crobatoPLANAF Su-30MK2 should have Series 4, and all the spare engines recieved after that point as that should be the current production standard (and only one). Kits for J-11s recieved at that point should have this engine too. 100 engines ordered from Salut and 80 engines from UMPO should be Series 4.
FM-1 should be 13,200kg not 13,500kg. Said to be ordered for the J-10s and J-11s now.
Series 3 began exporting 2000-2001 time frame. MKKs and earlier J-11s should have this.
Last remaining 17 J-11As were finished last year. These are planes made without kits and had engines sourced seperately. That would be only using 34 of the 180 engines ordered. The rest might go to spares as production shifts to J-11Bs.
crobatoIs that J-10’s cockpit?
Standardized with FC-1’s cockpit?
It looks like the FC-1’s cockpit, but afterall it’s the same company, it says J-10 in the poster, why not just kill two birds in one stone. Given that there appears to have been an upgrade on the navigation system, might be a better way to display the results. Advantage of glass cockpit, makes it easier to electronically upgrade the aircraft by worrying less how to display the results from the new systems. If you ever decide to integrate FC-1 into PLAAF service, having a similar cockpit helps in user training, and maintenance via standardization.
crobatoso show me that contract cost for F-22 that u say is $200m per plane? u will not find that cost anywhere now in 2006.
You’re a complete joke. You are asking for sources that everyone has posted. What is the latest contract price again, 237 million?
same is Greek/Arabs. but this has nothing to do with Industrai revolution that started from Europe. that is based on some other values and culture.
do u know why i posted the link from Arabnews (official Saudi mouth Piece) where JP went to Finland and have private talk with Finish PM and there is series of reports by him for benefits Of Arabs in that site as too wake them up from deep slumber.
It started from why Finish education system the best in the world and the most competitive economy and there he was told there is something far superior accross russia and he presented the message in coded words as future of west.
Nice of you to post names of Swedish companies that makes excellent products but I have to see them invent something so fundamental. Now you’re talking of the Finnish educational system?
Arabs didnot sent him to study Chinese education. u only see things very superficially. just like in retail store. where u see made in China.
More BS from you. Firms like Microsoft, Sun, and IBM laud the quality of Chinese universities. In fact, look how Chinese coders from these universities win programming contests. A Chinese programmer was the first to hit the Red boundary in Sun’s Topcoder competition.
and it is more funny that u take PLA report as holy grail.
More funny when you take Russian report as holy grail, even when time and time again, they don’t match their words.
and what is worth of that report. like sending twice as number of athletes to Olympics compared to russia and claiming similar medals.
Really, how many athletes did they really send.
thats why i ask what is it?
Man you can’t even google it. Get off your ass.
u dont understand the word development (which means some thing new). Su-27SM/MIG-29SM is using already developed tech paid by exports. it is to get cheap PGM carriers for close air support. u can get 20 Su-27SM for price of 1 Su-34. Development is happening in some other places like strategic aviation and deploying missiles like Kh-65/KH-101/102. and further into fifth generation.
You don’t even understand what contract price, multirole and PGMs and you are lecturing me what the world development is?
The Su-27SM was paid for techs that was developed and exported with the MKK. 76 MKks were already exported before the Su-27SM was flying. And what’s the price of an Su-34, and oh and please don’t compare flyaway prices vs. contract prices. Engineers have to feed famlies you know.
And PGMs are not cheap.
no i am not side tracking things. u simply dont have understanging of things.
Talking about someone who don’t know what a PGM really is.
next generation of routers for next generation of internet extended to military communication? they have this systems developed since mid 70s. they are now fully capable of destroing moving targets with Billistic missilles with IIR seeker,digital scene matching, fully stealth and immune to ATBM due to terminal maneours.
You don’t know what a router is, really, and what a next generation router should do.
and why would they talk about Russian orders in the media. u will only hear this from exercises. Saturn alone has 80 service centers for engines working in russia. every thing does not come into media.
Let me tell you if Russia’s MiG-29s and Su-27s are as active as the ones in the IAF and PLAAF, they would be ordering gobs of engines for spares, especially, since Russia numerically has a larger fleet. If you’re not burning up engines, then you’re not putting flight hours, and that means low flight hours per pilot or the fleet is mostly mothballed, cannibalizing planes to make a fraction fly.
And that makes it even doubtful that the more maintenance extensive bombers are active.
Taiwan is only a contract manufacturing country and it is just intermediary to labor from China.
It is not South Korea which has its own research centers spread acrosss the Globe with its own brand name.
