ErezI’m sorry to inform your majisty and all the guys refusing to look straight at facts here that the latest news from Israel says the crew of the Merakava 3 dor dalet that was his left it after it recieved the hit and started firing in the direction of Gaza strip thinking the attack came from there, that’s when one of them was captured.
during normal combat while firing his weapon and that is it, end of story, he IS a POW wether you like it or not!.
And what I last heard was that the IDF inquiry found out that after the tank was hit, the crew was in a state of shock and did not fire against the terrorists.
And even if they would have, it’s still a sneak attack, murder and kidnapping conducted by sub-human terrorists inside a sovereign Israeli territory – and not fightings and capturing during combat inside occupied territory.
don’t make me laugh, the dude you are calling a civilian is a student of the military engineering academy!
He is an 18 years old student in a pre-military school. It’s hard to explain the nature of this institute, because it’s unique to Israel, but mostly what they do is studying, as well as preparing mentally and physically for their military service. It’s NOT a part of the IDF. He is NOT a soldier.
And even if he was – it still would have been kidnapping, not a POW or capturing or any of that bull$hit.
you guys need to get your reality straight and understand that you are NOT going to be welcome in the area, ever! at least not while you go on killing people here and there and bragging about your so-called long arm!
We will use that long arm, we will use it in the PA, Tunis, Lebanon and Syria – as well you should know. We will use it against anyone who threatens our country and way of life – anywhere. Your terror-sponsoring leaders will not be able to sleep at night because of the roar of the Israeli fighter planes over their house, like this morning, over and over again, first as a warning and then as an action.
ErezI’m sorry to inform your majisty and all the guys refusing to look straight at facts here that the latest news from Israel says the crew of the Merakava 3 dor dalet that was his left it after it recieved the hit and started firing in the direction of Gaza strip thinking the attack came from there, that’s when one of them was captured.
during normal combat while firing his weapon and that is it, end of story, he IS a POW wether you like it or not!.
And what I last heard was that the IDF inquiry found out that after the tank was hit, the crew was in a state of shock and did not fire against the terrorists.
And even if they would have, it’s still a sneak attack, murder and kidnapping conducted by sub-human terrorists inside a sovereign Israeli territory – and not fightings and capturing during combat inside occupied territory.
don’t make me laugh, the dude you are calling a civilian is a student of the military engineering academy!
He is an 18 years old student in a pre-military school. It’s hard to explain the nature of this institute, because it’s unique to Israel, but mostly what they do is studying, as well as preparing mentally and physically for their military service. It’s NOT a part of the IDF. He is NOT a soldier.
And even if he was – it still would have been kidnapping, not a POW or capturing or any of that bull$hit.
you guys need to get your reality straight and understand that you are NOT going to be welcome in the area, ever! at least not while you go on killing people here and there and bragging about your so-called long arm!
We will use that long arm, we will use it in the PA, Tunis, Lebanon and Syria – as well you should know. We will use it against anyone who threatens our country and way of life – anywhere. Your terror-sponsoring leaders will not be able to sleep at night because of the roar of the Israeli fighter planes over their house, like this morning, over and over again, first as a warning and then as an action.
ErezSoil that once belonged to someone else, entirely…
It will never stop. Whether it belonged to someone alse or not is not the point – it’s an internationally recognized Israeli soil. Do you need anything alse?
ErezSoil that once belonged to someone else, entirely…
It will never stop. Whether it belonged to someone alse or not is not the point – it’s an internationally recognized Israeli soil. Do you need anything alse?
Erezhow many times should one repeat this??? a soldier captured in a military operation is NOT kidnapped! how difficult is this to understand for the western media??? ever heared of the expression POW???
why is it that when an Israeli is captured they say he was kidnapped ??? is it to gain sympathy of the audience reading/hearing the news???
kinda reminds me of two terrorists, both killed UN envoys, Isac Shamer got to become a prime minister and Zarqawi got an LGB up his ****!
