Nick_76Ummm no IAF is not PAF that it needs a handout or begging bowl. I agree Mig-35 might sneak in due to russian lobby’s clout in south block, but otherwise Rafale (probably 80 odd) and 30 more Mig 29K for the navy can keep both happy.
You have to “understand”- MiG-35/ Russian according to our friends across the border is not as good as “western”. After a while, their line of thinking becomes cylical. They tend to believe only what they wish. :dev2:
Nick_76Hey Harry can you put up any of the stuff from SP’s?
thanks in advance
BTW In an interview with SP’s aviation, SP Tyagi said that the IAF “may” “embed” some of its officers into the Tejas project to speed it up. Guess who was doing the same thing for decades? Its no wonder that sometimes, the Navy actually looks down upon the AF.
Goes without saying that the Navys processes for making things happen is far more developed than the IAFs.
Nick_76:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Nick_76Thanks to BR for the link.
INs history from its own webpage
Lieutenant (now Rear Admiral) SK Damle completed training in Britain and was in the Sea Harrier Squadron from 1984 to 1989. He recalls:
“While operating from Vikrant, we learnt how to operate the Sea Harrier from a carrier. When Viraat came in, we progressed from these basic concepts and started operating in bad weather, taking advantage of the Sea Harrier’s capabilities to land from any direction. The carrier did not have to turn into the wind.
“With the help of the Indian Air Force, we developed the air combat potential of the Sea Harriers.
“In the Seahawk days, the emphasis used to be on close formation flying and delivery of air to ground weapons. But as far as air-to-air combat was concerned, there was no radar on the Seahawks and any air-to-air radar interception capability was definitely not there during the Seahawk days.
“The Sea Harrier was a quantum jump. The aircraft was more advanced, almost state of the art technology. Secondly the aircraft could carry more all up weight, more load in terms of weapons, various kinds of weapons and, therefore, many modes of delivery. Thirdly, we had air-to-air radar and, therefore, we could do air-to-air interception.
“Air-to-air combat was something that had to be developed in our Navy after the Sea Harriers were acquired. During the Seahawk days some attempt had been made to actually do some kind of air combat, but we found that people were not very keen and it was never really done as a serious business. But in the Sea Harriers we had to take it seriously because we understood well that Sea Harriers were the air defence fighters operating from the carrier and we had to learn air combat to the same level that the Air Force’s interceptors and fighters did.
“Similarly, we started flying in bad weather much more than the Sea Hawks used to do. With the inertial navigation system, we had a navigation kit available on board. We could also use our own radar for assessing clouds and for navigation. The instrumentation of the Sea Harrier was much better than that of the Seahawks. With all these advantages, we developed the art of flying in bad weather, which we never used to do in the Sea Hawks.”
Nick_76– No BVR experience. SHARs get whacked in BVR DACT. Period.
And before the forum jester pops up and prances around (AMRAAM JF-17 sooperfaighter rulez, suckerz)- I may as well add that the same holds true for the entire PAF at present. And institutional knowledge of BVR is well established in the IAF which can assist the IN with developing tactics for the Derby.
The Grifo is without doubt better than the Blue Fox but thats because the latter is a piece of junk.
Which is exactly why the Elta is being used to replace the Fox.
The SHAR also suffers from poor range. It cannot do any meaningful air-to-air combat without two 100 gallon drop tanks. India should just modify all the choppers aboard Trenton into tankers and send them along with the task force. Given that the IN already has an insane surface to surface missile capability, I don’t see too many SHAR-Sea Eagle missions.
The SHars were also cleared for IFR, if my memory is right.
Nick_76So its put on the pole underground, and then the entire pole plus aircraft is hoisted up???
Nick_76But is it Network Centric?? 😉 :p
Nick_76Ah, the anti-Islam nuts crawl out of the woodwork again. All religions have their fantatics. Some even encourage widows to burn themselves on their husbands graves, but we are not allowed to mention that are we? Only Islam bashing permitted! Pathetic!
