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Y-20 Bacon

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  • in reply to: If you had to choose between Rafale or F-35 #2203659
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    thanks for the pic but numbers do seem suspect
    which f-35 is being used?
    su-30mki with 3 external fuel tanks? it never flies with external fuel
    same for f-35 for now.

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2203663
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    1) You guys literally deleted a portion of the J-15’s tail sting with that thick blue line.

    2) I doubt the 21.9 meter figure. The Su-33 is 21.3 meters long, and the J-15 probably shares its dimensions. I suspect this is a case of lazy spec filling absent official information.

    3) Now replicate that with a different satellite pic. There are others.

    no, you’re just being late to this discussion and lazy. you provide no new information or supposed pictures.
    its another case of waah waah, i don’t like what you said but I have nothing to prove otherwise.

    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    What’s wrong with Tejas ? Despite initial problem the Tejas already evolve quite well. Frm begining with Mig 21 is sloted to be replaced by Tejas, then India should stick it’s backbone with Tejas, as Mig 21 used to be and still the backbone for Indian AF.
    So frm begining of this thread, the answered already clear. The gap will be filled by Tejas, which build and developed to fill the numbers as backbone frm begining.

    either: its capabilities are not up to expectations. its capabilities are not up to par for FUTURE needs. or simply, they can’t produce them fast enough. Keep in mind it is still many many years if decades off from reaching the number the IAF wants. Also mig-27s, jaguars and mirage 2000s will also become obsolete.

    ideally the current IAF should’ve looked like this.

    1.
    Su-30MKI
    Rafale (A,B for AF and M for navy)
    LCA

    or

    2.
    Su-30MKI
    LCA

    or

    3.
    Su-30MKI
    Rafale
    M2K (should’ve ordered more in the beginning instead of the Mig-29)

    in reply to: If you had to choose between Rafale or F-35 #2203776
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    can some one put up range figures for the rafale and f-35 (preferably A and B) for a similar mission profile?

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2203778
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    Let me give it a shot. I can’t get 23m. Problem is the resolution is extremely poor. It is hard see the J-15 tail boom. So I excluded the tail-boom. Another thing, what is the J-15 length without the pitot tube? Pitot tube won’t be visible at all at this resolution.

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]248681[/ATTACH]

    Glad we are in agreement that the original “analysis” was poor because of the poor quality image, and especially biased and poor measuring.

    fanboys like to take things at face value, especially when it favors their pre-determined biased views, like Foxmulder

    Good job on the picture. Now we have TWO people confirming that the J-20 is as big as the Flanker.
    I took your picture and flipped the J-20 to make an easier side by side comparison with the J-15.

    It is 1 or 2 pixels LONGER. But I’m not going to nitpick.
    it is more or less the same size as the 22 meter J-15. So most outlet’s claim of 23meter was not baseless

    http://i.imgur.com/RG8mctU.jpg

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2205238
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    this is why you’re biased Deino. you are cherry picking images to fit your agenda. sure. ignore all the HD quality pictures comparing them from the side.
    cherry pick the top down, grainy pixelated low quality picture of the flanker and j-20.

    http://i48.tinypic.com/jshc9u.jpg
    its this pic that you base your 20M from, but you follow it so faithfully

    OH LOOK, blow it up in and zoom in

    https://s12.postimg.org/n7jkkyi31/flankerj20.jpg

    Look how much space in measurement he gave the Flanker.
    Sure, the yellow line on the J-20 goes right to the edge of the engine, but look at that huge gap on the flankers tail (maybe about 3-4 pixels), and the gap by the radome.

    Why don’t you put the j-20 side by side with the flanker. you will see its the same size

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2205266
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    Sorry … if I’m over-sensitive, then You are over-ignorant and I’m not sure how relevant it is to search for the original F-22 image.

    I’m afraid that over the years, you’ve become a fanboy with a strong bias towards Chinese aircraft. Maybe not to the extent of JSR, but maybe more along the lines of Nicolas10

    It’s simply some sort of math …
    Not sure what obscure link You just found to bake You claim, but most sources say it is about 20,30 (Wiki) or 20,35 m long. Just look at this image … otherwise You surely claim this J-15 is only a sub-scale model.

    you try to argue against my HD image with a super pixelated one, where the edges are blurry and a one pixel difference is like a 1 meter difference?

    sorry, many sites give 23 meter. just google j-20 and 23 meters.
    Try to be non-bias and fair. I’m sorry not everyone thinks the J-20 is good looking besides you and other Chinese enthusiasts. In fact most of the rest of the world here, thinks it is probably the worst looking 5th gen aircraft behind the X-32.

