The Folha newspaper, the same who broght out the leakage of FABs report, says that it believes that the proposed unit costs – including 5-year post-sale support, training package and some armament (not much!) – is: Gripen US$ 70 Million, F-18 US$100 Million and Rafale US$140 Million.

How reasonable do these number seem to you?

Regards,

The Rafale figure looks like the usual figure (UAE, Morocco, etc).
If only Dassault hadn’t cut the price for Brazil by 40 percent…:confused:

We haven’t got any F2 anymore, at all, as far as i know.

Maybe Rafale is built in €uros, maintained in €uros, operated in €uros… Then convert it all in Dollar$.:confused:

I thought you wanted to be my wingman…:rolleyes:

Nothing to do with previous post.

I left this forum some months ago. Why ? I’m fed up with what has been going on here, for YEARS.

To me, it’s been a real pain to translate my thoughts for STERILE debates. I’ve started here a kind of thread with special rules, threads about Rafale news, only Rafale news, to talk only about Rafale. Those threads had become the best compilation of news about Rafale, thanks to the help of arthuro, glitter, Kovy, Nicolas10, Opit, Scorpion, and i’m sincerely sorry for those i’m forgetting right now (they weren’t all French).

I’ve done my best to impose Rafale as a credible platform, since it is one, trying to keep it out of contention.

But for years, every achievements it could get were… discredited to say the least.

Dutch evaluation, Korea, Singapour, TLP 2007, NTM 2006, Colonel Moussez, Benco, and so on. Every press article comparing favourably the Rafale to other competitors has been criticized, from the very article to its author, generally by the same guy.
The same guy who’s been using lots of “cliché” about French, lots of small words deceptively kind, and every tactics to bash any opponents.

If only it had happened one or two times, or more… ok. But no, it happened simply EVERY TIME. Quite suspicious if you ask me.

I think there is the French point of view about Rafale and its news. And there is another point of view disputing every single point from the French one.

Between those two points of view, we’ve seen extremely heated debates, we’ve seen rhetoric, i’ve felt abused due to my poor skills in English, we’ve seen real flamers, real obvious trolls, but also insidious liars (only detected by French, i mean ALL French).

I won’t sum up all the discussions, of course. But people have to understand that there is something which looks like a 3 sided reality (though of course, it can’t be).

There are a collection of news that make a LOT of sense when you side with the French (as well as there is a collection of arguments making sense for the opposite side). And this “French” collection may suffer some loss without killing the overall coherence.

THUS, YES, i’ve chosen my side. Yes, i believe Benco without restriction. Yes, i don’t feel ashamed to acknowledge you that i believe what AdA says about ATLC. Yes, i side with the pilots who give their names, who give details about their simulated fights, provide numbers and engage the credibility of our army. Yes, I prefer THEM to those who remain unknown when quoted by suspicious journalists using aliases.

Call me a moron, or else, i really don’t care. I’ll always feel free to change my mind if i’m proved wrong ! And it may happen when the opposing side will have an official unambiguous speech.

Also, i think French should enjoy free access to the forum, without seeing every article they post been toughly criticized as they are used to. If you don’t like “the French side”, then go on, do not comment, “live with it”.

I’m fed up with immune liars who have been insulting us, but not only us, but every source we provided. I’m fed up with the idea that because of JOUST and BAe marketing, we French have to doubt about everything coming from our country (you see the problem ?) just like if it was propaganda EACH TIME. I’m fed up with those who systematically try to discredit others by using the word “fanboy” or the names “Thunder/etc”.

I don’t want, anymore, to see people charging us for partiality just because we simply can’t adopt an opinion which is just plain stupid from our PoV. No one’s perfect. “Live with it”. Accept to read French news when it comes to Rafale. Accept to read non-French articles too when they prize Rafale.

And let the people build their own mind.

Rafale exists, it’s doing pretty well, even if you didn’t want to see it appear among your beloved F-22 and Typhoons, eventually bringing a bit of shadow over them.

There is still a lot of way to discuss about our common interests without insulting, without suspecting every time every things not fitting to your mind.

Please accept the “French touch”.

Thanks. 😎

PS : i wouldn’t have written this if i had felt alone in my complaint. I think i wouldn’t be wrong to say that most French will approve, as many of the most respected did support me.
PS 2: i know there are French trolls too.

http://secretdefense.blogs.liberation.fr/defense/2009/12/carton-plein-pour-le-rafale-lors-dexercices-aux-emirats.html

Merchet was at the press conference too.

Now it’s clear that what some try to make look like a mere rumor is in fact an official speech by the AdA (lieutenant-colonel Grandclaudon).

6 encounters between Rafale and F-22. Rafale lost only once. It doesn’t mean that it won the other encounters.

@ Scorpion : i understand your PoV… But i’d be pleased to read a RAF or Luftwaffe, or Italian or Spanish pilot saying very officially that they beat Rafale easily.
“Extremely gratifying” results doesn’t mean “we won”.

French pilots apparently aren’t afraid to look ridiculous.

but I were French I would be a bit worried.

I think we are.

You’ve got so much of trustful contacts in France (when it comes to get negative comments about the Rafale). You could phone one of them in the coming minutes, just like you did for the 8g limit…

So, why do you still rely on French fanboys with “nationalistic prejudices and preconceptions and with polishing an unbalanced, over-optimistic and exaggerated picture of an aircraft and its manufacturer.”

:rolleyes: Who’s the journalist (the award winner ?) ? Is he really doing his job here ?