Since when did any of the last two posts have ANYTHING to do with upgraded Saudi Tornados!?
A happy Derka derka to you too my dear Jihadi friend (ah the sweet posts you make in Pakdef)! :rolleyes: :p
Look back in the thread & you’ll see plenty of political discussion going on, a thing to keep in mind before cherrypicking posters who have taken the mickey out of you in other threads (which you couldnt address) and calling them names here (nice excuse, wot), whilst ignoring all the others who discussed similar topics.
Nick_76Not quite.. That is what they openly do, in order to gain some sympathy from their masses. But insiders report of wild parties where Cristal is being poured in waterfalls and Eastern European models are present in dozens. From time to time things like that leak out.
Dude, there are Saudi royals who hit the mat all the time and shudder at the thought of shaking hands with a women..then there are the smart ones (like the ones above 😀 ).
Have you ever thought about why true religious fanatics would cooperate with someone openly supporting Jews?
Even religious fanatics need money dude.
I guess you have never studied this topic to the very roots. Khomeini was not what he wanted all Iranians to believe. He had a quite interesting history and did his best to conceal the unpleasant details (including removing the ones who were diggin too deep). First, very probably as a son of British BP employee Williamson and Indian mother he was not of Ayran (pure Persian) race at all. According to Savak members, his sayed title (claimed descendents of Muhammad) through the seventh Imam Mousa Kazem is an outright lie. Second, he never made it to Mekka to gain the Haji title. That makes his religious title Ayatollah appear in somewhat weird light, but reports says he has gained this one via political connections gained from his (deeply religious) father to prevent execution due to treason. Third, he has barely spoken Farsi fluently (limited vocabulary of some 500 words plus basic grammar) and disliked Iranians in general. According to some sources he rather spent his time elsewhere than in Iran and thus ‘travelled’ a lot.
Spent some time on the net googling around, I am sure you will find enough articles about this strange guy. Start here:
My friend, you have to study the topic in depth rather than depend upon savak articles about who or what Khomeini was. K was a right old sod. Full of Islamic fire and brimstone, and like a typical Islamist, very canny and aware of the usefulness of being in the west to avoid the reach of the Pahlavi regime. The Egyptian Brotherhood and many other fundamentalist organizations, as well as the Pak based terror ones (currently being hammered by the US) have used the west as a staging ground. Fundamentalists have no problem in being in & using the liberties of their western staging grounds to support revolutions back home.
Nick_76I think we should have a Greenday contest- how to come up with theories and tie them up into an incoherent whole. The more incoherent, the more marks awarded.
Story has to end with : IAF, IN destroyed by
Block 52 F-16s with AMRAAMs
J-10s with SD-10s
JF-17s with AMRAAMs
The tale has to have thrilling episodes of MiGs “destoryed”.
Please feel free to litter phrases like “PAF has ECM”, “PAF has WVR”, “superb ECCM”, “Falcons will create havoc in electromagnetic spectrum”, “superb intergatin onf chinese planes with westen avincs” thru’out the thrilling tale !
Then it will all make sense. Remember, incoherence= more points! Also feel free to cut and paste, absolutely everything else BUT whats been actually asked. Be as confusing, as certain and as WRONG as possible. You will be a winnah!
Nick_76Oh lord, here we go again, the forum jester is at it again. Never mind that his earlier flight of fancy got shot down, now off he is with more!
Only thing that MAY be degraded on F-16 is its offensive ECM pod memory library. NOT its ability to aquire and destory Indian MIGs with the AMRAAM C5.
“Offensive ECM pod memory library”.
The less confused, might point out that its a simple thing called DRFM which doesnt allow the F-16s to excel in a hostile EW environment or jam threat emitters, whether airborne or shipborne or landbased, in real time, effectively.
But never mind, lets mangle a perfectly fine technical term to make it sound I dunno what. Sheesh. Never mind that the Indian MiGs all field DRFM equipped SPJs for the express purpose of protecting them from being “destoryed” (I dunno what destoryed is, sounds fairly threatening, does a PAF F-16 come and threaten the Indian MiGs with stories?)