That soldier was kidnapped and not captured because he wasn’t fighting. He was just inside a tank, in a military outpost, OUTSIDE of Gaza, well inside the internationally recognized borders of Israel. So yeah, sneaking in in a tunnel to a sovereign country in order to execute an aggresive action and attack people who posed no threat on them (soldiers or civilians) is kidnapping – not capturing.
This is not a matter of a resistance to occupation, as one might say, and it’s not OK since it was an attack against an occuping military force – it was an attack on Israel, on Israeli soil, against Israelis. In that sense, it’s completely wrong.
And then there is the young civilian who is missing and probably has been kidnapped in the West Bank.
Erezhow many times should one repeat this??? a soldier captured in a military operation is NOT kidnapped! how difficult is this to understand for the western media??? ever heared of the expression POW???
why is it that when an Israeli is captured they say he was kidnapped ??? is it to gain sympathy of the audience reading/hearing the news???
kinda reminds me of two terrorists, both killed UN envoys, Isac Shamer got to become a prime minister and Zarqawi got an LGB up his ****!
That soldier was kidnapped and not captured because he wasn’t fighting. He was just inside a tank, in a military outpost, OUTSIDE of Gaza, well inside the internationally recognized borders of Israel. So yeah, sneaking in in a tunnel to a sovereign country in order to execute an aggresive action and attack people who posed no threat on them (soldiers or civilians) is kidnapping – not capturing.
This is not a matter of a resistance to occupation, as one might say, and it’s not OK since it was an attack against an occuping military force – it was an attack on Israel, on Israeli soil, against Israelis. In that sense, it’s completely wrong.
And then there is the young civilian who is missing and probably has been kidnapped in the West Bank.
ErezThe IAF received its first F-16A in 1980 and the first F-16I with extensive Israeli components arrived in Israel 24 years later. Would it be similar for the F-35?
Cheers,
Sunho
That’s not entriely true – there have always been quite a lot of Israeli hardware and software in the Israeli F-16s. DeepSpace should probably have more information.
Erez<1. Hmm, how do you recognize a Jew living in Slovakia, for instance?>
I heard from a Jewish student whose grandparents came from Carsbad that during WW2 the Germans used to make the Czech men drop their pants to catch the Jews – the ones circumcised were machine-gunned or shipped to KZs.
Flex probably knows more about it.
Incidentally, this tactic wouldn’t so easily work for the Arabs if they were to take over Israel at some point 😀
Well, some Nazi officers boasted their ability to ‘recognize the Jew-type’ or some other crap. This mostly happened in Eastern Europe though.
Erez1. Hmm, how do you recognize a Jew living in Slovakia, for instance?
2. Is a Jew (nation-wise) practicizing other than Jewish religion still recognized as Jew? Can a Jew be, let us say, Christian or Muslim?..
1. While physically recognizing can sometimes be hard or impossible, a Jew for me is someone borned to a Jewish mother and doesn’t deny his Jewish identity. I don’t force anyone with Jewish heritage to maintain their Jewish identity – that’s an individual choice.
2. Yes. I know one of this kind of people, and heard of others, for example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Christians
Nope, my friend.. The whole conversation originates in following sentence:
Well, we should definitely agree that if Israelis were Moslims, the way to acceptance of their country would be far easier..
I guess that was just a slight misunderstanding…
ErezWell, I don’t see Jews as nation, I only see them as religion. I recognize israeli nationaality and jewish religion but now I see you see it different.
So, what is the difference between Jews as nation and Israel as nation?
You are, again, mixing Arabs with Muslims.. I was talking about Muslims, not Arabs.
Could France remain the same country it was before with majority of Arabs? Probably not. Could France remain the same country it was before with majority of Muslims? Very much yes, as long as they keep secular government.
Jews are a nation, Israeli is a nationality. “Israel” is another name for the Jewish nation.
You can be a Jew in Israel, the US, Russia or Slovakia, but you can only be an Israeli if you have Israeli citizenship. That’s the difference.
