That’s the weekend of my 30th. If you can get Mr Agar to fire up the Mossie, I’ll definitely be there! 😎

So the loan has zero impact on the manufacturing capability.
Thus the loan has nothing to do with the closure of the UK or Belgium plants.
Thanks for making that clear. 🙂

Ford are closing a UK plant, the EU are giving them our money to improve a plant in a non EU country, that will supply the UK with vans.

Nothing illegal about it, but it’s indecent.

Perhaps you think theres nothing wrong with that? I’m sure you’d find that the Ford UK employees, whos tax money is funding this, may see things differently.

Why didn’t you see fit to also post the following?
Note the piece i have highlighted.

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getAllAnswers.do?reference=E-2012-011072&language=EN

“The EIB is strongly committed to supporting growth and jobs in the EU through long-term, sustainable and economically sound investment in infrastructure, private sector companies and small businesses. It also operates outside the EU in line with the EU’s external policies, in support of long-term investment in order to foster local economic development.

In particular, the investment in the Ford Otosan production line will not result in a capacity increase but aims at upgrading technology and accelerating the promoter’s compliance with forthcoming EU legislation on CO2 emissions. The EIB loan is carried out at the own risk of the Bank and does not benefit from an EU budget guarantee.”

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getAllAnswers.do?reference=P-2012-010100&language=EN

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getAllAnswers.do?reference=E-2012-010134&language=EN

Charlie, again here are the facts that support my view, those holding an opposing view chose to only post a segment of the facts that suited their agenda…

They have a surplus of production capability, so they don’t need any additional capacity. The EU are still loaning the money as an incentive for EU membership, and production is moving away from the UK and Belgium.

That doesn’t sound like great EU member support to me. Just EU politicians looking for revenue streams for themselves and their organisation.

“Ford has announced its intention to close its last UK assembly plant, in Swaythling, Southampton, with the loss of 1 400 jobs. Production of Ford’s Transit Van will switch from Swaythling to Turkey, having been based in Southampton — the company’s last UK vehicle assembly plant — for 40*years.

It has emerged that the European Investment Bank (EIB) has loaned Ford GBP*80*million to invest in its Turkish plant, as part of its moves to prepare the country’s economy for possible European Union membership.

Has the Commission considered that certain EIB loans may have a negative impact on firms registered within the*EU, especially where the EIB’s very favourable loans could offer an unfair advantage to non-EU firms?”

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?type=WQ&reference=E-2012-011072&language=EN

.

Pray tell how that is the EU shafting the UK??? Perhaps you think the EU should step in the “nationalise” Transit production to keep the UK and Belgium factories open? :rolleyes:

The EU is giving Turkey the money to do it! UK taxpayer money! You’d think they’d show a bit more loyalty, considering we’re a contributor.

Taking this topic as an example i will completely accept that the EU is not the finished article.
Will any of the more than less than enthusiastic with regard to the EU conceed the UK has benefited in any way from membership?
The facts are plain that the UK has; farmers receive subsidies and the UK gets a hefty rebate as just two examples. However to read some of the opinions and supposed facts presented here the UK has never ever received a penny from the EU.
The trade discussion is a case in point, the anti EU guys all state that the EU needs the UK more than vice versa without any concession that as i believe i have illustrated things may not be as simple as that.
Of course the UK exiting the EU will have an impact on EU exports but the internal market within mainland Europe according to the graphs presented by the anti EU guys themselves is somewhat under developed. The UK potentially will have to import the same goods as it currently does from Europe from much further afield which comes at a cost.
Despite j_jza80’s attmepts to disguise this fact with some reference to UK exports it is a fact!

We do not benefit from the agriculture policy at all! Agriculture and fisheries have had a negative impact on us, and are ridiculously in favour of the French.

As a NET contributor to the EU, we give them more than we receive. I don’t see how that benefits us? Especially when they then assist a non EU country in establishing industries that take jobs from the UK!

Labour handed away our “hefty” rebate.

Perhaps less reliance on imports from our European neighbours would kick start UK industry? We’re quite an innovative nation when required 🙂

Hhmm.
Actually i’m not accepting you making a comment that i believe to be inaccurate and can demonstrate why so and then being told that “it’s off topic” thus apparently immune to challenge.
Sadly typical behaviour of those wishing to “win” an argument rather than engage in a debate.

Your second sentance is hyperbole of the highest order.
Why introduce socialist? Could you possibly be attempting to use scare tactics? 🙂
As for “giving away” what real influence do you think the UK populance have on the current level of governance? Especially having choosen to maintain first past the post! If ukip get into power it will be a disaster for the UK, have you seen farages expense claims as an mep?
To name a few benefits of a Federal Europe; collective influence and power beyond any of the nation states alone, security, harmonisation of standards driving efficiencies throughout industry, limitation of fx arbitrage which limits potential instability (clearly more a benefit of a single currency than the EU per se), human rights standards which clearly are attractive to many people around the globe.
I fully accept that the EU has a journey to travel to begin fully reaping the benefits but to condemm the project simply because it hasn’t been completed yet is short sighted in my view.

And when will this “project” be “completed”? When every nation in Europe is bankrupt?

We are quite secure enough as it is, I don’t see how being an EU member increases this? We’re already members of NATO, and have existing defence ties with France.

Our politicians should be looking out for our interests, other countries shouldn’t come into domestic matters at all. We don’t need yet another level of power.

Are we not capable of having Human rights without Europe? If my memory serves, we were the major proponent of a Human rights court?

Even Milliband has joined the Immigration band wagon, according to the crass party political broadcast i’ve just been subjected to! I think you’ll find (speculation, not fact) that over the coming months, many of UKIPs policies will be adopted by other parties.
Under UKIP, hopefully MEPs will be a thing of the past, so no more expenses there.

How long until all of the parties are offering referendums in their manifesto?

It’s wrong. This stance rather undermines your entire argument!

No, you’re trying to drag the thread off topic.

But again, all I’m seeing is negativity from you. Perhaps you would like to give the audience a few non economic reasons as to why we would benefit from giving away our governance to a federal European socialist state?