GeforceRE: SCREW NATO — Old Europe responds
Why would Iraq attack Turkey? Turkey on its own could easily defend itself if necessairy. But that won`t happen unless the US will attack Iraq unilaterally.
GeforceRE: SCREW NATO — Old Europe responds
Why would Iraq attack Turkey? Turkey on its own could easily defend itself if necessairy. But that won`t happen unless the US will attack Iraq unilaterally.
GeforceRE: figaro
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 10-02-03 AT 12:19 PM (GMT)]Icarus, 200 % right.
And neither Belgium-France-Germany broke any EU-regulations. Spain, Italy, Denmark and the UK of A did, because before writing that letter they should have consulted their EU-partners. Belgium did this. The official EU-position is still that everything has to go through the UN, and NATO has no place in this conflict, unless Turkey would be attacked by Iraq which seems very unlikely at this moment. I`m sure that if the UN thinks military action over Iraq is necessairy, than we can still place patriots and E-3`s in Turkey. But the alliance at this time is dead, and so is the Union, unless it reforms. I think this is the biggest crisis in the EU since it was created. Spain and Italy have all benefitted from the EU, or from Germany and France. The UK should think that the Union can exist, even without the Britons. Berlusconi is a criminal who will not win the next elections, and same for Aznar. Keltic? Any views?
GeforceRE: figaro
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 10-02-03 AT 12:19 PM (GMT)]Icarus, 200 % right.
And neither Belgium-France-Germany broke any EU-regulations. Spain, Italy, Denmark and the UK of A did, because before writing that letter they should have consulted their EU-partners. Belgium did this. The official EU-position is still that everything has to go through the UN, and NATO has no place in this conflict, unless Turkey would be attacked by Iraq which seems very unlikely at this moment. I`m sure that if the UN thinks military action over Iraq is necessairy, than we can still place patriots and E-3`s in Turkey. But the alliance at this time is dead, and so is the Union, unless it reforms. I think this is the biggest crisis in the EU since it was created. Spain and Italy have all benefitted from the EU, or from Germany and France. The UK should think that the Union can exist, even without the Britons. Berlusconi is a criminal who will not win the next elections, and same for Aznar. Keltic? Any views?
Geforcefigaro
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 10-02-03 AT 09:11 AM (GMT)]Otan : Français et Belges opposent leur veto
Avec une heure d’avance sur l’échéance qui était fixée, la France a officiellement bloqué ce matin des mesures de l’Otan visant à assurer la protection de la Turquie en prévision d’une guerre en Irak, a annoncé un responsable de l’Alliance atlantique. La Belgique a ensuite emboîté le pas au veto français. Les ambassadeurs de l’Otan sont convoqués à une réunion de crise à Bruxelles à 10h30.
Bruxelles : de notre correspondant Philippe Gélie
[10 février 2003]
La «procédure de silence» déclenchée jeudi à l’Organisation du traité de l’Atlantique nord (Otan) par le secrétaire général lord Robertson volera en éclats ce matin. Elle visait à faire entériner «par défaut» les demandes américaines de soutien logistique aux préparatifs d’une guerre contre l’Irak. Mais une lettre cosignée par la France et la Belgique, peut-être avec le soutien de l’Allemagne, doit demander la tenue aujourd’hui d’un nouveau débat du Conseil.
«Oui, nous allons bloquer» l’adoption des dispositions préconisées par Washington depuis le 15 janvier, a confirmé hier Louis Michel, le ministre belge des Affaires étrangères. «Nous sommes en train, avec la France et je pense aussi l’Allemagne, de rédiger cette lettre pour exercer de nouveau notre droit de veto.» Le ministre de la Défense français, Michèle Alliot-Marie, l’avait laissé entendre à Munich.
Devant ce même cénacle, Donald Rumsfeld s’est emporté samedi : «Il est inexcusable d’empêcher la Turquie de renforcer ses capacités défensives (…). Ceux qui empêchent l’Alliance de prendre les mesures minimales risquent de saper la crédibilité de l’organisation.» Le secrétaire d’Etat américain, Colin Powell, a repris hier les mêmes termes : l’idée d’un veto à l’Otan «est inexcusable», il est «temps pour l’Alliance de se regrouper» derrière Washington.