    Even a poster that was being shown in China but it closer to 22 meters.
    yes, an actual information poster. yes in China

    lots of other people came to the same conclusion
    https://sofrep.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/j-20-f22.jpg
    https://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/12203563/img/Anonymous/j-31-j-20-su-50-f-22-f-35-if-x-f-3-atd-x-stealth.png

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2205283
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    Sorry, but sometimes I have the feeling You simply need something to mock !

    no that’s just you being oversensitive.

    The J-20 is flat, but not extremely long.

    Use at least some realistic dimensions. The F-22 is 18,90m long and the J-20 about – based on a comparison to a J-15 side-by-side – about 20,35m … so this is about 1,45 or 1,50 m longer And not as shown in You completely off image.

    no, the images are quite accurate. note that you didn’t even bother trying to include the f-22 image in yours, let alone the right kind of scale.

    J-20 is more likely 23 meters, as confirmed by many sources like
    http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/detail.asp?aircraft_id=860

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2205303
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    And of course side shots are great, where the smoothness of the plane gets to show itself off:
    http://i.imgur.com/gJs7cQm.jpg

    no, the sides are the worst. you can see how absurdly long it is. look at it compared to an f-22 juxtaposed with the j-20

    https://imgtaxi.com/images/small-medium/2016/10/03/57f2542c8793d.jpg

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2205611
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    Considering both Russia and the US take decades upon decades to design and produce their jets, I just can’t see how the J 20 has been put through the rigor that US and Russia deem adequate.

    can you clarify how Chinese jets are not as rigorous as US and Russian ones?

    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    nonsense… the Mirage successor (a better aircraft) was being studied since 1978, even before first Mirage 2000 entered service.

    as for the upgrades for M2k, while Dassault proposed it in the late 90’s – early 2000, nobody wanted it anymore, even upgraded. As a result you can be sure it wouldn’t take any orders from the Gripen that would have the edge, if anything, because it is a more modern concept. And Dassault would never have been able to sell it to any of the markets that the Rafale gets today for pretty much the same reason. Another point is that as the Mirage is not carrier capable (and absolutely unrealistic to imagine such modifications), the french navy would have been forced to get their fleet fighters elsewhere, reducing even more Dassault sales. What’s more, the Rafale as of today,has more export orders than the Gripen

    Basically, there’s no contest between the Rafale and Mirage 2000.. the latter did what it had to do, but the new bird is what Dassault needed to continue its development.

    that successor was the mirage 4000. Rafale only went through because 4000 failed and Europe was moving a head.

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2128388
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    China is at basic level. Chinese does not even realize they put the big factories at wrong places. large scale aviation factories need there own factory towns and not in coastal regions. it still very manual job and large scale turnover of labor can either destroy the whole projects or import depended.

    your mig 1.44 clone is being produced faster than the other stealth jets bar f-35

    in reply to: Chinese Air Power Thread 17 #2128391
    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    Beautiful isn’t the word I was thinking. Brutish more like. Not in a bad way.

    With the big body and the canards, it looks mean.

    Chinese aircraft in general just look very long. the J-20 compared to pak-fa or f-22, the j-10 compared to f-16 or gripen, or the j-8 compared to the f-4.
    the only normal looking one is the jf-17.

    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    Nicolas was right, it was a test bed for the RBE-2 AESA, the radar was way heavier than the RDI/RDY, that brought severe fligh restrictions to that particular Mirage airframe.
    The Mirage 2000 line could not be kept open because there were no orders for it, and Dassault could not maintain an upgrade path for it without a major backer.

    no, nicolas was wrong because he is talking about current day.

    I am asking, if the Rafale was never made, then France would have to put more effort into upgrading the M2K.
    The question is if the M2K would’ve been more marketable.
    Yes, we know it is a dead end NOW, because people went elsewhere.

    Y-20 Bacon
    Participant

    This is bull.

    The Mirage 2000 was only a testbed for the Rafale radar.

    This radar was never planned to equip the M2000 and brought severe weight imbalance.

    Nic

    no you’re bull.
    because it was tested with an aesa radar.

Viewing 15 posts - 556 through 570 (of 1,779 total)