“J-10 purchase was given goahead last year by Pakistan cabient accoridng to press reports (you can search for these yourself, cant be bothered to feed you).”
Right. And all these will join PAF tomorrow for the PAF to invade India. LOL.
I have provided evidence that JF-17 for PAF may have Western avionics to the forum jester who claimed it will all be Chinese. This despite the evidence I have posted and he fact that the ACM of PAF has himself stated on seveal occasions in the past year that JF-17 will be equipped with western avionics. SAGEM and Grifo are the most likely suppliers.
How one has to deal with the habitual twist, twist, and run dudes…
No answers for:
Namely:
1. PROOF OF THE PAF SERIES PRODUCTION PLANES GETTING SD-10/AMRAAM WITH WESTERN RADAR
2. PAF’s SO CALLED AMERICAN/ EUROPEAN JAMMERS (BAR THE OBSOLETE F-16 ALQ-184s ORIGINALLY DELIVERED WITH THE F-16S)
3. PROOF OF THE PAF INTEGRATING CHINESE/AMERICAN BVR AAMS WITH WESTERN RADARS ON ITS AIRCRAFT
Here, just so that you cant weasel out this time, I typed it in caps in plain english.
Not so hard to read, is it?
In fact our Italian chums are marketing the specific radar for JF-17 in this brouchure.
http://www.selex-sas.com/datasheets_ga/Grifofamily.pdf
Now what? Can we accuse them of secretly spreading propaganda and being cunning Pakistanis!?
This very family of radar is already in use by Signapore in its F-5s and they have integrated AMRAAM.
What a joke! The Thales website has the RC-400 with the LCA on it…does that mean it has the same radar? The SELEX Website has a T-50 on its lightweight AESA radar being offered, does that mean that the T-50 has the same for sure!
The Grifo has been advertised, offered to the PAF for donkeys years, and this “offer” is proof that it HAS been accepted for the PAF and IS being integrated with the AMRAAM? LOL!
OMG…this guy is absolutely bonkers!
If its AMRAAM or SD-10 for the JF-17. Lets not pretend Indian Harriers will stand a rats chance.
In fact nothing can stand up against AMRAAM equipped JF-17 (sic!).
Not even the F-22. JSF might have a rats chance.
All hail the mighty AMRAAM EQUIPPED JF-17, the new superfighter from Pakistan! (It comes with ECM and BVR to create havoc in the electromagnetic spectrum, assembly required)
Meanwhile, Hillen (US State Dept) notes that any F-16 equipment being sold to Pak, will be kept under strict monitoring and segregation by the US.
Obviously he hadnt heard of the PAFs secret plans!! PAF JF-17 plus WESTERN RADAR PLUS AMRAAM rules, suckerz!! :rolleyes: 😎
Nick_76Its an old habit- dude just makes it up as he goes along. Let me post something typical Greenday/Yasser style”
“PAF Has extensive experinece with creatng aahavoc with state of art french bvr and eccm from its mirages
I have given proof through all my links
PAFs F7s have superb WVR and ECM and can decimate IN
PAF Southern command can take on and defeat whole IN.
Dude PAF has super experience in inetrgrating western state of art savionics with chinese aircraft for decades for professional excellence in electromagnetic spectrum
INs arcrafft carrier will be sunk if it goes against superb PAF ECM”
Note use of generic comments, which in reality mean- absolutely- NOTHING.
Note the use of all sorts of misleading nomenclature.
Note the hurried typing.
Note the excitable jingoistic tone.
Note the spelling mistakes.
Now add, four paragraphs of badly formatted Copy and Paste from Pakdef.
Voila!
Post is ready!
That is PROOF.
But this is NOTHING.
Go to Pakdef.
Over there, he is fairly frothing at the mouth. He was imagining invading India over “Azaad Kashmir” because Pakistan would get F-16s. :rolleyes: :p
We should be thankful for small mercies on this board!