I’m not mixing Arabs and Muslims – you originally talked about the Arabs in Israel, not Islam in Israel:
“Imagine a situation where the 20% of non-Jewish part of Israel actually managed to *sexually outperform* the Jewish part”
“non-Jewish part”=mostly Arabs, mostly Muslim.
ErezWhy Arabic Israel? The Muslims would not have to be automatically Arabs, they could also be from Pakistan or Sudan (theoretically).
During my visits to US I was surprised to learn one thing: Afro-Americans seem much greater racists than the *white*.. It is them who see everything black and white, most today’s whites don’t give much damn, as long as their daughters don’t date someone from the other side..
Now after reading this thread it looks to me that it is Israelis who are often far more religiously radical than common muslims.. All this BS written here about Israel being *state of Jews* only supports that.
I am for strict separation of church from state, be it Christian, Jewish, Muslim or anything else. Look what it brings..
Israel being the state of Jews is no different than the USA being the country of Americans, England of the British and France of the French.
A part of this thread was meant to show that Jews are a nation, not just a religion. What defines a nation? usually it’s the combination of language, history, traditions and ethnic origin. Can you really tell me that Jews don’t qualify there?
So the definition “Jewish State” is national – not religious. It is maintained through the keeping of a Jewish national majority within Israel. The larger part of them are secular. The second largest part are traditional (what the Americans might call Conservative). Only a much smaller minority is truly religiously radical – the Ultra Orthodox.
If, for example, Jesus Christ will return to this world and all Jews will see that he is a true Messiah and will convert to Christianity, they would still be Jews by origin, Israel will remain a Jewish state, and Israelis will still be Jews, Jews who believe in Christ – just like his first followers.
The same goes with Islam, btw. But such mass conversion of religion is not what you talked about in the begining – you talked about the non Jewish part of Israel, of which 90% are Arab-Muslims, “sexually outperforming” the Jewish part, and that’s an entirely different case.
It’s like the Arabs becoming a majority in France – could France remain the same country it was before?
ErezWhy not? Imagine a situation where the 20% of non-Jewish part of Israel actually managed to *sexually outperform* the Jewish part and their offspring would jump over 50% (which is purely theoretically possible in some 200 years). Would that not be Israel anymore?
I done really mind, I won’t be here to see it 😀
The country might still exist, but differently. Theoretically, it might simply unite with the Palestinian country, since both will have a Palestinian majority.
For me, an Arabic Israel (or maybe, Yisraeel) is not the same country as today’s Israel, if that’s what you ask.
ErezWell, we should definitely agree that if Israelis were Moslims, the way to acceptance of their country would be far easier..
If pigs could fly… 😀
Well, if Israel would have become a Muslim nation, it wouldn’t have been Israel anymore, would it?
ErezI agree. But you should actually start asking WHY you were attacked so many times.. You will obviously blame it on religious hatred but there is actually more behind all that.
Nobody is saying that it was all about religious hatred – we should remember that most Arab regimes back then were utterly atheist/socialist with communist background. The main reason was nationalistic – the Arab leaders’ unwillingness to accept the existance of Israel. If there was, for example, a “war for Galilee” between Israel and Syria, that doesn’t directly involves the rest of Israel, then it might have been accepted as a legitimate war. But since every war fought against Israel until today was meant to completely destory it, none of these wars are even remotely justified.
ErezWith long white beard and moustache? Or Jews don’t have those? 😉
And a very big nose 😀
If you can’t see the difference you are blind. Israel gets JDAM kits as an almost automatic free pass. Egypt wants the Harpoon and all the Israeli lobbyists cry that it is wrong. Not too even.
Alright, sure, different lobbies got different amounts of influence. The Israeli/Jewish lobby is quite powerful, but that still doesn’t answer my question which you qouted – what makes the Israeli lobby being able to control the US?
I deliberately compared the Israeli lobby with the British lobby, as both of the countries are close allies of the US. Egypt has less influence in Washington, and less sympathy there as a non democratic country.
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