IAF could assist in anti-terror operations

By Indo Asian News Service

New Delhi, Nov 24 (IANS) Perhaps for the first time, the Indian Air Force (IAF) could assist the security forces in anti-terrorist operations at the nation’s borders. But the IAF will not use its aircraft and weapons against Maoists and other ultras operating within the country, a senior officer said Friday.

The IAF is also increasingly focusing on precision guided weapons as part of its medium and long term plans to achieve a 24×7 battle capability, Air Commodore Ravi Burli, who heads fighter operations at the IAF’s premier Western Air Command (WAC), said at a media interaction here.

‘We are readying ourselves for asymmetrical warfare of the future across the spectrum of conflict ranging from low intensity warfare on the borders to counter terrorism,’ Burli explained, speaking ahead of the annual WAC station commanders’ conference.

Commanding officers of the 18 air bases of the WAC will be attending the four day conference Nov 27-Dec 1.

‘The conference gives an opportunity to the field commanders to interact with senior WAC officers and to familiarise themselves with the future plans and strategies of the IAF,’ explained WAC commander-in-Chief Air Marshal A.K. Singh.

Speaking about the IAF’s efforts in the war against terror, Burali said the force was ‘developing the capability of the security agencies to coordinate activities’ in areas prone to terrorist activities.

This would be done through an array of measures including the use of unnamed aerial vehicles (UAVs) and satellite imagery, the officer explained.

One UAV has already been placed at the disposal of the Chhattisgarh government to counter Maoist activities in the state.

‘We have to take a holistic approach to anti-national activities. In the war against terror, we have to ensure that all the assets of the state are put to best use,’ Burali maintained.

He replied in the negative when asked whether the IAF would go into operation against Maoists and other terror groups operating in India, saying it would never use its firepower against Indian citizens, no matter how misguided they were.

At the same time, he left open the question of whether the IAF would act against foreign guerrillas operating in states like Jammu and Kashmir.

As for precision-guided munitions (PGMs), the IAF had first used a modified version of these with telling effect during the 1999 Kargil operations against Pakistani intruders in the Kargil region of Jammu and Kashmir. Their effectiveness had spurred the IAF to concentrate on this weapon, Burali stated.

‘What we are aiming at is the Suppression of Enemy Air Defences (SEAD) and Destruction of Enemy Air Defences (DEAD),’ he added.

Unlike conventional bombs that virtually have to be ‘nursed’ to their targets, a combat jet armed with a PGM can fire its missile at a target and then take evasive action even as the weapon continues toward its target. This ensures not only greater accuracy but also reduces the risk to the aircraft from ground and air fire.

During the Kargil operations, the IAF had drooped 2,000-pounder bombs that were fitted with an Israeli guidance and stabilising system. These have now been further refined.

‘During war, there is often need to target urban centres but there is also need to guard against collateral damage. That’s where the PGMs come extremely handy,’ Burali explained.

http://www.dailyindia.com/show/85428.php/IAF-could-assist-in-anti-terror-operations

I am a bit confused about your plan for LCA.
“IOC planned for 2008”, Planned to start or Planned to finish?

Finish. It takes two years more for FOC, if all goes well. Which is why I added two years more, ie 2012 for a more conservative timeline.

Anyway, is my following understanding correct:

Now – End of 2007: PV3, 4, 5 plus 8 LSPs = 11 LCAs to finish all flight testings
2008-2010: First batch of 20 LCAs
2010-2012: Second batch of 20 LCAs.

That would be correct, only that I would put all 11 LCAs plus test flight completion, at 2008.

Thanks. Some chinese forumers are asking about latest progress on LCA, so I just want to get the latest timelines correct.

No problems. The above does not include the Naval LCAs though, which would add to the orders.

SP Tyagi:The contract for Tejas (LCA) aircraft has been signed on 31 March 2006 for a quantity of 20 aircraft in the IOC configuration. By the end of the 11th Plan, one squadron of LCA would be in operational service in the IAF. An additional two squadron are expected to be in operational service by the end of the 12th Plan period.

With the likely fructification of the M-MRCA in the middle of the 11th Plan period, the effect of depletion would have been arrested, especially since there is a parallel programme to augment the force multipliers such as the FRA, AWACS and UAVs to enhance the flexibility of the combat force. Force multipliers also add substantially to the effectiveness of the force.

———–
So by 2017 IAF will having 3 squadron of LCA or about 60 aircraft

The plan has been revised; the IAF wants 100 aircraft to be in IAF service by 2017. Note, that per the timeline I put up, I had 48 aircraft by 2012, now at a production rate of 14/ year, that would give me 118 by 2017. But even so, I stuck to the lower figure. For two reasons, one it has been reported as such, second, the conservative figure is a more likely one considering some last moment IAF equipment fits or the like requiring equipment changes. It also accounts for some production going towards Naval requirements, the IN is planning for upto 20-40 LCA.

Nonsense. If that was the case the PLAN SSK surfaces IN FRONT of the US CVSG. 10k yards astern is hardly firing position for torpedoes!. Without a pretty high-end HWT aboard theres a good chance a surface unit could simply outrun a stern-chasing torp from that range. If the SSK was trying to transmit the message you state then someone in the PLAN command chain really IS a muppet!.

Well scope shots usually do for most. The most likely explanation is probably some variation of the ‘Sukhoi Effect’ when Kitty was buzzed by those two Russian jets. That got media attention – a submarine surfacing, dramatically, just off a US carrier would be anticipated to do at least as well dont you think?. As to the captain being ordered to do it – for his sake I sincerely hope he was and kept a very clear message log of the receipt of that order because it wasnt very smart!.