What a joke. Taiwan is number one in the freeplay fab services. Companies like TSMC are not even matched Japanese or Korean companies on how quickly they can translate a design into silicon, and yet produce chips in lower quantites and yet achieve low prices. The free play fabrication Taiwan has, shared now with Singapore and the mainland China, is the reason why greater China companies dominate fabrication of chips like graphics chips (nVidia and ATI), NICs, motherboard chips (SiS, VIA), sound chips, disk controllers, and others. Why the area dominate in motherboard and graphics card production. And now they produce massively in areas like PDAs and celphones.
IT manufacturing is not cheap labor. It is skilled labor. Much of it is manufactured by machines, then assembled.
and South Korea does not want Raytheon. they have simply more money from F-15K to Wedgtail AWACS.
Irrelevant. The fact remains Taiwan is equipped with one of the world’s best air defense network with an AEGIS like SAM system.
what this has to do with USAF officials. foreign bases depends on political relationships and money.
That’s bull also. Its also about strategic positioning. The fact remains that small fighter bombers taking off from nearer bases, can accomplish much more missions in any segment of time than bombers taking off from remote locations.
i want to know ur answer.
why not?
Where is your fantasy electromagnetic weapons from your lala land, ha? Show it.
and u want to argue with those who deployed MIG-31? and has proud aviation history as anyone else on this planet.
Who gives a rats ass. You cannot argue by Taiwan sensors, Chinese AWACS have been observed vectoring fighters since 2004. it happened. Period.
Source of those billions? HK is just financial service center like London. it has nothing to do with science.
God, you don’t even have a grasp of some international business news. Hong Kong alone has a foreign reserve of 113 billion US dollars—for a freaking city.
u said that they dont have any foreign money.
No you popoohed it as budget surplus and now it turns out to be foreign reserves.
do u think so it is open? they dont want to be assembelers of outside multinationals. they are rich enough to ignore and throw investor. they have put high taxes on Airbus/Boeing untill there factories get modernized and Boeign/Airbus still want to do business with them. this is from 2001 now it is many times bigger after Dream liner launch.
Wrong argument. Simply pointing out a few companies willing to deal with Russia does not make a general whole. Just look how much FDI China gets compared to Russia.
In every country service sector is under reported. from hair cut to eating in resturant.
Not really. In countries that maintain a strict and proper receipts system, it will be less under reported. Especially when you have large visible service companies like fast food franchises.
But many small Chinese companies, shops and small businesses do not have proper receipts. Thus it is impossible to document their revenue. The blackmarket alone can be as big as the formal economy.
i have seen pictures but there is no evidence to support that these are Multifunctional.
What an idiot. Look at the buttons on the side of each MFD. What are those, eh? The buttons are mode switches, and when you change mode, they change function.
why is experiance irrelevant in this case?
Because experience does not provide a strict time scale. The KJ-2000 may have been under development even while China was trying to acquire the Phalcon. China always does things redudantly, having backups and parallel programs running. Fact remains, the AWACS have been used in exercises and even attempted to gain signal intelligence.
china has 400 million cell for 1.3b population. russia has 200 million for 140 millon so has more.? and China own cell network outside country? and do u think what is euroset.
And the European networks valid outside of Europe? Europeans band together to create common networks because each country alone does not have resources to do it themselves. Not the case of China. And how can Russia has 200 million celphones eh? Cite me proof of that.
u check US ITC site. it is not more than $100m a year. and amount of planes China buys.
Excuse me, but your site does not say this.
why it so difficult. finance.yahoo.com and type both the companies understock pick. u will get all the answers. one is $500 stock the other is just $37.
Man, you don’t know stocks. If you;re selling 500 dollar stock, then that stock has to be redivided, so you can make more shares and sell it for 50 each. You think you know about company size and valuation from the price of their stock alone?
Give me the actual revenue figures of each companies and their assets.
ever heared of sergie burknov and his search engine technolgy sold google.
Guy was US trained.
and those multinations are lauding so many other countries. they just want to customize products for local market nothing more. it has nothing to do with basic science.
That is called applied science and technology is basically applied science. You can’t even figure out that manufacturing is a vital skillset and everything starts from the bottom.
It is not Number 1 despite Fiancial center for 1.3b Chinese. where all stateowned IPOs are coming.
Give me more fantasy if you ever think Moscow is as economically prosperous as Hong Kong.
except that they do busiess differently. they sell there intellectual power to multinationals who assembled those things in countries like China. and it is there Service economy which is not reported and thats why they have the most expensive city on Earth. New York is because of US, Tokyo because of Japan. and than How come Moscow becomes world most expensive city? u need extremely large size service sector to support this. and they have equally expensive second city Saints Petersburg.
