didn’t they restart the development of Yak-41M?

I still am not sure if EF2000 will outsell JSF. There are already over 600 EF2000s ordered to be delivered to 5 different countries(inc Austria), there will be over 2500 JSFs ordered by US and Britain just alone and who knows how many other ones will be ordered by other countries like Turkey, Belgium, Norway and Holland and other participators.

Bell has not offered them a good enough deal which Turkey is waiting for that is why they bribed them to take Ka-50-2 instead. Cobra is politically a better choice but technically the Hokum is better.

Yahhh an upgraded j-22 Orao 3 with Kopyo or more advanced versions of it would’ve been pretty capable with R-77 and R-73, it would give it very good BVR capability. I have read that despite weak engines it is very manouverable too.

Anyways with that, also give it a very wide variety of air to surface weapons like PGMs and anti shipping missiles and etc.

J-22 Orao is very underpowered, it’s speed, payload and range are kind of pethetic compared to Jaguars due to bad engines, however they should get better engines, weapons and avionics.

I just wonder which Kopyo radar they were talking about, what radar do you guys think it could be fit in it’s nose and the specs of the radar?

Only 2 J-22s were ever lost, one in combat I think and one crashed in Romania. YuAF flew thes J-22s during the Civil war in 92-95 and in 99 in Kosovo but at very low altittudes, so did the Mig-29s to aviod detection.

Proven aircraft after all I don’t see why should we scrap it, perhaps if they upgrade it they could open a new production line and try to export it.

so can someone list all the exact contenders and pairs and etc

Glitter i know you’re really pro M2K, but even if Su-35 wasn’t an option Gripen would still be better than M2K, so why?

-Gripen is a much newer airframe
-Gripen is cheaper(70mn) compared to M2K(70mn) and a little cheaper to maintain and fly
-About the same range
-it has a smaller payload which is not a extremely big thing

I really don’t see why the M2K should go ahead instead of Gripen

Now as for SU-35, Su-35’s high maintenance/flying hour cost makes up for it’s really low cost to buy(35mn) and in the future if you run it for that many hours it really wouldn’t be that expensive, and I likely doubt it costs that much(20000) to run/hour, thats ridicilously high. But lets say Su-35 does cost the same at the end of 8000 hours along with lets say M2K, it still offers much better capabilities than the little M2K. You could buy 20 Su-35s for 350mn and buy 10 M2K’s for 700mn.

I don’t see whats so much more offensive on the M2K than on the Gripen. And as much as you say it, M2KBR doesn’t even exist not even as a prototype and who freaking knows what they’d put in it.

I always had a feeling Dassault on purpose stacked up M2K’s cost up to 70mn because they felt it would get picked because they partnered with Embraer and were abusing that position, I really hope M2K looses just for that and not just the fact that the other two are better. Dassault should’ve put the price somewhere around 35-45mn otherwise M2K wouldn’t be good if it costed as much as Gripen.

well those Mi-8/17s and G-4s are all being upgraded for sure but they haven’t made up their mind with the rest of te AF including Mig-21s/29s and J-22s and other aircraft.

Although 20 Mig-29SMTs for air superiority wouldn’t be a big scratch for NATO, they should get the rest of the parts for S-300, since we have some parts delivered from Russia before 99 but never became operational because they couldn’t get it to us in time. Remember if J-22 would get some good radar and missiles it would become good. It’s nose is good enough for a decent enough radar, maybe the Italian Grifo or some Russian one, after all it’s nose is much bigger than Mig-21s’ I’d arm those J-22s with R-77 and R-73 and other things and they’d be very good.