Israeli fighter jet crashes in Colombia; Israeli pilots escape unharmed

An Israeli Kfir-type fighter jet, which was purchased by the Colombian air force, crashed Monday on the coast of the city of Cartagena.

The two Israeli pilots who were flying the plane escaped unharmed, but the aircraft itself was completely destroyed.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3749978,00.html

Well it might be a write off but it doesn’t look totally destroyed, they should be able to salvage useful avionics and parts from it.

Bell 412? In what way is it hot-high sutible? The AAC/RAF use it for training/SAR jobs in the UK, cyprus, Brunei and Belize. They thump around mainly at sea level and rarely in the sort of temps expereinced in an afghan summer. The Cannucks had a real debate about whether it was worth deploying their Griffons to Afghan, they did in the end but mainly in a light utility/ convoy cover role – exactly what the Lynx is doing.

If we go to Blackhawk or NH90 we will be repeating history and adding yet another small fleet to the inventory. We must take the opportunity to consolidate on three to four types – Chinook, Merlin, Wildcat and perhaps a light utility type to be used to replace Bell 412/212, A109E etc, perhaps A109, maybe AW149 but a type mainly for the non op stuff and training leaving a frontline fleet of the first three.

A wild idea maybe to retire Puma immediately. Transfer crews and techs to the Merlin, chinook and sea king sqns. Use the money saved to upgrade seakings and swell the procurement pot with a promise to stand up 230 and 33 sqn with Merlin by 2012-13. Once the RAF has gone exclusively Merlin/Chinook, they pick up the mantle so the FAA can then retire the Seakings immediately and use the money to stand up 845 and 846 with Merlin by 2018-19. All tied up with a large joint OCU.

Well considering Pakistan operates the Bell 412 I would recon its hot and high capability is OK.

To be fair, I think the BBC article goes on to emphasize the father’s argument that the soldiers who go to afghanistan are pretty ill equipped. If anything this should serve them to put emphasis on this kind of stories.

Nic

I agree that the poor equipment situation in Afghanistan should be reported its criminal whats happening. But the non-story about this helicopter is different it is frankly dishonest to report it in a bad light.

Sadly ill-informed hysterical reporting from the BBC an organisation that has proven before that it knows next to nothing about defence aerospace. (It grates every time their supposed defence correspondent makes incorrect statements about how equipment is used or the wrong designation for example “SAM7” rather then SA-7 Grail/9K32M Strela).

I really feel for this fathers loss as we all should but basically he doesn’t know what he is talking about when it comes to repairing and upgrading helicopters. The major stress/wear components are the transmission and engines. The airframe on a helicopter can be cut and shut fairly safely and its common practice to splice major parts of airframe section when helicopters are upgraded, using sections of other aircraft is also very common. Actually done properly its common practice with millitary fixed wing as well, I have lost count of the reports in AFM of two damaged aircraft making one good example.

An interesting point posted by Kev 99 in the blog he found, the Bell 412/Griffon already in service with the UK and many pilots are cleared for it. It has the hot and high performance and its cheap.

Hi to all
I,m from Argentina
Reading the previous post, i have some cuestion
How many chopper have the British in Iraq to support her troops (number and Type)?
I saw pictures of the FGW, where they use Puma HC1 and Sea King HC4 there.
So, Can you transfer to Afghanistan choppper that you use en Iraq, and send to Iraq the Pumas? for example. But you will need to keep some Chinook in Iraq.
What is the problem to deploy the Puma in Afghanistan? Engine problems or what?
I agree with those who say that you (british) have many types.
For hevy chopper, of course you will need the Chinook
For medium, i`m not sure (merlin or other);For atack: AH-64D; and for recon: Lynx

There should be none in Iraq now the UK has pulled out, the Seaking HC4 are already in Afghanistan and the Merlin are going out as soon as possible which will help.

The Puma don’t have the hot and high performance to operate in Afghanistan without an upgrade, Eurocopter have presented an upgrade program to the UK which would take the HC1 Puma’s to a new HC2 configuration including new engines. Unfortunately whilst the upgrade is relatively affordable and it is the favored solution over the Sea King HC4 it has got embroiled in Politics because the work will be done in Romania rather then the UK making it less attractive to the politicians and their voters in the current economic situation.

The Sea King already operating in Afghanistan have new composite main rotor blades and 5 blade tail rotor to help them operate hot and high out there.

You know I think you need to have a look in the mirror sometime Pfcem:rolleyes:

Of all the “Kool Aid” drinkers as you call them on this forum you are the most vocal of them all…a Boeing Kool Aid drinker that is!

Also as asked earlier can you not treat other forum members with a general lack of respect and reply with the comment ‘BS’ every time you don’t agree with someone…

There is a high level of misinformation about the supply of Stinger the Mujahadeen during the Soviet Afghan war.

The CIA didn’t just give 500 Stinger missiles directly to the Mujahadeen, the reality is they were supplied to the Pakistani army (well technically as Pakistan’s ISI controlled the supply of arms to Afghanistan you can only loosely say the army) who then trained fighters from the different Afghan factions to fire the missile. Arguably the Pakistani army/ISI favoured particular Afghan factions when it came to the supply of missiles but thats another story. When it came to supplying the Stingers themselves to the Afghan Mujahadeen factions it was done on a missile by missile basis, basically the army would supply the grip stock and a couple of missile containers to a faction. Once the missile had been used the Pakistani army would ask for the empty container back before they handed over a replacement on a one for one basis. This means very few Stinger rounds were in Afghanistan at any one time and only with factions who prooved themselves trustworthy in using them.

There were some accidents, a few Stinger rounds accidently ended up in China and Iran who welcomed the look at the technology for reverse engineering.

There were some hysterical reports that Iran might hand the small number of captured Stingers to terrorists, total bunkum considering the numbers were small and more of an interest to Irans defence complex who have now made a manpad system very close to the Stinger in performance.

Basically there wouldn’t have been many Stinger rounds left in Afghanistan and they are basically unusable now.