As Bruce has said, this thread has gone a surprising distance! I’m just posting again to explain that my idea of converting the CASA to Jumo configuration is based on two things.

Firstly, the museum’s own collecting policy. If indeed a Merlin-CASA were deemed unfit for the museum, then conversion to Jumo would redeem it through its resemblance to the original German version. Whether it were painted in Spanish or Luftwaffe markings, it would in either case represent a wartime Heinkel in the metal. I’m still hoping someone can clarify whether this airframe would have been built with Jumo’s, in which case it would be a conversion back to how it originally was anyway.

Secondly, the current condition of the airframe, ie. heavily corroded and fairly well stripped. This means that an enormous amount of work would be needed in any case, and that conversion as part of the restoration work may not add very much to the total effort and funding required. The airframe’s poor condition could be seen as a good opportunity to convert.

I’m not suggesting that it would in either case be easy or cheap, I simply feel it’s an option that should be explored given the airframe’s condition and the collecting policy of the museum that currently holds it.

As a slight aside, I’m hoping the rumour mentioned earlier in the thread about disposing of the French-built Storch and Ju52 are unfounded. To my mind they are close enough to the originals, and where on earth would IWM source the real German-made replacements?

Alder Tag,

According to the axis aircraft website this aircraft is No 53, was this a production or Spanish Air Force number, I don’t Know!!!

What I was told is that a number built were Jumo engined CASA 111’s, I don’t know for certain the exact number but if my memory serves me right the figure was closer to 100.

If anyone can verify these two points are fact, than the aircraft may be a prime and valid candidate to be restored with Jumo’s.

Either way this aircraft deserves better TLC than currently being received- no bad reflection on the IWM, as with any other museum they’re constantly fund juggling.

Perhaps the only way forward is to form a seperate support group to restore and maintain the aircraft on proviso from the IWM that it is legally protected from disposal, so the groups efforts are not in vain.

Yes they were all repainted in Spain I believe, where a lot of the filming took place due to the weather over UK. Colours were pretty authentic, black/dunkelgrun splinter camo with light blue undersides, albeit gloss paint was used. Luftwaffe codes were correctly portrayed and thank goodness the ban on the use of swastikas wasn’t extended to the film aircraft! The aircraft looked pretty convincing and the opening sequences of the BoB film are very good with ‘Field Marshall Goering arriving in a JU-52 (don’t anyone mention it’s a CASA 352!) and inspecting two huge rows of ‘He-111s’. I would be interested to know how many of those were actually airworthy for the film and if Duxford’s was in that line-up?

I thought it was Gen Milch taking the inspection in the opening sequence. Mind you it was an article from my dad’s “magazine”;) ( M*****r, if memory serves me right) so they could have got it wrong.:confused:

Dear sir or Madun,

I am writing to complane about the Spitfire witch flu over my house today, witch was so high I cud only tell wot it was by the shape of it!!! Add too that it was so quiet it cudn’t be herd above the noise of next doors chickens.

THIS IS JUS NOT GUD ENUFF, shud the pilot continue this atroshush…… awful behavyur, I’ll ‘aff to get a ristraning oredr to get him to fly lower.

Yors sincerly,

Mrs Ima Saddun.
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

P.s. In reality it would be nice to get a few vintage aircraft warbirds over Retford occasionally please.

regards Rad

This was the exact scenario I attempted to achieve at Boulton Paul, with the wreckage of Defiant N3378 (With one or two added bits from other Defiants, not least Steve Hague’s engine and prop) laid out as a crash-site diaroma right next to the FSM of Defiant L7005. Sadly, the guys who actually built the FSM did not want what they called the ‘scrap’ aircraft ‘ruining’ the view of L7005. The wreckage was exiled to a distant corner in the belief that the FSM was far more valuable.

What a shame, this attitude shows those of small minds need to broaden their horizons if they want to get the best.

Looking at what has been released so far a miracle occured when you see all on board got out Ok, mixed with sadness at the loss of “Liberty Belle”, my heart goes out to all involved.

I notice this was restored at Tom Reilly’s- Just curious, was this the B17 he had in the workshop around 1991? – I went to see his place whilst on holiday, and was this the former turboprop testbed?

Tongue in cheek ans – Airfix 1/24 Spitfire – Price X L X H X W = £40x24x24x24= £552,960 versus 1/1 FSM ?? £28,000 + VAT ??= yep:D:D

Seriously, that depends on what you gain from a purchase – in the case of individual, arguably an expensive garden onament but if they are happy with their purchase there is no issue to raise – many of those individuals use their FSM’s to raise awareness & funding for charities, so that adds value to them.

However, for museums and collections I still believe they are worth the money, whether its a one off build or mass produced fibre-glass, especially when they are relevent. They can be a valuable tool, education-wise and in the case of warbirds a cost effective option to an original, occasionally they can be complementary to other displays – such as at Hawkinge.

Casing a Spitfire, would I love to see one at the museum of which I am a member? Yes I would!!!- the type is extremely relevent and I feel with the right compilmentary display would be a great attraction, act as a memorial to those who flew from there but also entice the casual visitor to go to collections that do have a real one on display.

Regards Rad

In a very sad day and strange movement , the Queensland State Government has forced a local aviation musuem to give up its loaned Spitfire on display.

The historic plane has now been sold overseas to a UK owner it seems.

The Spitifre should of been kept in Australia… why it was sold by a State Governemnt with no heritage thinking .. is scandalous to many.

The Caloundra Air Museum volunteers are rather upset at this snatch and sale of a item they had on loan. Someone should have their heads rolled in tourism QLD office for one and another at the cabinet level.

Wonder where was the export protection for this warbird?

See more at http://caloundra-journal.whereilive.com.au/news/story/museum-loses-historic-spitfire/

Very sad to hear, as much as I love the Spitfire , we have more than our fair share in the UK and to deprive a museum from such an exhibit is callous and as short-sighted as you get with those in authority that are clueless to heritage.:(

My heart goes out to the volunteers.