You think high cost of living is a sign of prosperity? Usually, high cost is symptom of bad economics happening.
Here are some causes.
Lack of retail competition
Inadequete supply of goods
Too much taxes
Too much payouts to local gangs, organized crime
Inefficient business, high overhead, high operating costs
And not the least, overpopulation competiting on too small a land.
ever thought why Samsung investing in OIL refineries, oil platforms. Moscow E-government and largest cellurlar phone supplier. there are things u dont understand.
Man, just because Russians get some investment, you think its the only investment happening in the world. Check China’s FDI figures if you want to see the big picture.
thats why they have 45% world commercial satelliete luanchers and have three full size space lauching sites Baikonor, Plestek and new one French Guyana. and how come they dont have manufacturing base? (they produce millions of cars alone and the best known truck brand like Kamaz.) U cannot even make a Tank engine let alone aircraft engine.
and how u come to ther GDP figures and military spending. it is there secret.
So what? You have a space agency charging 10 million for every space tourist. Gimmicks like that show you they don’t have enough funds on their own.
and u also enrich the same multiantionals that depnds on russian engineers. so as Chinas enrich through assembling. Russia do the same with service sector.
What a joke. China is a complete economy. It has design, service, manufacturing. In fact, the whole cycle can be accomplished within its borders. Why so many multinationals invest in China is not just for the cheap skilled labor, but because you can also subcontract so many components. 60 firms alone making GaAs/GaN related products.
and where is China Oil export to make stabilization fund? they will first hook the world on uranium and later raise the price.
Lol. China has a strategic national oil reserve and its own production that includes both local and offshore production. Plus 1 trillion and over in foreign reserves. Why do you need to export to make a stabilization fund exporting oil eh?
think a little harder about this zhuk. all the time excuses.
Just more nonsense. Your replies suggest you really don’t know how things work in the real world—economics, military, technology.
crobatoIt has been reported that, according to Russian sources, China is working on a variant of the basic J-10, with 3D TVC (confirmed by the reports of purchases of the AL-31FM1 engine) and with a PESA radar (I do not know how likely this is as I do not know enough about the chinese radar industry to comment- certainly possible though). This version MIGHT have a DSI (technology seen on FC-1 04) instead of the current rather awkward looking intake arrangement. This variant may not be that far away from flying or even entering service based on the delivery schedule for the TVC engines.
There are also rumours of a twin engined version, these reports vary greatly from it just being a variant of the basic variant modified to take twin engines to it being a stealthy uber fighter. My opionion is that there is in fact two, one a basic version (intended to compete with the J-11B) and a proposed 5th gen aircraft with very little commonality with the current J-10 except for a basic design board configuration. Neither of these seem to have left the drawring board yet.
The DSI J-10 is not likely to happen at least in the short term. Too much wind tunneling may be needed to certify this. DSI interference on the canards might be more iffy, and J-10’s highly tuned aerodynamic design may not be as tolerant to changes vs. the FC-1’s. The way the J-10’s intake is designed it probably has the WS-10A in mind, and for the purposes of rushing into production quickly, it won’t make the change. Still it may be more interesting in the longer term and certainly Chengdu seems serious about DSI effects.
The direction here is, will the J-10 take the TVC AL-31FMN-1, get the advantage of using TVC, or take the WS-10A, get the advantage of domestic logistics. Or will you end up with two J-10 versions in the near term?
Super 10? (J-10G? G as in Gai)
PESA/AESA radar
AL-31FMN-1
(Perhaps the “elite” J-10s)
J-10B
MESA radar
WS-10A
(perhaps the conventional, “filler” J-10s)
J-10 two seater is now officially J-10S, not J-10B.
crobatoWho has considered more MFDs being more advanced?
More gaming options perhaps.
Just bigger on the “cool” factor.
crobatofrom where the $200m current production figure comes from?
You really don’t know anything about the arms industry do you? Contract cost tend to be double of that of the flyaway cost and more because it factors corporate profit, support, training, documentation, and other unmentionables. Planes are never bought at flyaway cost but at contract cost.
Get some education will you.
Sweden has history of innovation from Bofors, Volvo, SAAB, Scania, ABB Engg, Ericson, celsiustech. what is China history?
China has a history of inventing paper money, steel, forging, blast furnace, the compass, the crossbow, the stirrup, the rudder, ship bulkheads, multimasts on ships, gun powder, the rocket, the invention of the mine, the grenade, among other things. China has invented things that changed civilization.