Nick_76OMG…you were the one being asked to provide sources, which you have been weaselling out of by posting all sorts of hyperbole and nonsense but none of the facts!
Do you seriously think a smoke and mirrors show will sidetrack the issue? :rolleyes:
Namely:
1. PROOF OF THE PAF SERIES PRODUCTION PLANES GETTING SD-10/AMRAAM WITH WESTERN RADAR
2. PAF’s SO CALLED AMERICAN/ EUROPEAN JAMMERS (BAR THE OBSOLETE F-16 ALQ-184s ORIGINALLY DELIVERED WITH THE F-16S)
3. PROOF OF THE PAF INTEGRATING CHINESE/AMERICAN BVR AAMS WITH WESTERN RADARS ON ITS AIRCRAFT
Here, just so that you cant weasel out this time, I typed it in caps in plain english.
Not so hard to read, is it?
Nick_76OK, you have still not placed one shread of evidence to support your claims. I have posted several peices showing that yes, JF-17 prototypes will have Chinese radar, but PAF examples will be equipped with western avionics. You claimed otherwise. I have proven you wrong. Now you want to know “what” avionics. That I do not know. Its clear you have been proved wrong. All you can do is now rant. Sources include Reuters, APP and Pakistani press.
Actually all you have done is post a lot of speculative b0ll0cks but try to pass it off as fact and you have been caught out at it rather badly.
There is NO proof that the Chinese radars are only for the initial prototypes and that there is an all western avionics fit for the later aircraft. There have been Chinese reports on the other hand, elucidating their avionics for the JF-17 for Pakistan & they obviously are a better source than dated speculation from Pakdef ( :rolleyes: ).
You have been asked to provide PROOF of any PAF attempt to successfully integrate BVR AAMs on its own with any radar. You have not done so. Talking about Chinese engineers at CAC doing their bit is not something to pat your own back with.
The PLAAF, IRIAF, IAF all have shown far greater systems integration expertise than the PAF. Another fact, which might be of interest to you as you indulge in juvenile bragging!
I orginally sought to prove that IN wont be handle the PAF without EXTENSIVE support from the IAF. You claimed that Indian Sea Harriers would take on the bulk of the PAF.
You have a problem with the English language. I said that the Indian Sea Harriers upgraded (with BVR) would be more potent than the bulk of the existing PAF fleet. Your F-7s and Mirages, dont possess any BVR capability.
Thats one big massive joke.
F-16 Block 52s with AMRAAM C5
J-10 with SD-10
JF-17s with unspecified avionics and missiles
Please dont make me laugh my guts out. First, the SHar upgrade is short term- its a done deal in the next couple of years. By the time, you’d be lucky if the JF-17s even enter anything resembling squadron service, the J-10’s likewise, and there will be only a handful of F-16’s (that if the deal is not cancelled over the neutered EW).
The PAF is going to be reliant on non BVR F-7s and Mirages for quite sometime, despite Pakdef dreams of a 100 F-16s and J-10s and JF-17s appearing overnight.
Deal with it.
Right now, even PAF F-7s and Mirages would take care of Indian Naval aviation.
That if they ever even managed to take off once the IAF got done with them.
The IAF will be needed. The only thing an IN carrier would do for the Indian Navy would present a massive morale problem if ever it was sunk.
Never mind that- I think the PNs surface fleet has extensive experience in getting sunk.
“I am sorry your ships were sunk old boy. That happens in war”.
PAF Chief to PN Chief- 1971.
Please enough about IN Sea Harriers taking on the PAF. SU-30s yes. 30 year old Sea Harriers no.
Which unless your head was stuck in the sand, you would realise are getting upgraded, hence this thread.
Which unless you were still stuck, you would realize are fairly capable systems given prior experience of updated Sea Harriers elsewhere.
Denial is not the name of a river in Egypt.
Nick_76Right. I really cant argue logically with you if you deny basic proven facts.
