As I udnerstand it, they’re looking for other opportunities too for Europe, though I expect it will be more of the same, low frequency, leisure orientated stuff.

That’s going to be a long journey in a 737..

This is probably anyone’s initial view, but after you think about it, the B737-800 is virtually the same size as the B707 which spent 3 decades crossing the Pond. The only differences will be it’s slower than the B707 and has two engines, but by comparison, the B737 is quieter and probably provides a better passenger experience than the 707s. We’re increasingly accepting of single-aisle layouts across the Atlantic on B757’s, so again it’s going to feel much the same as that really.

And rightly so!

Yes I agree, if The Times’ article is correct and not overly spun then yes, rightly so!

I am going to put my two-pence-worth in as a result of the article related to the Airline in Airliner World. I would say to the mods that I hope I do not cross any lines within this, and I think the fact that such an article has appeared in the magazine is an invite for comment in exactly the same way that it would be in relation to any other larger airline or airline personality. Being honest about it, there has been a lot of reference to Willie Walsh and Micheal O’Leary on this forum which is a comment on their business skills and therefore if I appear to make personal references to Martin they are not a reflection on someone I don’t know, simply a comment invited by a very personal interview he has given. I will however, in my piece, try to reflect this as management, not as Martin to distinguish.

I think the first thing that stands out is that having been approached by an investor, looking for someone with experience to start a business for them, it is interesting that their desires were perhaps not explored. It is most interesting because some of the schemes proposed by the investors would on the surface seem to be more sensible than the scheme launched in the end. The two examples given both require some comment; firstly the carrier flying aircraft to Spain in the wake of the demise of XL may have been very justified, not least because the investors would have had a wide knowledge of the market to add to the management’s ability to set up an operational business. In addition to the loss of XL, it would potentially have been an ideal time because of the merger of the big four charter carriers has led to them reducing their capacity within the primary markets, including Spain. The second airline suggestion would have also been potentially lucrative given the markets have been tested in the past and an airline such as this could have been ideally placed to pick up certain sectors very quickly and succesfully, I’m thinking in particular of the MME-LON route. What strikes me is that the investors may have been let down and I cannot judge the exact reason why, though I have two theories induced by the article. The first is that Martin (I have to make personal reference for a specific reason here) believes that there is potential from his local Airport, Kidlington. This is where many airline’s have failed in the past because there is an underlying emphasis on local pride rather than any pragmatic review of the actual market. I think as a child and even teenager with a love of aviation, I always aspired to see my local airport regenerated and felt that I COULD make such services work. I am a little less optimistic about said airport these days. The second possible reason is a desire to prove the forums that he talks about as wrong and it is unfortunate that the investors have been taken along on this ride if this was the case. Despite the reference to London/Oxford, I think the airline was still designed to serve a local market, not draw from London.

The references to easyJet are in my view a bit naive and possibly a Red Herring. I do not see many, if any comparisons between the business model adopted by EZY at it’s inception and those of Varsity. The choice of aircraft and bases both generate competely seperate business models in their own rights. The fare structure of a semi-low fares airline such as Varsity is not feasible on the aircraft size chosen, having said that, nor would a B737 be a candidate for such services from Oxford to EDI (forgetting the runway issues, I’m talking busines models here). The view of starting small may not be an unrealistic one, the only area of unrealism is suggesting that EZY started small, it didn’t, it jumped into the market with two larger aircraft, a lot of money, a lot of bravado and most importantly knowing that there was significant scope within the market it chose.

It is a shame that comparisons weren’t drawn with Eastern Airways, which started small, but with realistic fares and an understanding of it’s market place (although admittedly it had the benefit of wealthy oil companies paying fares for their travellers). I think the note in relation to Newcastle is interesting because it probably proves that the market is not adequate for an airline such as Varsity (low capacity) because market stimulation, induced by fares would be necessary. The Edinburgh market may be the same, the original fares of £49 appear to have been introductory, but if they were necessary to induce 70% load factors, then I would be worried about how the airline could operate financially long term because the fares would have to jump significantly, but this would have reduced the market scale. This is not necessarily the end of the earth in the right market, but the proximity of LHR would act as a significant impediment to this.

I think we have to give respect on a personal level to Martin for his ability to start an operation, i.e. from a operational point of view. This is a hard part of any airline start up. I think perhaps the management however has lost it’s way with respect to the business plan side of the airline, especially in light of the requirements originally laid down by the investors.

I’m not sure what will happen next at Varsity, but I think they will struggle to restart operations in the local market due to the press coverage to this airline and the association with Alpha1 which unfortunately cannot be ignored.

I do hope I haven’t been too personal in this.

Even though it’s from Hindustan Aeronautics, do you think they’ll try and give themselves a European name and pretend to be in Dagenham when you call?

Thre you go GA 😉

I suppose childish racial sterotypes do have their place, but this isn’t it

Probably about .42 microseconds if you assume you normally sleep for 8 hours/day

IF (:o) I’ve done my calculations correctly then this means that we will loose a day every 188 years (rounded), so do we need to have a new type of leap year every 188 years? It’s something they need to think about, otherwise, after about 17,300 years, Spring will end up in summer, summer in winter..etc etc. That’d just be confusing:eek:

OK, so I realised I got the calculation wrong as I was using full seconds, not microseconds.

I’m going to be losing a lot of sleep over this:eek::rolleyes::D

Probably about .42 microseconds if you assume you normally sleep for 8 hours/day

It is a Dassault Falcon 20DC. Operated (at that time) by FR Aviation.

IF (:o) I’ve done my calculations correctly then this means that we will loose a day every 188 years (rounded), so do we need to have a new type of leap year every 188 years? It’s something they need to think about, otherwise, after about 17,300 years, Spring will end up in summer, summer in winter..etc etc. That’d just be confusing:eek: