decision. I have way too much of a life to be like that.
EELightningWow, a certain member crawled out from his pit!!! Bad loser and also a bad winner…Must be a history thing.
Nice one for Rafale, hard luck for Typhoon.
Now, Dassault just need to keep India happy and not bollox up their chances before March…They seem rather good at messing it up at the last minute.
Whats this about 80 additional MMRCAs? I’m aware of these additional units would be the one selected for the MMRCA, but this is new to me. But if India don’t want another 80 MMRCA (Rafale in this case), but of other aircraft that took part in the competition, then surely Typhoon is a no-brainer, isn’t it not?
EELightningIs that the only typhoon achievement in 4 years ? Only good for dogfights above 30 kft ?
weak. And certainly not what one would have expected form a machine built for air domination.
Do you have every single result from when Typhoon has met Rafale in A/A exercises? I very much doubt it and I wouldn’t always bet on Mr. Superior Froggy coming out on top.
Sign In
