Phil FosterThe rumour is that they want the Typhoon at MPA before the end of the 2007. I suppose we’ll have to wait and see.
Phil FosterNo she isn’t remotely useless but that is because the RAF have learned how to get the best out of her. She is not however the ideal platform for the role she performs. All that is now changing with both Number 3 and Number 11 Squadrons working up to IOC on the Typhoon F2 and Number 29 Squadron working its butt off in the OCU role. The Tornado ADVs days are well and truly numbered.
Phil FosterSorry Swerve. I didn’t see you there.
Phil FosterOK, thanks so far, learnt a lot.
1) Didn´t know about leased ADV by Italy. Leased from whom? The RAF I guess, so the RAF cut back on active sqaudrons?
2) Thought the saudi Tornados were IDS. Or do they operate both types?
3) Thought the ADV had a complety different set of engines than the IDS, isn´t that so?
4) How did the RAF ADV perform in Desert Storm 1991? In terms of not being nor the design operating environment nor mission type (iraqui long range bombers not much of concern, right?) Were there any changes made to electronic suits or operational employment protovcols afetr Desert Storm? Was there much to learn out of Desert Storm, in terms of air superiorty, anyways?King Jester
PD: Waht does RIO (second crew member) stand for?
1) RAF and yes they did indeed cut back on active squadrons. Currently there are 3 front line and one OCU plus flights withing FJOEU and the South Atlantic.
2) Both.
3) No just a bigger afterburner
4) Did not see any action, came close a couple of times but were called off. Lots of mods have been made, a lot of mission equipment added HOTAS MFDs, AMRAAM, ASRAAM ECM chaff flares etc but what they really learned from Tornado ADV ops was to make the best of a bad job and replace at the earliest opportunity with the Eurofighter Typhoon.
RIO means Radar Intercept Officer also see WSO for Weapons System Officer or simply ‘Navigator’ in traditional RAF parlance.
Phil FosterThe Brits thought about using the F-14 for a while, but it was too expensive. The Tornado has some inherent disadvantages, first of all that is is too small. But the general approach – making a fighter out of bomber – seems feasible when you look at the mission. An advantage of the ADV was its improved and optimised engine for high level cruise, and it was also able of prolonged afterburner flight.
If only that were true. They did no more with the engine than give it a bigger afterburner. It is still optimised for operations below 25,000ft where it is a suprisingly brisk performer but above that it kind of runs out of breath.
Phil FosterHere you go chap.
http://secure.simmarket.com/product_info.php?products_id=1993
The FS2004 version works great although the FSX version is a bit ropey. They are working on a patch for FSX though. It should be available within the next couple of weeks.
Its not wholely accurate though. I doubt the real thing can do -9 G but its a blast to fly otherwise and the sound set is cracking too.
Phil FosterPlease dont be duped by the the latest attempt at a funds grab by the Light Blue PR machine!.
They are never going to scrap the Red Arrows. The Reds are the best recruiting tool the RAF has and they know it.
This is a cynical attempt by them to say ‘look how poor we are….we cant even keep the Red Arrows going….send us more money’. Its even more blatant than when they ‘leaked’ the fact that the Typhoon cannon was being deleted so they could cry poverty over the fact that their new fighters wouldnt even have a gun ‘boo-hoo’!.
This is all while the light blue are sending SAC’s on Expeds here, there and everywhere and putting them up in 5-star hotels!. Dont fall for the crocodile tears ladies and gents!.
Jonesy, no disrespect mate but thats just the attitude and just the kind of comment that keeps Bliar grinning like a Cheshire cat, wringing his grubby hands together and bleeding the armed forces dry.
I think that we have to be careful about what we do and say about the services. Some berate the RAF, some the Army and some the Navy. They are all under threat from this government and they are all important.
We have to question EVERYTHING they say and do these days and I mean everything.
Phil FosterI never wanted to speak too soon about the SNPs bid for Scottish independance because it really could go either way. But apart from all the other arguments against there is one thing nobody seems to have mentioned.
If the SNP win and gain power in Hollyrood it seems they may do so by a very slim majority and possibly in coalition. They need about 29 to 33% of the vote either way. Then to realise their manifesto they would then put the question of independance to a referendum. To win a referendum they will need 50%+ of the vote which is a whole different ball game.