First you said PAF cant integrate western avionics in Chinese aircraft. I have proven this is not the case.
Reading IS not your strong point! I said the PAF has not shown the ability to integrate any BVR AAM on its own with any radar! Feel free to show otherwise!
I repeat:
Pakistan is yet to integrate a single western radar with a BVR AAM. Period. It has little to no ability in terms of designing and fielding its own Radars or EW equipment bar license assembling Chinese RWRs and Grifo radars for its earlier F-7s. These are not likely to give it any great capabilities in this field either. In its immediate neighbourhood itself, there are three AF’s with far greater achievements to their credit, so I dont think your example is particularly noteworthy or even relevant.
“Miscellaneous Systems
The F-7MG has several modern avionics upgrades. These include a Stores Management System, which is essentially a useful cockpit-pilot interface to help establish the status of stores including configuration, fusing and weapon codes etc. A voice warning system, colour video recorder, elaborate cockpit lighting and a more precise and jitter–free AOA probe are nice-to-have improvements. The colour EFIS includes two displays, one for the attitude and the other for the heading and navigation sub-systems like ADF, VOR, TACAN, ILS etc.
The PAF pilots used to advanced cockpits like the F-16 were quick to point out several ergonomic improvements and had detailed discussions with CAC design bureau. Switchology changes and relocation of several instruments led to a much improved cockpit; it has been suggested in a lighter vein that a nomenclature change to F-7PG2 might just be in order. (‘G’ incidentally stands for ‘gai’, meaning ‘improved’ in Chinese.)
ROTFLMAO…….who integrated this but CAC in China??? And of course, this will be claimed as a great victory for the PAF!
I burst my sides laughing! Gai means improved in Chinese, not Urdu! 😀
Is some integration work done by CHINA, albeit with some help on ERGONOMICS by PAF Pilots = ability to integrate SD-10 with Western radar single handedly against Chinese opposition by the PAF? :rolleyes:
Radar
The F-7MG was originally designed to have the GEC-Marconi Super Skyranger. At the time of initial PAF trials the radar was not ready. Trials were held again several months later after the prototype radar was installed. In the event the radar did not come up to PAF specifications and GEC-Marconi was not able to surmount the problems associated with the small nose cone, including antenna size and equipment air-conditioning which was insufficient.
The PAF eventually retrofitted their F-7Ps and F-7PGs with the FIAR Grifo-7. To say that miniaturisation technology is at its best in this marvellous Italian radar would be an understatement. An excellent pulse Doppler radar with respectable ranges and a medium order azimuth and elevation scan, the system is married to the all-aspect AIM-9L Sidewinder, making it a lethal combination.”
LOL, yes Pakdef may claim that this miniature set with only close combat modes and no BVR ability ( :rolleyes: ) is a marvellous achievement, etc etc, and how wonderfully miniaturised it is ( 😀 )….BUT…hyperbole apart, anyone & his dawg knows that a FIAR team in Pakistan did the job, and FIAR also set up an assembly plant in Pakistan …so once again, was this job a Pakistani achievement or a Fiar one? What did Pakistan do? Which BVR AAM did Pakistanis in Italy integrate with the F-7?
Aw wait, nothing on Pakdef to cut and paste? Aw shucks! 😀
AVIONICS: Expected to be of domestic and/or Russian origin for Chinese squadrons and Western type for Pakistan Air Force. FIAR Grifo S7 pulse Doppler multirole radar will be most likely selected for Pakistani version. Other avionics will be Pakistani made and/or from SAGEM. A cockpit layout shown by TECNA Corporation which is working in close association with the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex to establish a full Systems integration capability at Kamra shows 3 large multi-function colour displays, an Up Front Control Panel and a smart Head-Up Display (HUD). The Pakistani version will also feature a HMS. In the second half of 2005 prototype #4 with the complete avionics package is expected to undergo extensive flight testing for qualification of the avionics arid weapons. Ultimately it is expected that the aircraft would be fully certified in the year 2006. ”
More old stuff from Pakdef. Maybe, expected, could be, and you cite this as proof? :rolleyes:
From App.com.pk today.