Hmmm yes my vote would definitely be somewhere close to the ‘brainless moron’ end of the spectrum here for someone in this ships extended chain of command!. I dont care what anyone says about sending messages I’m afraid a combat crew trains for war. That is gaining position by stealth, firing sufficient weapons to complete your mission goals and clearing the datum through stealth to go home, thank whatever protected you that time out and prepare to go again. Doing anything else – unless you have a massive technical overmatch on your opponent – is stupidity of the highest magnitude!.

Anyone thought that the sub could have had an issue with its batteries and surfaced to snorkel?

The reports turned out to be false unless China, as always, are phishing for information.

Right. You said exactly the opposite ages ago, but never mind.

Very amusing. If an item is sold to China, its default that China got access to it and China gets it. If an item is not available despite public reports of Chinese interest and the like, it was never around/ china was just phishing etc.

That was cleared both by Janes and KANWA, the latter has good connections with the Russians. Certainly the phase array wasn’t an issue, since Phazotron did offer the Kopyo-F for the FC-1, not to satisfy the PAF requirement for it, but the PLAAF side of the bargain.

The companies can offer anything. They run up into a brick wall thereafter. Ask someone from Phaza about their reaction to the Pero issue.

And it would upset you, but it is a real fact of life that the Russians now ignore so called restrictions so long they don’t involve strategic weapons.

Keep believing that.

And what happened to them now? In the end, its more talk and myth than real action.

The real action so far, demonstrates exactly what I have said.

Somehow the money syndrome eclipses it greatly.

Nope.

You may be a friendly and non threatening nation to Russia, but those two adjectives are not going to feed the Russian engineer and his family.

Yes, which is why the orgs dont like the Govt policy.

Except now they know the Chinese don’t want the older stuff anymore. But then, the Chinese also don’t want the latest stuff the Russians are selling only half baked.

True. But what the Chinese (or for that matter even the Indians) want, they dont necessarily get.

The Russians are pulling all stops because they are in bad need of developmental money.

Not really. The orgs have been pushing for it. They have run up against Govt resistance. As I said, please do contact someone in the field- perhaps you can try them at Zhuhai, and chat them up.

Lol you are so funny. And you actually want me to believe you? When they talk to you, they will only say things that is nice for you to hear, and you must be either an idiot or downright naive to believe them. Actions speak louder than words…remember that always because you of all people, seem to consistently forget that the most.

Like I said you cant hold a civilized conversation when it comes to anything that goes against your own preconceived notions of Chinese pride. Pretty pathetic really. All the name calling wont change that.

I would rather take the words of any Russian developer with years in the field, over yours. After all, wasnt it on this very forum that you tried to even correct PiBu?

Its all right there in black and white. Klimov’s TVC nozzle? Guess who its being sold to. Salyut has upgraded their engine and guess to whom it is being sold to. Phazotron and NIIP are actively marketing their phase radars in China, especially they know the gap in phase arrays is rapidly closing given the Chinese advances in air defense and early warning phase arrays such as in the 052C and the KJ AWACS.

*Yawn*. Believe what you must. Come back and talk after the Irbis is in PLAAF service.

I know it hurts you to believe, but the facts are the facts.

Sure, keep thinking that. China is the greatest, China is the greatest etc.

Why do I even bother trying to discuss anything with the likes of you.

International air power article? What kind of source is that? lol, bring an actual authentic Chinese article

Authentic Chinese article. Hmmm. Like the kind you quote?
Su-27/30 Family: ‘Flanker’ In The 21st Century” by Thomas Andrews, INTERNATIONAL AIR POWER REVIEW, Spring 2003, is a far more reputable source than most junk one finds on bbs.

if you say so.

Sure.

are Indians on this board really this insecure? If the Russians are willing to sell backfires and bears to China, what do you think makes Irbis so special? Actually, since you mentionned Salyut, you might have noticed Salyut have sold their best engines to China. Personally, if they get this radar upgrade, then great. If they don’t, no big deal. The main air superiority fighter in plaaf is J-10 anyhow. The mkks should concentrate on what they do the best, which is ground attack.

Please dont be stupid. Your excitable nature apart, do think it through. It has nothing to do with Indians or Pakistanis or Martians. It is plain common sense. If India and Russia shared a border, it would also be treated similarly. Russian firms may be willing to sell, but lets see if china ever gets them. cheers.

Its from Farce. Enough said.

Exactly.

BARS is the overweight Radar even Russian Airforce doesn’t equip if my memory serves correctly. Of course when they promoted sales then, they could put up the advertising words like” a Radar so advanced that even our own force yet to equip”, so, you can see who indeed hooked by the beautiful words.

Whatever floats your delusional boat. If the PLAAF had the Bars you would be saying the reverse. :rolleyes:
The Russian AF radars- heck, whatever they have sold for the past decade and are still selling abroad is mostly better than what they have purchased. They are concentrating on their strategic forces instead, their choice to make. Perhaps they will only do a MLU with AESA when it comes.
The Irbis wont be much lighter than the Bars either btw, if at all it is. Lighter antenna but two servos for rotation instead of one. Geez, thats too bad aint it?

According to Jane’s, China has been offered the Irbis-E radar as an upgrade to their Su-30 fleet. According to the article China is considering either purchasing the radar or going all out and grabbing the new Su-35.

There were many reports of the Bars being available to the PLAAF too, ultimately nothing came of them. I daresay the same will happen with the Irbis. NIIP and Phazatron couldnt care a damn as to what they sell to China as long as the money flows in, the Russian Govt is much more restrictive and often intervenes to prevent the latest stuff from going to China.