Les demandes adressées à la mi-janvier par les Etats-Unis à l’Otan s’appuient sur l’obligation de solidarité entre ses membres, mais elles dépassent en réalité les stricts besoins militaires d’Ankara. Washington souhaite donner un mandat immédiat aux experts militaires du Shape (le commandement intégré de l’Otan) pour préparer quatre options : déploiement des avions radars Awacs de l’Otan sur la frontière irako-turque ; soutien à l’envoi en Turquie de batteries antimissiles Patriot ; renforcement de la sécurité des bases américaines en Europe ; remplacement de troupes américaines dans les Balkans.
Les deux premiers volets ne posent pas de vrai problème. Mais les deux autres reviendraient à «accepter une logique de guerre, ce que nous ne sommes pas prêts à faire», dit Louis Michel. «Le jour où la Turquie sera véritablement menacée, la France sera la première à la défendre», a souligné ce week-end MichèleAlliot-Marie. L’Allemagne s’inscrit également dans cette logique. De source diplomatique, on dessine une porte de sortie : «Nous voudrions que la demande vienne de la Turquie» et qu’elle se limite à la stricte protection d’un allié. Sur le point d’accepter le déploiement de 38 000 soldats américains sur sa frontière avec l’Irak, Ankara envisage d’avoir recours à l’article IV de la charte de l’Alliance, qui impose un «devoir de consultation» entre les dix-neuf Etats membres dès que l’un d’eux estime «son intégrité territoriale, son indépendance politique ou sa sécurité menacée».
Mais, jusqu’ici, les Etats-Unis l’en ont dissuadé, soucieux d’obtenir satisfaction sur l’ensemble de leur «paquet» de mesures. S’ils insistent, le blocage à l’Otan pourrait s’éterniser.
—————
Disappointed in the German and the Dutch gov`t, I hoped they would have backed the Franco-belgian policy. At least someone has the balls to say that NATO is not a warmachine.
Geforcefigaro
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 10-02-03 AT 09:11 AM (GMT)]Otan : Français et Belges opposent leur veto
Avec une heure d’avance sur l’échéance qui était fixée, la France a officiellement bloqué ce matin des mesures de l’Otan visant à assurer la protection de la Turquie en prévision d’une guerre en Irak, a annoncé un responsable de l’Alliance atlantique. La Belgique a ensuite emboîté le pas au veto français. Les ambassadeurs de l’Otan sont convoqués à une réunion de crise à Bruxelles à 10h30.
Bruxelles : de notre correspondant Philippe Gélie
[10 février 2003]
La «procédure de silence» déclenchée jeudi à l’Organisation du traité de l’Atlantique nord (Otan) par le secrétaire général lord Robertson volera en éclats ce matin. Elle visait à faire entériner «par défaut» les demandes américaines de soutien logistique aux préparatifs d’une guerre contre l’Irak. Mais une lettre cosignée par la France et la Belgique, peut-être avec le soutien de l’Allemagne, doit demander la tenue aujourd’hui d’un nouveau débat du Conseil.
«Oui, nous allons bloquer» l’adoption des dispositions préconisées par Washington depuis le 15 janvier, a confirmé hier Louis Michel, le ministre belge des Affaires étrangères. «Nous sommes en train, avec la France et je pense aussi l’Allemagne, de rédiger cette lettre pour exercer de nouveau notre droit de veto.» Le ministre de la Défense français, Michèle Alliot-Marie, l’avait laissé entendre à Munich.
Devant ce même cénacle, Donald Rumsfeld s’est emporté samedi : «Il est inexcusable d’empêcher la Turquie de renforcer ses capacités défensives (…). Ceux qui empêchent l’Alliance de prendre les mesures minimales risquent de saper la crédibilité de l’organisation.» Le secrétaire d’Etat américain, Colin Powell, a repris hier les mêmes termes : l’idée d’un veto à l’Otan «est inexcusable», il est «temps pour l’Alliance de se regrouper» derrière Washington.
