Too bad that between P15 and P15A, there is going to be a lag of about 10 yrs. Even worse, the IN should have gone ahead and built 3 more P15s with some incremental upgrades in b/w the P15 and P15A time lag.

When is the first P15A hull supposed to be launched? Commissioned?

Also, in the din of the P15A stuff, don’t forget about the other stuff in the report: Namely that 12 IAI Herons are already in service and the req for 40 new gen ASW/MR helos.

I have read that the IN is happy with the Herons and want more. Any confirmation of the same?
__________________

Victor There was plans to built the P-15B after P-15 A but now it has apperently been cancelled as the Delhi cannot be stretched further also limits imposed on stealth and sensors as its a late 80 design , so after P-15A we could see the P-18 class of destroyers, P-15A will be launched next year and commisioned in 2007/2008 with the remaining two following with a years interval.Yep the navy is happy with Herons euipped with elta 2022A radar and IR sensors the inventory will gradually increase

I think the article is in error then. The 9M38M1 (as stated in the article) missile is the SA-11 GADFLY, and the navalised version is the SA-N-7. The SA-17 GRIZZLY uses the new 9M317 (or possibly the 9M38M2, it’s unclear) missile with a small increase in range. The new Chinese Type 52B DDGs are fitted with it.

An article from here states clearly that the TALWAR has 9M317. I thought it was odd at first, becasue I thought the TALWAR only had the old SA-N-7.

Again, I think the article is wrong.

Glenn, AFAIK there is ****il and ****il-1 the ****il carries the SA-N-7(Gadfly ) and the ****il-1 as on Talwar carries the SA-N-17 Grizzly , The P-15A will definately carry the Grizzly , No point in Carrying the SA-N-7 as in delhi class as the SAM is itself 20 years old first entered in 82 with the Sovermny, Infact its very difficult the differenciate just by looks as they look very similar , As far as specs goes the Range has been increased from 35 to 45 Km , It carries better guidance , has the Same Mach-3 speed and has increased kill probabbility for a single missile , Infact the Landbased BUK-M2upon which the Grizzly is based has limited ATBM capability as advertised by the Russians and in dire situations can perform as AshM WITH A RANGE OF 25 kM IN Top Attack Mode , Each MR-90 Orekh FC radar for ****il-1 is capable of providing guidance on 2 targets , the ****il-1 is capable of Attacking 6 Targets with 12 missile , to increase the kill probability , The IN has decided to Standardise its Medium Range SAM based on the ****il system , considering 9 ships will be carrying the System ( 3 Delhi + 3 talwar + 3 banglore ) , Although On paper it doesent looks as Potent as The Aster , Only the end user knows the real potential of this SAM , and Since the IN has decided to Standerdise on this SAM , it has to be something .The Aster will come when it comes and most likely from all the Sources It will be installed on the Follow on P-17 class the P-17A , The only Strange thing i find is that the VL ****il-1 has been quoted a Range of 32 Km far less than its instrumented range of 45 Km.
The P-15A will be stealth to an extent that it will have angeled Surface and probably all the good features gathered from the P-17 class like machinery will be mounted on noise and vibration proof mounts to reduce acoustic and vibration signatures.Low IR signature and IR supression system , so it will have certain LO character and not stealth in the real sense only the DD-21 and Type-45 are truly stealthy in design and only future Naval Ships Designed from scratch and Stealth in mind will be truly stealthy , Also The Navy has been pretty impressed with the Hulls of P-17 class and all future ships of IN will be based on this hulls.

SCORPENE CONVENTIONAL SUBMARINE

The Scorpene submarine has been jointly developed by DCN of France and Bazan
of Spain. Two Scorpene submarines have been ordered by Chile. Construction
has been started at the DCN shipyard in Cherbourg for the first to be
delivered in 2004, and at the Cartagena shipyard of Bazan in Spain for the
second with delivery in 2005.

SCORPENE FOR THE CHILEAN NAVY

The 1500t Scorpene being built for the Chilean Navy has a length of 66.4m.
It is not being fitted with the air independent propulsion system. The two
vessels are being equipped with four diesel generators providing more than
2,500kW using GM synchronous motors with permanent magnets.

The Chilean Scorpene will not use a towed array sonar but is equipped with a
flank array sonar. The six torpedo tubes will be capable of launching German
SUT torpedoes, F-17 Mod 2 or Mk 48 torpedoes and SM-39 missiles.

WEAPONS

Scorpene is equipped with six bow located 21in torpedo tubes providing salvo
launch capability. Positive discharge launching is by an air turbine pump.
The submarine’s weapons include anti-ship and anti-submarine torpedoes and
anti-surface missiles. 18 torpedoes and missiles can be carried, or 30
mines. The handling and loading of weapons is automated.

COMBAT MANAGEMENT SYSTEM

The SUBTICS combat management system, with up to six multifunction common
consoles and a centrally situated tactical table, is collocated with the
platform-control facilities. The combat management system is composed of a
command and tactical data handling system, a weapon control system and an
integrated suite of acoustic sensors with an interface to a set of Air
Surface Detection sensors and to the Integrated Navigation System. The
system can also download data from external sources.