8 of 10 engagements were won by Indians and it is in this form.
Documentation please. I find that funny since some of the exercises are purported to have Indians and Americans working together against another Indo-American team.
and what is credibility of this?
That’s been reported officially, and the PLA does not come out saying this unless its that obvious.
I just want to know how much u understand this thing or ur living in a past.
You don’t even know what a PGM is, do you?
Offcourse u dont know about what Ruaf and there methods that are uniquie only to them.
A laughable response. You’re the one who don’t know the RuAF. Talking about multirole, that’s what they’re doing with their Su-27SMs and MiG-29 upgrades.
how?
You are always attempting to side track things because you have a defeated argument.
Keep on topic.
surely a person who consider buying some thing from retail store as sign of scientific achievements like routers.
Lol. You don’t know how important router technology is. That’s the heart of every telecom and internet system, and for that matter, even military communications. China is the first country to implement IPV6 routers, thats the next generation of routers for the next generation of internet.
from where u get this information?
Lol. Much of the Russian fleet is in mothballs. There is hardly any new engine orders for example, when engine makers like Salut, Saturn and Klimov are reporting nothing but Indian and Chinese orders. If you’re actually using your planes, you would be ordering spares for them, especially engines.
ROC is too poor comparet to South Korea and South Korea is building next generation SAM using Russain technolgy which will be more advanced than PAC-3. and ROC does not even that one. Now just imagine at what state is Russian missile technolgy that want to sell atleast PAC-3 capability.
Bull. The ROC is an exceedingly wealthy country, with foreign reserves higher than 247 billion. That’s higher than S. Korea for only half the population, and for only a fraction of Russia’s.
The ROC built the TK-2 with Raytheon help, a 150 to 200km missile with an active seeker and AEGIS phase array technology. That’s for a missile already deployed now and for some years already, while you’re still talking of a non existant undeveloped SAM proposal.
As if these decisions are made by USAF of buying foreign allies.
Lol, you think you’re better than the USAF officials? Huh?
surely.
For a guy who brought up electromagnetic weapons, you’re surely in the bag here for fantasyland. Add to that you don’t even know what a PGM is and think you got better judgement than USAF officials.
have u ever read about Ruaf A-50 operations?
Oh, and they actually still operate them?
u dont need 360 coverage in most situations. they have already figure this thing out.
That is complete nonsense. Now you want to argue with AWACS designers and airforces who actually deployed them?
$304b in foreign reserves and approximately $88b in stablization fund.
http://www.cbr.ru/eng/pw.asp?file=engpress 70111_114653eng_res.htm
http://en.rian.ru/business/20070110/58838072.html
Stabilization fund does not count since that is a reserve used in case of economic calamity. 88 billion is actually small for a stabilization fund. China poured 200 to 300 bilion into HK to stabilize it from the 1997 economic crisis.
First you pooboohed foreign reserves, and now you pointed out that the figure comes from foreign reserves. Hypocrital.
offcourse. i am delusionsary. infact u only read about China. If Russia opens itself like China to West. the investmen will be in trillions.
Lol. Russia is open to the West like China. The only problem is, the West does not trust Russia’s government and lack of rule of law.
from where this figure comes from?
does it includes service sector as as service sector in most countries are bigger than industrial. and China had 1/5 of world population.
No. That is industrial output. That does not count service, and service sector in China is vastly undercounted.
show me offical picture not speculations.
Lol. You must be the only one in this forum who have not seen the pics badgered in this FORUM, and in other forums like secretprojects, CDF, SDF and others. I don’t need to show you stuff that everyone has known and seen already, just as I don’t need to tell you what a PGM is. Go figure it out yourself; I don’t give free education.
why? Experaince of 20 AWACS and 2 export A-50E does not count?
Bull. That experience is irrelevant since it is reported by Taiwan media that Su-30s have been vectored by Chinese AWACS since the planes appeared in 2004. It is something that has happened, just as recently, Chinese AWACS also appeared trying to scan Matsu island.
yes i dont know thats why i ask what they are developing.
You don’t know anything at all.
and they also big RD centers in India but level of RD is different. u havent understood that point.
But what do you know about the RD taking place to say what is the level of difference?
as if Russia celluar companies are any smaller. there 200 million cell phone users which is very high penetration considering the size of population and they also own networks in other countries. and Gazprom is world Largest GAS firm so what? this has nothing to do with scientific level of countries.
Lol. China’s celphone projections is still growing and some expect as high as 600 million. China Mobile is indeed the world’s biggest telecom and celphone company in the world. When you are in this kind of busines, you are already producing your own celphone designs, routers nad repeating stations.