Pak Air Force to receive first batch of JF-17 thunder aircraft next year
Chengdu, China, May 10 (APP): The Pakistan Air Force will receive the delivery of first batch of JF-17 thunder aircraft sometime next year, Chief of the Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed said.
Talking to APP here Wednesday after the success of first maiden operational test flight of PT-4 aircraft, he said the Air Force plans to induct more than 100 Fighters (JF-17) Thunders, jointly produced by China’s Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex, Kamra.
Lauding the efficient performance of the prototype-4 aircraft, he said it will be equipped will ‘state-of-the-art’ avionics, radar and weapons integration systems. Small batch production of the single-seat, single-engine JF-17, will begin in China next month.
Pakistan and China had been negotiating with different companies inviting them to buy the avionics package for the JF-17 aircraft. It would be economic model. The Air Chief said there is no aircraft in the world which has such good value for money.
The exact price cannot be determined at this stage, but he said he was sure the aircraft will be almost nearly half of the price of any other fighter aircraft. And capability-wise, it would be better than some of the most modern aircraft in the world.
Answering a question, he said, ” We are confident that many Air Forces in the world will prefer to buy it, when it will go on mass production.”
About PT-4 combat aircraft, he said the project is a important milestone in development of aircraft industry in the two countries. It carried the new and modified airframe. Minor changes we might have to do after testing the aircraft, he said adding “ Now we have final shape of JF-17 (thunder) and it is hoped that this particular aircraft will get into production.”
Commenting on the depth of Sino-Pak relationship, he said it proved time-tested over the years in various sectors, including the Defence production sector. “ These relationships are based on mutual trust, faith and friendship. JF-17 programme has provided a big incentive to this relationship.
He hoped that collaboration between the two countries enjoy would give more strength to their aviation industry. “ We are discussing some other projects with our Chinese counterparts.” The success of the JF-17 thunder joint programme will usher a new era of strategic partnership between the two friendly countries in the aviation sector. He termed the success of the PT-4 maiden flight a big achievement in the aviation history in the recent years.
He noted that trial flight has laid a solid foundation of further cooperation between the two countries to meet future challenges
Nice blah di blah but lets get to the relevant PART:
[b]Pakistan and China had been negotiating with different companies inviting them to buy the avionics package for the JF-17 aircraft. It would be economic model. The Air Chief said there is no aircraft in the world which has such good value for money.
In other words, all it says is that Pak & China are asking other countries to buy the cheap JF-17 and China seems to be deeply involved.
This, in effect, is against your arguements. :rolleyes:
By Mayed Ali
LAHORE: Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmud Ahmed will attend the formal first operational flight ceremony of the JF-17 (Thunder) fighter aircraft, a joint venture of Pakistan and China, at Chengdu on May 10.
The air chief marshal will witness the first aircraft (prototype 4 or P4) taking off from the People’s Liberation Army Air Force airbase in Chengdu. He will be heading a 10-member delegation of the Pakistan Air Force to see the first-ever Pakistan-China joint production lifting off. With this take-off, the aircraft will enter into formal production at Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) in Sichuan. The CAC is the second largest aircraft industry in China. The Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC), Kamra will start the production of the aircraft in June 2007.
Pakistan is expected to get the first batch of four JF-17s Thunder (Chinese FC-1) in the first quarter of the next year (in March probably). The CAC-PAC joint venture has an accumulated cost tag of $500 million, while the aircraft will have a price tag of $15-20 million, depending on the specifications. Pakistan and China have shared the cost on the project equally.
Once developed and fully operational, the JF-17 might find potential markets in the third world countries. Egypt, Burma, Bangladesh, Zimbabwe and Nigeria are closely watching the evolution of the aircraft.