Les demandes adressées à la mi-janvier par les Etats-Unis à l’Otan s’appuient sur l’obligation de solidarité entre ses membres, mais elles dépassent en réalité les stricts besoins militaires d’Ankara. Washington souhaite donner un mandat immédiat aux experts militaires du Shape (le commandement intégré de l’Otan) pour préparer quatre options : déploiement des avions radars Awacs de l’Otan sur la frontière irako-turque ; soutien à l’envoi en Turquie de batteries antimissiles Patriot ; renforcement de la sécurité des bases américaines en Europe ; remplacement de troupes américaines dans les Balkans.
Les deux premiers volets ne posent pas de vrai problème. Mais les deux autres reviendraient à «accepter une logique de guerre, ce que nous ne sommes pas prêts à faire», dit Louis Michel. «Le jour où la Turquie sera véritablement menacée, la France sera la première à la défendre», a souligné ce week-end MichèleAlliot-Marie. L’Allemagne s’inscrit également dans cette logique. De source diplomatique, on dessine une porte de sortie : «Nous voudrions que la demande vienne de la Turquie» et qu’elle se limite à la stricte protection d’un allié. Sur le point d’accepter le déploiement de 38 000 soldats américains sur sa frontière avec l’Irak, Ankara envisage d’avoir recours à l’article IV de la charte de l’Alliance, qui impose un «devoir de consultation» entre les dix-neuf Etats membres dès que l’un d’eux estime «son intégrité territoriale, son indépendance politique ou sa sécurité menacée».
Mais, jusqu’ici, les Etats-Unis l’en ont dissuadé, soucieux d’obtenir satisfaction sur l’ensemble de leur «paquet» de mesures. S’ils insistent, le blocage à l’Otan pourrait s’éterniser.
—————
Disappointed in the German and the Dutch gov`t, I hoped they would have backed the Franco-belgian policy. At least someone has the balls to say that NATO is not a warmachine.
GeforceRE: SCREW NATO — Old Europe responds
Nato rift deepens over Iraq
European leaders are closing ranks against war
France and Belgium have formally blocked a request from the US to provide Nato protection for Turkey in the event of a war on Iraq.
The move further deepens the divisions emerging between the US and some European countries over the Iraq crisis.
Opinion polls suggest little support for war among Europeans
Washington is also facing coordinated opposition from France and Germany, who have proposed reinforcing weapons inspections in Iraq – a plan endorsed by Russia.
Both France and Russia could veto military action through the United Nations Security Council, which is due to hear the UN inspectors’ crucial report on Iraqi compliance this Friday.
French officials called Nato to say they are ‘breaking the silence’, a Nato spokesman said, referring to a procedure under which each of the 19 Nato members had until 0900 GMT to raise objections.
France, backed by Belgium, had argued that preparations to defend Turkey could undermine diplomatic efforts to avert a conflict in Iraq.
Nato has now called an emergency meeting on the deadlock, to begin at 0930 GMT.
Blow to solidarity
Top US officials had earlier said that such a move would be “shameful” and “inexcusable”.
The BBC’s correspondent in Brussels, Stephen Sackur, says the rift between the US and what US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has called “old Europe” threatens to do lasting damage to Nato solidarity.
The increasingly poisonous relations are also being exposed by Franco-German proposals to expand weapons inspections, he says.
Washington has dismissed the plan as a “diversion”.
But Russian President Vladimir Putin, who is due to hold talks in Paris with French counterpart Jacques Chirac on Monday, has thrown his weight behind it.
After talks in Berlin with German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder, Mr Putin warned that a unilateral attack could lead to the suffering of millions and said he saw “no basis for the use of force at this time”.
Amid the diplomatic wrangling, the two chief United Nations inspectors have given a cautiously optimistic assessment of how Iraq is meeting its obligations to disarm.
Speaking at the end of their latest visit to Baghdad, Hans Blix said there had been signs of new co-operation but no “breakthrough”.