If this happens it will be interesting to see how they play their tenure in office IF they win the election, but not the referendum.
Phil FosterWell I don’t know about overpowered, it could be but the real thing does get airborne from brakes off in 6 seconds flat in full reheat.
Ground handling is a bit frustrating as you can’t turn the nose wheel without using the toe brakes so you are always in danger of coming to a halt or even tipping the jet when tryin to turn.
Phil FosterOkay we heard you the first time. 😉
Phil FosterFirst of all, hello to everyone – have been reading this excellent forum for some time now, and decided to get-off my backside and post for a change!
Exocet 2 – I have to take issue with your statement. I’ve no doubt that the American’s did assist the UK in some part (Satellite imagery, provisions at Ascension Island etc). However to say the UK succeeded in the Falklands only because of the US is far from the truth.
A common example I hear is that “American supplied AAM’s made all the difference”. The RN Sea Harriers already had the AIM-9L Sidewinders (so successful against the Mirages/Daggers etc) prior to the invasion & conflict. Most Sea Harrier pilots had already trained on them.
That’s just one example – excellent UK fighting forces, by and large good kit, poor leadership on behalf of the Argentinians, and a huge will to win on behalf of the British are what won the day – not assistance from the US.
Keep on posting on this excellent thread – it’s a huge area of interest for me. I was based in the Falklands for a few months with the RAF, and it’s a fascinating place.
Don’t forget either that Assension is a UK dependancy and the USA has a lease to use it similar to the one they have for Diego Garcia. They couldn’t refuse to let the UK use them so thats hardly major American assistance. The UK didn’t need to ask permission to use them, they only had to say they were coming.
Phil FosterAt this time the MoD are still obliged to take all 232 aircraft on order. They are desperately back peddling and trying to amend this but they managed to put in place ****e loads of checks, balances and caveats that effectively tied the other partners into the program in its early stages.
Now those checks and balances have come back to bite them on the backside because they also tie the British into the program for the entirety of the build. If the British ‘government’ do pull out of the full 232 aircraft they have ordered they are liable to pay up fines that pretty much cover the cost of the full build. So it is in their own interests to build their own and then help build the 72 Saudi aircraft on order otherwise they are throwing money down the drain.
Which means the backsliders will likely pull out of the full build regardless. Thats the way they think. They will go down the path of least resistance to reduce their workload whatever the cost to the British tax payer.
Phil FosterThankyou very much ta. 🙂
Phil FosterROTFLMAO! If you looked closer enough you would actually see that I have defended Typhoon against tiddles’ senseless argument about the bird not being ‘fully developed’. But that would require putting down the Union Jack flag from you eyes first..
I still stick to my claim about the other things I have said. European consortium made a big mistake to let the French go develop their own Rafale. But then again, this decision was made by blindfolded fools for whom pi$$ing the French by not accepting their weight and size requirements seemed more important than the future of the whole programme. Now you got what you wanted. Two 4+ gen and no 5th gen aircraft.
How, pray tell, can ‘the European consortium’ prevent a free and soveriegn nation such as France from building their own jet? Do you assume they just say so and the French do as they are told? Do me one favour though pathetic boy. Keep your nationalistic comments to yourself, you’re just pushing your arrogance that bit further.
TMOR. Sorry. Must try harder.
Phil FosterHe means like when you sit in Typhoon’s cockpit, a good half of the buttons and knobs don’t work or have NO FUNCTION written over them. 😉 BTW, did you know that the left MFD is standardly mounted as a mock-up to save cost? 😀
I think the Brits and Germans should have been wise enough to give in at least some of the French requirements especially related to the carrierborne version. I mean, would Germans and Brits really mind having a bird of Rafale’s size and weight today? Was such marginal difference a sufficient reason to split up the whole programme?
As I know Brits, they surely depended on that French wouldn’t manage to complete the aircraft by themselves and come crawling back for export orders.. :rolleyes:
Is that a bit like when F22 pilots have to be cut out their cockpits with a chain saw? The day I see a little perspective and view balance from you is the day hell will freeze over. Contribute something meaningful for once you fool. You’re all the same, its all about dick sizes with you lot there is no discussion just mine is bigger/better/badder than yours. You’re all pathetic. Grow up.
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