US only buy $100m of China parts. it is like price of toilets in Boeing aircrafts.
this website of Teal group consultant. kindly look around what is happening in aerospace world.
http://www.richardaboulafia.com/
Lol. That is just one of the many deals they have. Parts from China are being supplied to Boeing and Airbus since 1994.
what? finance.yahoo.com and just put Google stock capitalization and compare to yahoo.
Where is the five times larger? Show me size of assets and revenue figures.
and by education he is not Chinese.
And so did the Russian guy who founded Google, since he was in the US since he was five.
Bill Gates will Praise India also but here the issue is something else. which u are not getting.
The point remains, that companies are lauding their Chinese RD labs.
and do u wan to compare the debt level, populaton size, natural resources, energy and above all research skills. and why do u think Moscow surpassed Tokyo as world most expensive city despite far larger area?
Really. Maybe you should find out how much office space in Hong Kong is worth?
Does not mean anything because you have an economy getting rich selling oil and minerals and not finished projects like Japan. China, South Korea and Taiwan. In other words, you got an economy more similar to Saudi Arabia. And remember, your GDP is not bigger than Mexico, which actually exports finished products to fill those numbers. Without a manufacturing base, you don’t get better income distribution to the lower classes because money via resources is a matter of owning resources and you don’t use the output of labor. And you still have an extremely large sized military feeding on a budget is like what, 10 to 20 billion US?
and that $800b is not in addition. it is included in $1 trillion. u dont have Oil stablizaiton fund.
Lol. China’s reserves is over a trillion and counting, and every few months, you add another 50 billion to it.
What makes you think that China does not have not an oil stabilization fund huh? Not to mention it has its own oil reserves and yes, its own oil resources. Not to mention that China still sits upon the largest coal and shale rock reserves in the world, which is the basis for synthetic fuel.
more confustion. Zhuk-8 was done by 2000. the point who initiated this project and for what purpose and China does not have weopons at that time for exploiting that radar
The F-8IIM was demoed in Zhuhai in 1998.
crobato-M stands for a modification where the processing bandwidth is doubled.
-E for export
-F PESA
-A AESA
-S for Sukhoi variant
So theoritically, Zhuk-MSAE (unannounced) should be Zhuk for Sukhoi, AESA, for export.
Some Export variants.
Zhemchug (proposed for J-10, lightened to 180kg).
Zhuk-10PD (proposed for J-10)
Zhuk-8II (proposed for F-8IIM, fitted on two prototypes at least)
crobatoHere are the specs this time of the J-10 as AFM reported. Thanks to Dylan in the CDF.
Feb issue of Air Forces Monthly features the J-10 official launch. An article by Dr Riccardo Nicolli titled “One Fighter or Two?” has a chart of modern fighters including the J-10. The stats given:
Span: 9.7m
Length: 15.5m
Wing area: 39 sq metres
Powerplant: one 123kN
Weight empty: 8300kg
Max TO weight: 18000kg
Weight A-to-A cbt: 13200kg
Max Speed at high level: Mach 2.2
Max Speed at S/L: Mach 1.2
Load factor: +9/-3G
Internal fuel: 4500kg
Hardpoints: 11
Missile load MRAAM: 4?
Missile load SRAAM: 4?
crobatoDamn missed that one before. Here is a picture of a J-10 cockpit mock-up on an airshow. Found it in another forum, source unknown:
As you can see 3 monochrome MFDs and a couple of analogue gauges. Looks less advanced than the JF-17 cockpit at all.
Design was obviously frozen much earlier than the JF-17s. Of course, CAC can put such a cockpit on later batch of J-10s, should there be any need for it or if the PLAAF wants it and pays for it.
crobatowhen it enters production than it is fly way price period. same like $44b for 442 F-18E. F-22 is in production and only that cost matters now. and what about longer range due supercrusie of F-22?(fuel savings, greater area coverage) where is surper crusie of F-35?
Maybe you don’t know but there are other costs besides flyaway costs, and that’s why the F-22 total package is over 200 million.
Gripen is indigenous to the extent where Swedish content is involved. Toyota is old firm.
Double standards. The engine is GE right? Didn’t it have contributions via BAE?
most of engagement were won by IAF. and it was exercise between two airforces not some in house play.
Give me some actual stats like kill ratios.
PLAAF and data give me a break.
I will give you a kill ratio from one exercise: 5,0.
seriously i want to know the meaning of PGM.
If you don’t even know this terminology, you don’t have any business here.
and how do u know about Backfires. capability. it is supposed to be a secret just like LPI radar of Su-34.