He said Iraq had promised to respond to a key demand to allow flights by U-2 surveillance planes before he and his colleague, Mohamed ElBaradei, deliver their key report on 14 February.
Mr Blix said he would welcome more time for the inspections to take place.
Ex-chief of Iraq’s biological weapons programme, Rahib Taha, tells the BBC that Iraq never intended to use the weapons developed in 1980s
A senior Vatican envoy is sent to Baghdad on a humanitarian mission as part of the diplomatic moves being made by the Holy See to stave off war against Iraq
President George W Bush is due to meet one of his staunchest allies, Australian Prime Minister John Howard
‘No grounds for war’
On the first day of his visit to France, the Russian president is scheduled to meet Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin and President Jacques Chirac.
Russia’s Itar-Tass news agency says the visit is aimed at boosting relations “to the level of strategic partnership”.
“All those who follow the evolution of the situation in Iraq can see that France, Germany and Russia are almost completely in agreement,” Mr Putin said during his brief visit to Germany on Sunday.
“At the moment, there is no basis for resorting to the use of force,” he stressed.
Details of the Franco-German plan are due to be presented to the Security Council on Friday after Mr Blix and Mr ElBaradei deliver their report.
‘UN protectorate’
The inspectors’ report could trigger US-led military action if it proves negative.
German news magazine Der Spiegel has sketched out the main features of the peace plan being drafted by France and Germany:
A tripling of the number of inspectors now searching for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq
The deployment of thousands of UN troops from Germany and other states in Iraq to help the inspectors carry out more thorough searches
The declaration of all of Iraq’s airspace a no-fly zone to allow surveillance flights by spy planes.
Der Spiegel says that, under the plan, Iraq would, in effect, become a UN protectorate with Saddam Hussein its ruler in name only.
Decision time
The US Secretary of State has dismissed the plan as irrelevant.
“The issue is not more inspectors,” Colin Powell said on US television.
“This idea of more inspectors or a no-fly zone or whatever else may be in this proposal that is being developed is a diversion, not a solution.”
US President George W Bush again challenged the UN Security Council to take tough action on Iraq when he delivered a speech in West Virginia on Sunday.
“The United Nations gets to decide shortly whether or not it is going to be relevant in terms of keeping the peace – whether or not its words mean anything,” he said
GeforceRE: SCREW NATO — Old Europe responds
Nato rift deepens over Iraq
European leaders are closing ranks against war
France and Belgium have formally blocked a request from the US to provide Nato protection for Turkey in the event of a war on Iraq.
The move further deepens the divisions emerging between the US and some European countries over the Iraq crisis.
Opinion polls suggest little support for war among Europeans
Washington is also facing coordinated opposition from France and Germany, who have proposed reinforcing weapons inspections in Iraq – a plan endorsed by Russia.
Both France and Russia could veto military action through the United Nations Security Council, which is due to hear the UN inspectors’ crucial report on Iraqi compliance this Friday.
French officials called Nato to say they are ‘breaking the silence’, a Nato spokesman said, referring to a procedure under which each of the 19 Nato members had until 0900 GMT to raise objections.
France, backed by Belgium, had argued that preparations to defend Turkey could undermine diplomatic efforts to avert a conflict in Iraq.
Nato has now called an emergency meeting on the deadlock, to begin at 0930 GMT.
Blow to solidarity
Top US officials had earlier said that such a move would be “shameful” and “inexcusable”.
The BBC’s correspondent in Brussels, Stephen Sackur, says the rift between the US and what US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has called “old Europe” threatens to do lasting damage to Nato solidarity.
The increasingly poisonous relations are also being exposed by Franco-German proposals to expand weapons inspections, he says.
Washington has dismissed the plan as a “diversion”.
But Russian President Vladimir Putin, who is due to hold talks in Paris with French counterpart Jacques Chirac on Monday, has thrown his weight behind it.
After talks in Berlin with German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder, Mr Putin warned that a unilateral attack could lead to the suffering of millions and said he saw “no basis for the use of force at this time”.
