plawolfRead your own words and try to think hard about that.
Broke an armistice is start a war again. That is what Hezbollah did exactly.
Congratulations, you got it at least!
God! How hard is it to get? :rolleyes:
What does ‘act of war’ mean? How is it used? Do I really have to give you a reading lesson? :rolleyes:
You also need to work real hard at your sarcasm.
Anyways, all this nit picking is getting out of hand. Lets at least try to keep this discussion from getting even more sidetracked.
plawolfWhen the armistice is broken!
A broken armistice is a broken armistice, declaring war is declearing war. You can’t declare war again if you are still technically at war.
The armistice was/is observed by UNFIL.
We all know except you, that the UN is just busy to end war again and restore the former armistice at first.
Please fewer ‘rolleyes’ and hard thinking at first.In the moment the IDF may start to use its tanks more properly and the “go-in and go-out” may end. Till today the IDF showed no sound concept to wage that war, what allowed Hezbollah its fluid warfare and caused attrition without sizeable gains for the IDF so far. If all worked well in that kind of warfare for Hezbollah is questionable too. I am shure, that they did not exspected such long-time fierce fighting either. For the number of anti-tank weapons used so far, the achivements are still limited and disappointing for Hezbollah too.
Yet more pointless monologs.
plawolfTo keep things simple for. When you start a “fire”, like Hezbollah did and none questioned that so far, you can not blame the heat for your hardship.
Its simplistic to blame Hezbollah for this. There have been so much tit-for-tat that no-one can draw a line under things. Israel says this offensive is in response for that attack, while Hezbollah says that attcka is for another offensive…
Also, even if you forget the pointless question of ‘who started it’, you can’t blame the excessive suffering of the Lebanese people on Hezbollah when it is the Israeli policy of ‘lets make them pay for liking Hezbollah’ that is causing so much unnecessary suffering and death.
When things become to hot for you, none prevents the Lebanese (Hezbollah are Lebanese too, just to remember you) to do all to stop that as fast as possible.
What kind of BS reasoning is that? :rolleyes: One can just as easily use such ‘reasoning’ to say that the Israelis should just give in to Hezbollah’s demands and release some prisoners to stop all the violence.
Also, what people have a problem with is the Israeli policy of deliberately creating civilian suffering to ‘max the heat’, to try and increase the chances of the people turning on Hezbollah.
Do not exspect, that Israel will be gratefull about the killings and kidnappings of their soldiers alongside the ‘Blue-Line’, voted by the UN and its Arabic-members, when Lebanon did nothing to prevent that!
Again, more irrelevent outbrists out of the blue. If you like arguing with yourself so much, please go do it with a mirror in the privicy of your own home and spare the rest of us your monologs.
plawolf…and the related hardship you forget to add.
You really need a reality check if you think the Lebanese people like what the Israelis are doing to them. :rolleyes:
plawolfThe point is, that the Lebanese have the best reasons to stop that hardship as fast as possible.
A hardship Israel is chiefly responsible for causing. And please spare us the ‘natural consequences of war’ act, Israel could have conducted its military offensive in a way that would have caused far less suffering to oridnary Lebanese civilians.
Its an open secret that one of Israel’s military objects is to maximise civilian hardship to try and turn the people against Hezbollah.
It seems, that their fate is not your main concern, isn’t it.
Your powers of deduction needs improvement.
When all countries outside the Islamic-world were the west in your simple view,
Only simpltons try to twist what has been said so that they can avoid the difficult issues. :rolleyes:
but I am shure you not even looked into that voting really, because such details will not suit your opinion.
Hmm, baseless assumptions. Looks like someone is pulling out all the stops. :rolleyes:
You even try to claim a special right or law, what does not excist.
Oh, so now its legal to force people off their land because you want it. :rolleyes:
The UN divided its Mandat Palestine into an Arab and a Jewish state at all.
What are you trying to say?
But I see again, too much details does not fit into your simple view.
Yet more baseless assumptions. :rolleyes:
plawolfYou speak about stop of filming and do not realize that it was about the true opinion at first. Have I be surprised about that?!
I did see what you were trying to point at, my point is that your point is irrelevent. The IDF has the best intel and is ideally places to take pictures of every rocket launch sight, and there is not a thing Hezbollah can do to stop them showing footage of rockets coming out of urban areas as justification for attacks in built up areas. So where are the pictures and videos if the exist?
I do not have to live with Hezbollah, but the Lebanese have so far. Good luck for the Lebanese!
And they seem to love Hezbollah.
plawolfWell here we go again. Lets face facts folks. We have the folks on this forum who realize what kind of threat the Muslim world is facing and know that the bad guys do not want to talk because they see the Muslim worldis weak and they smell blood when they drop bombs on our kids. Then we have the folks on this forum who are “whistling past the graveyard” who want to appease, back down and sellout the Islamic cause so they can go back to their Ipods, Blackberrys, MySpace, Playstations and Plasma TVs with 400 channels of s%^t and escape from reality because its too tough for them to face.