And what do you know about ground search and targeting? Backfires as strategic bombers are not meant for loiter, search, target and destroy, the cycle done entirely and autonomously.
Irak/Serbia/Afghanistan surrendered when didnot have the means to respond. so US could carry almost 78 days of bombing and put economic squeeze.
Irrelevant.
surely a fantasy. it can only comes from
Speaking of someone talking about electromagnetic weapons.
and Russian bombers and weopons exercise against airdefence network that Taiwan can only dream of.
Which ones? The ones Russia mothballs?
You have no idea of the ROC’s AD capabilities.
I have idea but there other ways instead of building and maintaining airbases and giving handouts to allies.
As if you know better than the USAF decision makers.
offcourse thats a fantasy thats why they are now building 500km followup with 40km height destruction and MIG-31 was never allowed to export despite offers.
More fantasy from you.
and u can build and maintain many more than few AWACS and go into action much faster and can be refuelled farther.
Shows your ignorance. Can the MiG31 loiter in long periods like the AWACs? Does it have all 360 degree coverage radar? How much bigger the radar is compared to a MiG-31. The AWACS can also carry much more equipment and crews to man them.
I am looking budge surplus not foreign reserves and stabilization fund that is separate ($380b) now. i can clearly see which country can afford and maintain bigger airforce not to mention extremly subsidize fuel. (just think about revenue income from 490 IL-76 with 240 with airforce. each bomber pilot gets 100 hrs)
Show me where you got the 380 billion. The figure you’re quoting is budget revenue.
If you think Russia has a bigger surplus than China, you must be even more delusionary.
except that u have to import energy/industrial raw material and support much bigger population.
And manufacture for 33% of the total world output too. Gunning now for 40%.
J-10 does not have glass cockpit from that video and look at smoke from ealry 80s era missiles. It takes mimimun five years of exeperiance to fully expliot AWACS not even a group.and u only make it fly in 2004. China does not have anything of its own. u bought even the laser tech from russia in 1999 that now u prouldy display.
J-10 has 3 MFDs, and in addition, the two seater has 3 to 4 more MFDs on the back.
Don’t give me your experience with AWACS. China’s AWACS have been reported vectoring Su-30s since 2004.
It seems u havent understood Ruaf. why would they need multirole fighter?
And why are they developing ones for their own? EH? You don’t even know the RuAF, do you?
u are living in post industrial era. have u ever heard about Knowledge based economy. Design centers?Research institutes? what would firms like Samsung(now the second biggest semiconductor), Intel , Motorola and Nokia do with out Russia.
All of them have big RD centers in China.
Biggest celphone and telecom company now in the world is China Mobile in terms of capitalization and user base. Lenovo is the 3rd largest PC maker, and it has successfully revived the Thinkpad line.
why do u think PW bought a stake in PermMotors?, Snecma with Saturn (VolgaAero),Alenia in Sukhoi , EADS in Irkut, and Boeing in everything. and public appeal for help from OAK for A350 from Airbus on dec 8.
Why do you think GE has a partnership with Shenyang Liming? Airbus and Boeing are subcontracting composite airframe components with Chengdu and Shenyang. The US is starting to import cars made in China, and several companies are using parts manufactured from there.
Google is 5 times bigger than yahoo.
show me.
he was Taiwanese (A country who owe its existence, education and wealth directly to US) and went to US as a child unlike a person born in communist state.
By language, by genes, by cultural and ancestral heritage, he is still Chinese.
excuse me on what planet are u living? u are looking at retail level IT. Asian has just made the cost lower. It has zero contribution as far as science goes. i am not even putting alot of stuff.
You are the one living in nana land. Motorola and Microsoft lauded the contributions of their China RD units, the latter by Bill Gates himself. IBM, HP, Dell, all have RD units in China.
u dont have surplus. u have reserves and that reserves are necessity not a asset as u have to fund the buyer for ur cheap products.
Lol, over 1 trillion foreign reserves are gathered from trade surplus that averages more than 150 billion yearly. In addition, China holds 800 billion worth of treasury bonds, Do you like to compare the relative sizes of economies with China like GDP, trade surplus, capitalization, savings rate, eh?
except that in mid 90s there was hardly a fighter platform for airlaunched C802. and where is ur theory of Iran went now? (dustbin of history)
all the time making excuses
Lol. The Iran interest was in the early 2000s.
crobatoDoes it mean anything that he has a J-10 patch on his arm?