The Integrated Navigation System combines data from global positioning
systems, the log, depth measurement and the ship’s trim/list monitoring
system. The Scorpene monitors the environment, including seawater density
and temperature and the submarine’s own noise signature.

SONAR

The vessel’s sonar suite includes a long-range passive cylindrical array, an
intercept sonar, active sonar, distributed array, flank array, a
high-resolution sonar for mine and obstacle avoidance and a towed array.

CONTROL AND MONITORING

All submarine handling operations are carried out from the Control Room. The
vessel features a high level of automation and surveillance, with automatic
control mode of rudders and propulsion, continuous monitoring of the
propulsion systems and platform installations, centralised and continuous
surveillance of all potential hazards (leaks, fires, presence of gases) and
the status of the installations that affect safety while submerged.

CONSTRUCTION

The submarine incorporates a high level of system redundancy to achieve an
average 240 days at sea per year per submarine. The maximum diving depth is
300m, giving the commander more tactical freedom than previously available
on conventional submarines. There is no limit to the duration of dives at a
maximum depth, other than the power systems and crew limitations. The
structure of the submarine uses high-yield stress-specific steel which
allows for as many dives to maximum depth as necessary.

The use of high-tensile steels has reduced the weight of the pressure hull,
allowing a larger load of fuel and ammunition. The reduced complement
minimises training costs and increase combat efficiency by making more
space, while a larger payload enhances the ship’s autonomy.

When dived the Scorpene has low radiated noise which permits improved
detection ranges of its own sensors and reduced risk of detection by hostile
sensors. The low radiated noise is achieved through the use of advanced
hydrodynamics with an albacore bow shape, with fewer appendages and an
optimised propeller.

Between the suspended decks, the equipment is mounted on elastic mountings
wherever possible, and the noisiest systems have a double-elastic mounting
to reduce the risk of their noise profiles being radiated outside the
submarine. The shock-resistant systems have been developed from systems
incorporated in advanced nuclear-powered submarine designs. The low acoustic
signature and hydrodynamic shock resistance give the Scorpene class the
capability to carry out anti-submarine and anti-surface ship warfare
operations in closed or open sea conditions, as well as the capability of
working with special forces in coastal waters.

ACCOMMODATION

The total ship’s company is 31 men with a standard watch team of nine. The
control room and the living quarters are mounted on an elastically supported
and acoustically isolated floating platform. All living and operational
areas are air-conditioned. The submarine also has space for six additional
fold-down bunks for special operations crew.

The vessel is especially equipped with all the necessary systems to provide
vital supplies, water, provisions, regeneration of the atmosphere, to ensure
the survival of all the crew for seven days.

The ship is equipped with full rescue and safety systems. A connection point
for a diving bell or Deep Submergence Rescue Vehicle (DSRV) allows
collective rescue operations.

STEALTH

The planning and design of the Scorpene was directed towards achieving an
extremely quiet vessel with a great detection capability and offensive
power.

The forms of the hull, the sail and the appendages have been specifically
designed to produce a minimum of hydrodynamic noise. The various items of
equipment are mounted on elastic supports, which are in turn mounted on
uncoupled blocks and suspended platforms. The isolation also provides better
shock protection to the equipment.

PROPULSION

The Scorpene has two diesel generation sets providing 1,250kW of power,
mounted on an elastically supported platform. At the top of the hull
immediately above the diesel generator sets is a Dutch Breach machinery
shipping hatch. The submarine has an elastically supported 2,900kW
electronic engine.

There are two variants of Scorpene, the CM-2000 with the conventional
propulsion system and the AM-2000 equipped with air-independent propulsion.
The AM-2000 is capable of remaining submerged on underwater patrol for three
times longer than the CM-2000.

AIR INDEPENDENT PROPULSION

A conventional diesel-electrical submarine sailing underwater is difficult
to detect. However the need to come repeatedly to periscope depth to
recharge the batteries using the diesel engine greatly increases
vulnerability by both its aerial detectability, because the snorkel
projecting from the water is detectable by radar, and its underwater
detectability due to increase in radiated noise from the working diesels.

The ratio between this time of greater vulnerability and the total operating
time is known as the “indiscretion rate” and for all conventional modem
submarines the indiscretion ratio ranges typically from 7 to 10% on patrol
at 4 knots, and 20 to 30% in transit at about 8 knots.

To lessen the submarine’s vulnerability, the vessel can be equipped with an
air-independent propulsion system such as: the Stirling engine, the fuel
cell, the closed-circuit diesel and the Module d’Energie Sous-Marine
Autonome (MESMA) system .

The MESMA anaerobic system, in which heat in the primary circuit is produced
by burning ethanol with oxygen, can be easily installed either at the start
of the submarine’s construction or in a later modernisation to convert the
CM-2000 to an AM-2000 build standard. With the MESMA system the AM-2000
submarine can stay down in underwater patrol three times longer than the
CM-2000. Its performance features remain the same in all other respects,
except that the length increases to 70m and its submerged displacement to
1.870t (against the 61.7m and the 1,565t of the CM2000).

The Scorpene submarine has been jointly developed by DCN of France and Bazan of Spain.