Amid the diplomatic wrangling, the two chief United Nations inspectors have given a cautiously optimistic assessment of how Iraq is meeting its obligations to disarm.
Speaking at the end of their latest visit to Baghdad, Hans Blix said there had been signs of new co-operation but no “breakthrough”.
He said Iraq had promised to respond to a key demand to allow flights by U-2 surveillance planes before he and his colleague, Mohamed ElBaradei, deliver their key report on 14 February.
Mr Blix said he would welcome more time for the inspections to take place.
Ex-chief of Iraq’s biological weapons programme, Rahib Taha, tells the BBC that Iraq never intended to use the weapons developed in 1980s
A senior Vatican envoy is sent to Baghdad on a humanitarian mission as part of the diplomatic moves being made by the Holy See to stave off war against Iraq
President George W Bush is due to meet one of his staunchest allies, Australian Prime Minister John Howard
‘No grounds for war’
On the first day of his visit to France, the Russian president is scheduled to meet Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin and President Jacques Chirac.
Russia’s Itar-Tass news agency says the visit is aimed at boosting relations “to the level of strategic partnership”.
“All those who follow the evolution of the situation in Iraq can see that France, Germany and Russia are almost completely in agreement,” Mr Putin said during his brief visit to Germany on Sunday.
“At the moment, there is no basis for resorting to the use of force,” he stressed.
Details of the Franco-German plan are due to be presented to the Security Council on Friday after Mr Blix and Mr ElBaradei deliver their report.
‘UN protectorate’
The inspectors’ report could trigger US-led military action if it proves negative.
German news magazine Der Spiegel has sketched out the main features of the peace plan being drafted by France and Germany:
A tripling of the number of inspectors now searching for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq
The deployment of thousands of UN troops from Germany and other states in Iraq to help the inspectors carry out more thorough searches
The declaration of all of Iraq’s airspace a no-fly zone to allow surveillance flights by spy planes.
Der Spiegel says that, under the plan, Iraq would, in effect, become a UN protectorate with Saddam Hussein its ruler in name only.
Decision time
The US Secretary of State has dismissed the plan as irrelevant.
“The issue is not more inspectors,” Colin Powell said on US television.
“This idea of more inspectors or a no-fly zone or whatever else may be in this proposal that is being developed is a diversion, not a solution.”
US President George W Bush again challenged the UN Security Council to take tough action on Iraq when he delivered a speech in West Virginia on Sunday.
“The United Nations gets to decide shortly whether or not it is going to be relevant in terms of keeping the peace – whether or not its words mean anything,” he said
GeforceRE: Bush Cartoons!
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 09-02-03 AT 08:15 PM (GMT)]http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/saddam_ballot.jpg
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/bush_dude.jpg
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GeforceRE: Bush Cartoons!
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 09-02-03 AT 08:15 PM (GMT)]http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/saddam_ballot.jpg
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/bush_dude.jpg
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http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/bush_dummies2.jpg
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/graphics/bush_knowwhatdid.jpg
GeforceGeforceGeforceRE: Bush Cartoons!
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 09-02-03 AT 04:57 PM (GMT)]http://cagle.slate.msn.com/2000/2000gifs17/bushmap11899.jpg
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/best/Texa…
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http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/WarMachin…
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/OldEuropA…
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/EuropAxis…
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/DrumsWarB…
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GeforceRE: Bush Cartoons!
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 09-02-03 AT 04:57 PM (GMT)]http://cagle.slate.msn.com/2000/2000gifs17/bushmap11899.jpg
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/best/Texa…
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/best/USGu…
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http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/DrumsWarB…
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/BushEmpty…
http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/World-USAvsIRAQ/WorldIraqGIFS/AllieWing…
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http://cagle.slate.msn.com/news/PowellUN/PowellSpeechgifs/BushOnMissilS…
GeforceRE: Airliner World 2010
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 09-02-03 AT 09:05 AM (GMT)]SN Brussels
You won’t have to wait that long. 2004 will be more realistic.
And both American and united gone? Don’t think so. Gov’t will support the airline anyway.
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