Brad,
I don’t see what the Su-7’s undisputed ability to withstand damage (read up a bit on the Suka, it is indeed VERY sturdy) has anything to do with the Su-39s performance in that respect, nor with that of the AMX. There is nothing imagined about that. One of the reasons that the Su-25 or Su-39 are what you consider ‘overweight junk’ is exactly because of the armour and redundancy fitted to the airframe, in order to make it survivable. There’s no armoured bathtub to protect the pilot in the AMX, there are no firewalls around the engine in the AMX, it hasn’t got foam-filled tanks, it hasn’t got any automatic fire extinguishers…. The AMX is nothing but a light plane pretending to be a fighter (it’s built, designed and ordered as a G91 and MB326/Xavante replacement after all), while the Su-39 is an up-equipped Shturmovik. Totally different class of airplanes.

Also note that the AMX’s weapon load of 4000kg is nothing more but a theoretical one. I will be surprised if you can show me a pic of an AMX hauling more than 2000kg…

Arthur- Not to drag this out, but your letting opionions get in the way of facts. To use the example of the Sturmovic, I garantee if the germans were able to employ AA flak guns over their battlefield, the IL-2 nuisence would quickly have been iradicated. Both the IL-2 and Su-39 are very effective against small arms damage-thats it, nothing more. And to say that the AMX is a light plane pretending to be a fighter is to ignore the fact that fighter is not its main role. As Flogger mentioned its in the same class as the Skyhawk, a light strike aircraft. Youll notice that the wings of the AMX are much larger and less swept than a normal fighter as its main role is to comfortably carry heavy loads at low level. So I have no doubt it could effectively carry a 4000 kg warload.

Arthur, Srbin- Lets make clear that the reason you like the Su-39 is this supposed ability to withstand flak better than other jets. I havent read anything about older “heavy” russian jets like Su-7 withstanding damage better in combat than any other jet, so its all up to your imagination so far. And just because this jet hangs so and so missle is not what I consider a good reason for buying overweight junk. And srbin, if you read my post I said “old style russian hardware” thinking the word style would be understood as a class of airplane, NOT ITS BUILDER YOU IDIOT!

Flogger- You mentioned earlier that the Mexican Navy is buying L-159s. I just read they are only going to buy 9 L-39s. Now I can understand buying L-139s, but the L-39 came into service in the late 50s and should all be in museums with the T-33s.

How does it compare with il2 forgotten battles and playing online eitherr via ubi or hyperlobby?

Compare to Il-2? It doesnt even compare to Rowans BoB.

Check out this screenshot of the London Docks. Youll notice Big Ben jutting out of the skyline in the background.

And a close up of Big Ben.

“I know. I want to make a political point and make somebody feel small. How do I do it? Of course! I make something up. I make out they said something they did not actually say (whether or not it stands up to scrutiny)and use examples that I do not actually have. If I can’t win an argument fairly I shall lie through my arse and make all sorts of unfounded claims even though I have no proof of what I say and what I say contradicts reality itself”. :rolleyes:

Thats what I get bored of.

Fine Phil, I think this discussian is getting blown out of perportion, and I dont want to drag it out. But I do just want to say that I want to be a good sport about this and say that I find what you say amusing and not offensive. How on earth what I say about WW2 fighter capabilitys is making a political point Ill never know, nor how it would make anyone feel small. And as for lies and unfounded claims and whatnot, I dont see how my sources are any less credible than anything else brought up on these discussian boards, unless youre like Moggy who thinks that only those who have flown the planes first hand can make any accurate statement, and anything else is hearsay. So yes youre right, I never flew as a fighter pilot in WW2, so niether I or you can actually know what these planes were capable of. You win, OK?

Like I said it is debateable and just because you say it is true doesn’t make it so. The argument bores me.

Yeah, it bores me too. But you brought it up, so I thought Id be nice and respond rather than ignore you.