This is large subject but I will try and be brief! Firstly, there is no way that an airshow can make a profit, never mind break even, through the flying and static aircraft displays alone.
My question about running as a business (for profit), was not regarding the airshows themselves, bur rather the individual aircraft operator.
Would an aircraft such as Air Atlantique’s Dragon Rapide (pay-2-ride) make a profit, or break even?
I remember when i was in Duxford, the Dragon ride was more than my Easyjet return trip from Copenhagen…:D
Thanks Lothar (and everyone else of cause) for a great insight into the world of airshow organisation/arranging.
I never even thought about the safety issues (besides air safty). I know there are organisations providing these services cheap, or free, but it still need to be organised and there are most likely some kind of fee/payment involved (even if its a free diner/lunch).
I’m pretty sure I speak for the majority of readers here, when I say; that we are VERY gratefull to anyone involved in organising airshows anywhere. Keep up the good work, as you might already know, its fully appriciated.
N.Wotherspoon I think you have established, that the parts for sale are not from 44-13593.
I guess the seller just wanted to “attach” a bit of history to the bits, or perhaps had beem told this when he acquired them himself.
If there are no serial numbers (other than pencil marks, which we can all make) then its a stretch to identify parts as belonging to a specific aircraft, unless you have dug them out of the ground on a known crash site.
I can see some general interest in the instruments (why on earth didn’t he make a metal panel?) and grip, but the rest have very little charm outside the circle of dedicated collectors, and i guess they would find the price too high (unless it was a famous bird, like “Glamorous Glennis”).
Yes, I can imagine its a fantastic feeling when everything falls into place.
I’m sure the planning can be a logistic nightmare. I can’t really imagine any other venture spending that amount of effort, when everything depends on the weather, thats kind of a big “unknown” hanging out there.
Is there any government, or EU, support the airshow can apply for?
Here in Denmark we only have a few airshows each year (and those are in physically separate parts of the country), so once the weather is there, people will go. The UK have quite a few and I’m sure they must somehow compete for the attending public.
When I was in Duxford (VE-Day show 2005) it seemed like a lot of people to me, but I was told that they had expected a lot more.
[QUOTE=Good Vibs;1223585]
The mother of all scrapyards: Kingman Army Airfield (Ca 1946).
Selling/scrapping surplus war assets.
* BT-13 $450
* P-38 $1,250
* AT-6 $1,500
* A-26 $2,000
* P-51 $3,500
* B-25 $8,250
* B-17 $13,750
* B-24 $13,750
* B-32 $32,500The stunt pilot Paul Mantz bought 475 aircraft (from trainers to bombers) for a cool $55.000
Hi,
Someone correct me if I am wrong but I remember the story that Paul Mantz bought the war surplus aircraft “as they were”. They were all fully tanked up with fuel and ready to go. He sold the fuel for more than he paid for the aircraft. Then he sold off the engines, parts, spark plugs,wheels, etc from the ones he did not keep and sold what was left for scrap.A very good business for him at the time. The aircraft he kept he used for his movie business in southern California.
Good Vibs[
Thats the story i heard anyway, and it makes sense too.
I actually found the the “Bill of sale” (a copy of it) for the Paul Mantz sale somewhere, its a pretty impressive list. I have it on PDF so if anyone wants a copy (just to cry over) drop me a pm and i’ll mail a copy.
Date = 19/2 1946.
Actual price = $55,425.68 “CASH IN HAND” (They didn’t trust those Hollywood flyers).
Location = Bearey field (Municipal airport), Stillwater Oklahoma.
The sale included “all appurtenances attached to or installed”. Which could also mean fuel. I have heard about many post-war sales, acquired by farmers purely for the fuel. If i remember corrently, some of those “Farm-birds” later became actual flying warbirds, as they were found across the US (or other nations).
It also notes that there is NO “warrenties whatsoever”
Poor old warlike Albert.
Guerrier is a surname in France and his first name would have been Albert-Edouard.
So:
In memory of Albert-Edouard Guerrier.
The following is my translation (and i don’t really know much french).
Pilot trainee (Maritime i would think).
Born 1st April 1852
Deceased 14 September 1885
I’m pretty sure its a Maritime pilot and not anything aviation related. I don’t even think the term “pilot” was associated with aviation untill much later.
Back they they were aerialist, aeronaut, or maybe even aviators.
Now I’m wondering (its neverending i know) how special guests like Red Arrows and BBMF are arranged.
It seems that the Red Arrows would swallow a large part on the ticket money (at least at smaller airshows), are they purely goodwill ambassadors?
I assume the “fee” also depends on the aircraft in question (besides fuel).
If the aircraft is rare and in demand (surely no aircraft can make all shows) they might be able to charge a bit more.
A show might not pay too much to attract a Chipmunk, but dig a bit deeper to see a P-47 (disregarding the actual fuel economy).
Could he have gotten the items from other sources?
I mean if the 1944 crash investigation removed it from the site, it could have ended up in private hands along the way.
I just love this bit:
“If you are a capable Engineer and would like a challenge this project is for”.
THB i wouldnt mind the bits, but the asking price is a bit steep.
PS. Tangmere1940, do you have my “Valdemar Atterdag” Spitfire 🙂
For airfield use, they must have gotten the airfield “hight difference” (for lack of a better word, my english do not stretch far into the field of math), much in the same way they get local pressure today. Then adjusted their instrument accordingly.
For a torpedo/bomb run they would have known their starting “Height” above sea level. Lets say 200′ for the home airfield. Thats an absolute “Height” above sea level and would not change (well its changing now due to global warming, but i think we can ignore that). If they deduct 200′ from their starting “Height”, they would have sea level.
It actually seems slightly easier than getting the target pressure for the day. As long as you know the absolute “Height” of your target.
I would still guess that this instrument was from/for an operational a/c with a decent climb performance purely because it is calibrated up to 40,000ft, which is why I suggested a bomber/strike navs altimeter.
I particularly like the way that the scale goes below zero:Dcheers baz
The 40,000ft argument makes a lot of sense.
When did they get rid of the “Height” type gauge (converted 100% to modern style altimeters), and what aircraft would need such a 40,000ft gauge?
Is this “Height” gauge a purely British thing?
Well, we know, unfortunatly, that a few AC has ended up below 0.
I will follow the forum rules, but material released under Creative Commons have no stipulation about credit. When i post my own pictures on Flickr, or Wikimedia, its for people to use as they please (non-profit), they can change it, cut it, or print it out and burn it. Thats simply the license i use.
BTW for other posters I can say that Webshats have a direct HTML link you can copy, that way you don’t even need to host it, it simply links to the webshot picture. That way people get their credit and nobody is violating anything.
Hi Peter,
Pictures I post here are generally from Flickr, where users post under creative commons 2.0 which means that non-profit use is permitted.
If the Flickr poster have posted the image without ownership, it would legally be his copyright infringement, as you can’t release under creative commons unless you own, or have rights, to the material.
Another fine photo site is http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_Page
Here the media files are also mostly under creative commons or a lower classification.