:rolleyes:
plawolfwrong! NYT reporter ,claim that hez deliberate choose launched there rocket from christian village.(it was printed in the new york time) according to eye whitness,anyone attempting to flee was shoot by the hez.
Source please.
plawolfreality is most arab countries do not give a damn about the palestinian cause,this nis open admission by arafat himself.while tyhey willing send them arm,but they refuse share the wealth,in fact, EU provide more money to palestinian authorities than saude arabia .
In Muslim eye,the creation of israel, a non arab,non muslim country is collective insult to all muslim, the “idea of abode of islam ” been violated.
therefore israel has to wipe out from the map.
Most Arab governments don’t care enough about the Palistinians to want to risk Israel and especially America’s wrath. That does not mean that the arab people don’t care.
As for your own opions on what the beleifs of Muslims are, well thats just your own point of view, and unless you have some sort of respectable opinion poll results to back that up, its unsubstantiated.
plawolfIsrael and lebanon has no diplomatic relation, technically they still at war,and hez by crossing in israel to killed 2 and kidnap 2 israel soldier was an act of war.
How can it be an act of war if the two sides are technocally still at war? :rolleyes:
Also, you have any sources regarding the no dip relations?
in israel eye,to exchange 4 israel soldiers with 1000 palestinian prisoner(lot of them was suicide bomber wanna-be)will be a total disaster.where’s the choice?
Since when has anyone in the ME ever agreed to all the other side’s demands? :rolleyes: Everyone sets a sky-high starting bid so they have more whiggle room when the haggling starts. No-one, not even Hez, ever seriously thought that Israel would release anywhere near that many prisoners.
plawolfConvince Hamas about that and you will get my support.
Those terms were exactly what the Palistinians wanted. :rolleyes:
plawolfStick to the point. The consequences are much severe to the Lebanese.
And the point is?
Before you blame the west, look into the voting of the UN from November 1947 at first. The UN was the ruler of that piece of land and before that it was part of the Osman Empire. That piece of land got its name Palestine from the Romans.
There was no independent state or country of Palestine before.
The UN in 1947 = the west. :rolleyes:
Also, whether there was a palistinian state there is irrelevent. There were people living on that land, and the UN, ie the west, abused its position by arbitriarily deciding to clear them off their land and build the state of Israel on the boldozed houses of the Palistinians to pay for their crimes against the Jews.
Otherwise India can claim a lot of artificial Pakistan.
It did and still does. :rolleyes:
plawolfI exspected such response. A lot of people in South Lebanon are Hezbollah supporters and I do not see those change their minds over night. At least they do not admitt, that they supported something wrong. What do you exspect from the neighbours of those, which had to live further on after that war. Will he blame Hezbollah and its supporters for the hardship he suffers?!
What are you talking about mate?
The journalists are not moving around freely in Southern Lebanon. Some are clever enough to note the TV-viewers, that there are some Hezbollah people around, watching them, but that they were not allowed to picture that.
And I supose the IDF fighters and drones also have Hezbollah fighters looking over them to stop them filming. :rolleyes:
The best thing Hezbollah can do for the Lebanese people is, give-in as fast as possible!
The same could be said about Israel and the IDF, so what is the point of that statement?
They triggered that war and related hardship. So they are responsible for that and the related outcome.
Is this another example of selective recollection? :rolleyes:
It hasn’t been that long, surely you still remember how things developed.
At first the Lebanese are responsible for the well-being of their people. If you are not intrested in a war as a Lebanese, you have to do all to prevent that.
Thats just the kind of wishful thinking that makes the Israelis think that they can make the Lebanese people turn on Hezbollah if only they made them suffer enough. Please! They are not 5 year olds, and whining, ‘stop making me hurt you’ while you make them suffer is only going to make Hezbollah stronger.
plawolfThe exact terms were set out in those unsigned peace proposals. Can’t remember the exact details, but the jist of it being:
– Get out of illegally occupied land
– Allow a viable Palistinian state to exist
– Share Jerusalem with the Palistinians as the capital for both states.
Not such outragious demands are they? :rolleyes:
plawolfWest is the mother of all evil… Big bad West sitting on us poor folks… If it weren’t for the West, there’d be peace and no Muslims would be dieing… Blah blah blah…
Wake me up up when you guys come up with some new mantra to repeat ad nauseum cause this one has lost its entertainment value.
Did the west create this mess or didn’t it? :rolleyes: The west is not the source of all evil, and no-one ever side it was other then in your head, apparently.
But the west, especially the UK, IS responsible for this mess, and clamping your hands around your ears shouting ‘LAH LAH LAH’ at the top of your lungs is not going to make the problem go away.
You’d think people would wise up after doing just that for half a century. :rolleyes:
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