The fact itself they used a modified MiG-31 i.e. a plane capable of both reaching very high altitude and supersonic cruise speed seem me to point to the capability to reach such range as a maximum, tactically it would however be wiser to reach a smaller one but with full manoeuvrability and a more discrete traiectory.
Also because I just don’t see the feasibility of converting what is considered a key asset of Air defence forces into a ASM carrier, let alone to built new ones just for such a role.
In the same adress the nuclear-powered cruise missile has been specifically related to strategical deterrence and with only nuclear payload.
Reason is quite obvious: even with a conventional payload it would result as a “dirty” bomb and so be counted into the total sum of nuclear weapons allowed.
In any case more those weapons with exception of Kinzhal would pertain to Strategic Rocket forces or Navy, not Ruaf.
So seems even ebil, ebil russian got their own Skunk-Works.
Send them to Russia as a form of payment for Su-35.
Configuration of Raptor is a triangle-like one: two Amraam back and one forward with the body between them: what actually prevent a similar arrangement for RVV-SD?
Oh my, ypu try to compare what reported by Sens with what was written by Izvestia and reported by Austin and you get everything and the contrary of everything …
Let’s add my own contribution of reports from 150th AD regiment and I think only possible explanation is that all those report from the ground describe just one facet of a protracted air battle involving different locations.
So Sens report both the findings of missiles in Israel &Lebanon that the (quite discording) version from their press, Russians describe what happened in T4 only (hence the attribution of the downing to S-200) where they have troops, people of Suweida just what happened at their own air base.
Sum them up and you still will not get a coherent picture but surely some more hints about how things went.
@Sens
A S-125? Less than 4 miles from Ramat David? Wow!
That’s a blast!
And they said it was a SA-17 instead?
A trailer or a C&C vehicle or instead just a maskirovka maquette as someone looking at released video said?
Let’s allow me to state that reading all these report together made me sure of just one thing: they are still in a state of self-denial about what happened.
So they try, I don’t know if willingly or as a mental reflex, to present things as they were fatalities, dirty tricks from the enemies, human errors etc, etc, etc.
As a paradox if what they say as a form of self denial would be true that would result in a whole s…load of bad news for them.
10.000ft too high of a quote for engage Syrian air defences?
20 missiles of three different types getting all together on the same target of opportunity, making part of a strike package of 8 planes?
Just near your own main base in the north of the country?
Mercurius, I think he intend to say that there has not been further actions in the days after the one in question.
So one part say to have caused incredible havoc and the other replies that the damage was instead quite limited and given that in the ME everyone lie as there will no tomorrow and the two states in question are champions in this sport, let’s stick to the very few facts we are certain of.
Despite all the media rumor of this one, there have been further engagements between the two, the most of them last year after the Air defence network was revamped, thanks to russian and iranian assistance but above all thank to the liberation of large part of Syrian territory thanks to the SAA,NDF and Hezb victories.
Making a simple sum, if I would believe to the reports of just one part, at this rate (I follow conflict day by day by the times of the battle of Al Qusayr, so I have missed no one of them) the IAF would have destroyed the Syrian Air defence four or five times according to their own declarations, while according to the one of Syrians, Israel would have gone bankrupt for the numbers of PGM they claim to have intercepted.
P.S. Said so, I gave a good credibility rating to the reports I have published in post #7267 (otherwise I would have published them ça la va sans dire): they come from sources on the ground and not from centralized propaganda outlet, Fire Brigate one report precisely damages and life lost (RIP to both) and let us guess between the lines of their not military language what type of missiles the regiment was equipped with i.e. Pantsir.
Probably both (actually more) parts are unwilling of a further escalation ATM and are instead frantically analyzing the military and consequently political implication of the double engagement.
Although we would probably not know much of the military action in itself (we are neither sure what weapon nailed the F-16) the endgame itself (if it will last) seem to suggest that a sort of new point of balance has been found.
Let’s say that one part know that its previously almost absolute freedom of action is no more and the other know that, despite his augmented capability to react, the adversary is still a formidable one and so it is not in his actual interest to escalate further.
New Israeli well planned raids against Hezbollah shipments would surely happen but no more hasty actions like this one.
P.S. And finally we have get to have an almost serene and on topic discussion about a potentially higly emotional and divisive matter. Let’s us all save the whole page and use it as a reference for future ones.
OH, my…
The issue is probably with the new twin launcher: http://i64.tinypic.com/6z1si8.jpg
Mounted here on a type 4/Strike Eagle CFT under an F-15C. Probably won’t fit and/or too heavy for an unmodified type 2 CFT.
The Strike Eagle CFT + twin launchers on fuselage+ four missiles on each wing: Instead the Silent Eagle the ANG would get the DRAG (not in LGTB sense) Queen it seems…
Thanks, bring on it.
It seems me that the timetable you publish is not in contrast with my reconstruction:
the first wave of attacks were started very soon, an hour from the initial incident, so it was surely more risky than usual ones targeting shipment to Hezbollah, prepared well in advance and by surprise.
Time of second one seems confirmed by sources on the ground.
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About the veridicity of relative claims: ascertain who between the Baath regime and the IAF is the bigger liar is something just impossible…
Still in the case in question the report of just two dead person can be an hint of not such a great effectiveness.
Levsha: nor one nor the other were ever tough for such a role, they were just ferries between Usa and Europe (or Vietnam until the conflict lasted).
Once arrived to a major hub their load was to be transferred , sometimes by C-130 but in the great majority of cases using the normal road or rail network to the front. The short-sightedness of such an organization was clear even before the end of the Cold War hence the money and the efforts spent on developing that exceptional, hyper-advanced but costly plane that is the C-17.
Still the damage done by such a gap between strategic lifting and tactical transport is still felt in many legacy NATO equipments, originally conceived with precise dimensional and weight limitation in order to be carried on the C-130 while on the other hand the NATO has still to rent AN-124 and IL-76 to airlift loads in Afghanistan, given that C-17 is damn too costly and scarce in numbers for everyday logistical support while C-141 and C-5 was all merciless retired ASAP.
Yes, but also for the Il-76 I forecast a similar life span and with new updated versions while I fear the J will be the last Hercules.
If a would instead name a transport plane showing both high end technology than real usefulness i would say the C-17 hands down.
C-141 like the C-5 were instead just transatlanic Cold War era ferries.
P.s. and that is the best response to Levsha also: C-141 has done just ferries between USA mainland and main, full standard bases abroad, it was surely efficient in this role but for qualify itself as a real military transport plane like the ones cited above it should have showed almost the ability to operate from forward operating bases if not from rugged, short airstrips like the An-22 proved able to do.
@TomcatVIP
Are you aware how such a comparison is really the best compliment one can made to Russian designer school when it come in terms of reliability and usefulness?
@Trident
Essential thing is that with just two engines and such a MTOW it is more akin to a Tu-22M than to a Tu-160 and it would so be possible to buy a consistent number of them.
so the claim that it would be used instead of both Bears than Backfires seees more than reasonable to me.