The Thunder is a handy aircraft, a perfect alternative for sophisticated platforms at an affordable price. It has a top speed of 1.6 mach at low altitudes. It has a Russian RD-93 engine. Having a good weight-power equation, this light-weight aircraft will have a great manoeuvrability. It can attain a ceiling of 16,500 metres, and has a ferry range of 3000 kilometres. The aircraft has seven standard pylons (hardpoints, including four under the wings, two on the wing-tips and one under the fuselage), enabling the platform to carry multiple weaponry for air-to-air and air-to-ground missions. It can carry a maximum weapon payload of 3,800 kilograms. This multi-role JF-17 can operate in all weathers, day and night and is fitted with two coloured multi-function displays (MFDs) and a head-up display (HUD), besides having the provision of helmet mounted display.
As for its avionics, the aircraft is fitted with Italian Grifo S-7 fir-control radar system. The PAF is already using the older versions of this system in its existing fleet of Mirage 111s, F-7Ps and F-16s. The aircraft will use the Chinese SD-10 BVR (Beyond Visual Range) medium-range missiles besides short-range air-to-air armaments. Though the exact range of the missiles has not yet been made public, it is expected the system (the radar and the integrated missile) will enhance the PAF’s existing potential from around 60 kilometres to around 100 kilometres. The aircraft will be able to carry guided bombs (including laser guided bombs) by virtue of the Infra-red Navigation System and Global Position System (INS/GPS) installed on the platform. It’s dual digitally controlled fly-by-wire (FBW) system will enhance its control and firing capability. The prototype to be flown on May 10 has been modified with work done on its air-intakes, strake and vertical fins, besides modifications in the fuselage.
Once again, an OLD SOURCE and clearly outdated
LAHORE: Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmud Ahmed will attend the formal first operational flight ceremony of the JF-17 (Thunder) fighter aircraft, a joint venture of Pakistan and China, at Chengdu on May 10.
As the pictures clearly show, the JF-17 has a Chinese radar! :p
Try the PAF thread, old bean! 😀
ISLAMABAD – The Pakistan Air Force is expecting the delivery of its first multi-role combat aircraft modelled on China’s FC-1 Xiaolong in early 2007, a spokesman said on Monday.
The Air Force plans to induct more than 100 Joint Fighter-17 (JF-17) Thunders, jointly produced by China’s Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex, to replace a fleet of ageing Mirage fighters.
“The programme is on schedule and the fourth prototype would be tested by the end of April,” Air Commodore Sarfraz Ahmed Khan said. The flight will be used to test the aircraft’s avionics and weapons integration.
Small batch production of the single-seat, single-engine JF-17, will begin in China in June and the aircraft would be delivered to Pakistan in early 2007, Khan said.
Serial production of the aircraft would start at the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex in Kamra by June 2007, with aim of supplying both the Pakistan Air Force and export markets.
Pakistan and China had been negotiating with different companies to buy the avionics package for the JF-17 aircraft, which at $12 million apiece is half the cost of an F-16.
BAE Systems Plc BA.L was one option being considered for sourcing the avionics, according to defence and diplomatic sources.
(Reuters) 10 April 2006
More fluff and nonsense. Does this mention WHAT is being negotiated from BAE systems? No. It could be anything from a radaltimeter to a spitoon for the pilot. But wait, this is some great proof.
Yes, IAF will be needed to counter PAF Falcon 20s, Erieyes and P-3Cs. You have proved my point. Indian Naval aviation will be insufficient to take on PAF Southern Command.
Dont dislocate your shoulder while twisting to pat your own back!
If you werent so jumping around with premature excitement, I had mentioned the IAF a long time back.
Of course, the IAF would be involved. There is such a thing as overkill. :p
I have given my sources. Now you can put up or shut up.
Actually showing the glaring holes in your cut and paste “lawgic” is far too amusing..
Wake us up when you actually make sense, instead of going on like a broken record about the wonderful PAF and its integration genius with Chinese planes, all on account of some sidewinders and I dunno…what Martin Baker seats? 😀
Heck, the Iraqi AF had done more with its planes if “bragging rights” is all what you’re about! 😎
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