Nothing really. Just that he may be on loan from the 3rd Division.
crobatoAnother J11B cockpit view
The guy is wearing the new 3rd Division jacket, so I guess that’s where he came from. Note the J-10 logo.
crobatoLow speed controlability does not automatically mean good manoeuvrability. Have you ever seen one live? F-18 is a nice plane, but compared to Gripen or Viper she’s sluggish and lazy like hell, everything takes her soooooo long.. More a Cadillac than a sports car, you almost get the impression the aircraft is bored to death being in the air.
That’s nonsense. Low speed controllability is every bit directly vital to good maneuverbility and then some, The tighter you turn, the slower a plane gets but faster you get around a turn. And the F-18 can point its nose in high AoA just about with everyone else. And perhaps better. Maybe you should ask the opinions of the RMAF, who has both F-18s and MiG-29s in their inventory, and in wargames, they don’t try to mix up their MiG-29s with against their F-18s. The Viper is definitely a faster plane than the Hornet, but the Hornet will turn inside it. Personally I have a hard time seeing the Gripen being fast, its a plane with a rather small engine.
crobatohow do figure that out. if they drop $276B F-35. they can surely afford 3000 F-22. just look at Fly away price. F-15E came very late in coldwar.
You must be an idiot to keep using flyaway prices. You’re not paying flyaway prices, you’re paying contract costs. You cannot afford 3000 F-22s in contract cost, not to mention their maintenance.
I surely know what . Even MIG-21 bison has won against F-15. ur thinking does not matter nor is anything from china official mouth piece that is calling ARJ21 indigenous (cabin influenced by DC-9 with old MD-90 toolin) because u are observeing an Airforce which works on obsolete doctorine.
So I guess the Gripen is not indigenous, since it uses GE engine, huh? So a plane is not indigenous because it is influenced by foreign design? Lexus not indigenous because they are influenced by BMW and Mercedes Benz, huh?
Winning once in a while and winning just about every time the planes meet are two different things. The Bison does not have a consistent superiority over the F-15. Once in a while even F-5E Aggressors manage to “shoot” an F-15 down but its not consistant, and the Aggressors often get “shot” down as well.
What I like to know about is the details of the wargames but no way the PLAAF would ever reveal that. In any case they appeared to have occured since the summer of 2003 until today, and there is enough data for the PLAAF to act on.
from where u got this information?.
they havent even used latest Su-34 in exercises. all exericises are done with Tu-22 precision bombing. and what is meant by latest PGMs?
If you don’t know what PGM means, you should excuse yourself from the forum so you won’t be a laughing stock.
surely u cannot see the 19 Blackjack and 90 Bears. Taiwan will surender with first crusie missile strike. Russia has the capability to sink entire shipping in around taiwan in less than 24 hrs with Backfires. i am not even going into electromegnatic weopons.
What a joke. Iraq, Serbia and Afghanistan certainly didn’t surrender themselves from cruise missile strikes. Is any Backfire carrying antiship missiles? I’m talking of those actually certified for use, not proposals that didn’t go anywhere.
Electromagnetic weapons? Fantasy.
The whole island is defended by one of the most formidable air defenses in the world. The TK-2 has a range up to 200km, said to have boast active radar guidance, and the radar set, whose design was in partnership with Raytheon, is practically a land based AEGIS set.
these decisions are made far above USAF. just look at cost of prince sultan airbase.
Like you have no idea of the importance of tactical air power, which even the Soviet Union had planned gobs of.
so those guarding fighters have 300 KM range Mach 6 BVR missiles and can Fly at Mach 2.34 at very high altitude with full load. and it is effective against all the target at all heights and speeds.
When did the missiles ever have 300km and reach Mach 6. More fantasy. Large missiles are also very poor against small maneuverable targets.
it has the radar range and volume scaning that makes AWAC irrelevant. and thats why it was denied to china in 90s. the report is there.
Really? I doubt the radar has the same search volume, range and number of targets as an AWACS. Or even the 360 degree scanning. Furthermore, such a plane cannot loiter around for hours, while an AWACS can.
what is the evidence that all PLAAF fighters are operable? Russia has airbases in Tajikistan,kazak, armenia, Krygystan and soon Uzbekistan. this alone shows how much forward deployment is there. and it is not GDP that matters but Tax revenue and debt. Russia has half of tax rev of China with 1/10 population and $100B surplus every year. China gov lives on borrowed money.
Russia does not have a 100b surplus every year (more fantasy from you). Thats like 150 billion in foreign reserves as a complete total in accumulation. It is China that is accumulating more than 150 billion each year, and its surplus has exceeded Japan’s and is now in the trillion. Certainly you can see which country can afford to maintain and upgrade their military.
