Tragedy. But they will rebuild it better than it ever was.

The more I see the J-20 the more it reminds me of several other aircraft. It has a tail reminiscent of a McDonnell-Douglas design, the canards of the Rafale, the nose of the Raptor, the engine size of the Foxhound, the intake bumps of the JF-17, and the wing form of the J-10. It’s a ‘Frankenjet’.

I believe the Viggen would have been competing with F-16’s. No way they were less expensive to operate. And they were competing against the likes of MiG-23, MiG-29, Su-17, etc. Caught between two ideologies and no market space save for maybe independents and neutral countries. South Africa would have been interesting, but they were in turmoil.

Why are people stating such low figures for the F-4’s turbojets? The Viggen didn’t always have as much power as is being stated so why compare early F-4 figures to mature Viggen figures? If you compare late F-4 to late Viggen or early Viggen to F-4’s of it’s era then it’s a much bigger gap.

And the Viggen operationally did not use two of it’s pylons because they caused too much stress on the wings. So in reality it’s a much wider gap between the F-4 and Viggen when it comes to payload. And I’m not seeing where a 55-ish foot long Viggen is only 17% shorter than a 70-ish foot long F-4.

The Viggen had a turbofan which gave it more relative power in a low level flight profile. The F-4’s turbojets were more optimal for flight at higher altitudes. We aren’t comparing Viggen to more modern fighters, we are comparing it to the F-4 which makes the difference significant.

And I didn’t mention the Mirage III as the one better for comparison. I said Viggen was more like the MiG-23. And it is.

The Viggen was significantly smaller than a Phantom, but not ‘compact’, when compared to its single-seat predecessors & contemporaries. It’s markedly bigger & heavier than Mirage III or F1, Draken, Jaguar, etc. It’s intermediate between them & a Phantom.

I don’t believe the Mirage (III or F1) was much shorter than the Viggen. Sure it was bigger and heavier. But it didn’t take up much more real estate in comparison to the Mirages. The F-4 took up significantly more room while on the ground.

whats the cheapest weapon (besides the gun) that the Rafale uses ?

Mk82