You get a much higher tax rev over China per PPP if you tax heavily and that affects your general economic state.
and where is PLAAF upgrades? essentially using down graded 80s era flankers and J-10 with no glass cockpit and no phased array radar anywhere in operations with borrowed technologies and no operational AWACS and with no experiance so to speak of with satellite and communication network. there Su-24 is better than ur Su-30MKK. because they use different weopons, ew and communication system.
More delusional fantasy from you. The J-10 has a glass cockpit and Flankers in the PLAAF are upgraded over their Russian counterparts starting with better build quality, higher payload, and the ability to use the R-77 through a simple upgrade which the PLAAF bought in 2001. The KJ-2000 and KJ-200 uses ESA radar, and yes, the KJ-2000 is operational as it has been reported by the Taiwan media vectoring Su-30s and J-11s in exercises and surveying the Taiwan straits. In addition to that the PLAAF also now has side scanning SAR battlespace surveillance planes. China certainly has an active satellite survelilance network, as often mentioned in DoD white papers and no doubt a better communication system, since Chinese companies are reported to have installed communication systems on many countries.
The Su-30MKK happens to be the first Russian plane that is truly multirole, which you cannot say abou the Su-24MK.
Russia has done exercise with CIS and India (2003 Indian ocean black jack). where is ur outside exercises?
I have read about telecom industry. u just look US congressional hearing from late 1980s about Soviet Union.
What? The Russians don’t have an indigenous manufacturing telecom industry. Are you manufacturing MMICs? Celphones? Internet routers?
So does The Greeks and Arabs but this has nothing to do with Present day science.
Look who is talking. As if Russia even has a massive export toy industry of its own.
And Google is founded by Russian . that is the biggest firm now next to Microsoft. thats not the issue.
And Yahoo was founded by a Chinese guy. so what?
The point is from where the knowledge came from. u show me a single transfer of knowledge from China to West. and i will show u 1 million Russian in IT alone. from South Korea/EU/Israel/US
Knowledge comes from the individual. If it were not for Asian immigrants and the Asian contribution, the IT industry would not be the way it is today. I have a hard time seeing Russia being a force in IT, I guess you don’t read IT magazines often enough or check the shelves in the stores.
why do u think SK gave $3B to Gorbi in 1990 which was a huge sum for SK at that time? China was too poor at that time doing only barter deals.
Guess who now has a trillion dollar surplus.
I am not looking at proposals from airshows. show me certification of El-2034 with J-8? and Nope AVIC cannot afford development of foreign radar at that time by itself and let alone certification without signed export customer. and why would Iran buy this aircraft with russian radar? what is there in this obsolete junk.
They were looking for a plane that could launch the C802 airborne. I don’t need to show you certification of EL-2034, that is a merely something the PLAAF apparently tested. The bottomline remains the current PLAAF radars are not Zhuks or based on such.
crobatoThat is just plain wrong. Only the number of F-15Es in USAF service went further than your ‘mid hundreds’ figure. Not speaking about the fighter variants F-15A/B/C/D which went far over 1,000 in numbers.
Since when the elegance of design is a merit of combat effectiveness? BTW, IMHO design-wise the J-10 sucks big time, definitely the ugliest 4th gen of all I am aware of.
Frankly I think the J-10 looks quite simple and elegant. There are more subtle and complex curves in the plane than the Rafale. Elegance and simplicity is a mark that designers understand the KISS principle and how that when all the crap hits the fan in battle, when Murphy’s Law abounds, that KISS of all things, pulls through. The complexity of maintenance, due to having two of everything, in the MiG-29, is a hinderence to combat sortie generation.
I would LOVE to see some data about that.
Your opinion is not relevant. If the perception of the PLAAF (it was officially admited by the way) is that the J-10s got the better of the Flankers, then that will affect their buying and deployment plans, and which we have already seen, since they stopped buying Su-30MKKs and Su-27 kits since 2004.
You forget Su-24Ms which are wired for all precision weapons in Russian inventory. Don’t let me prove that by pics, I got dozens.
Somehow they can go through the ROCAF’s 300plus aircraft armed with active radar guided missiles is beyond me.
Except Mexico’s technological base is a joke compared to the one of Russia. Scoring large HDP figures by mass-producing zillions of cheap low-tech products manufactured by foreign companies cannot quite compare to Russia.
Russia does not manufacture a lot of high tech items at all and unlike Mexico, it does not export a lot of finished goods. Russia’s exports are in bulk materials, ore, oil and stuff like that, which in comparison with Mexico which is actually exporting finished goods.
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