inkRE: For those of you condoning the assasination
If the CIA blew up a car in the middle of the desert and upon examining the remains discovered that they’d just killed six innocent Yemeni men out on sunday drive do you think they’d own upto it? No way. Considering the lenghts the US govt. went to in order to cover up various convoy and bridge+train bombings in ’99 I would easily beleive that they’d fabricate some evidence in order to avoid an internationsal scandal.
The fact is, we’ll never know. The only evidence against these guys is from the CIA and they never get anything wrong do they? I always thought that in America you were innocent until proven guilty – in which case these guys were definitely innocent because they can never now be proven guilty.
“There is clearly a disconnect between the US and the rest of the world on this issue. As an American I can tell you there is real fear in this country that something like Sept11 can happen again”
Thats a lot of sh*te. In Yugoslavia we saw the US as our main threat and the very real fear of a massive bombing campaign against our country actually materialised itself. Does that give Yugoslavs the right to act like terrorists? No. Of course not.
The plain fact of the matter is that the US can do this if it wants, nobody can stop them and very few will try. That doesn’t make it right and it doesn’t mean we have to like it. Is it any wonder that the US should be a target for terrorism when it arbitrarily bombs people around the world?
inkRE: BOND… a big smash!
Goldfinger has yet to be surpassed as a Bond film…
“Do you expect me to talk?”
“No Mister Bond, I expect you to die!”
Fantastic!
inkRE: BOND… a big smash!
Goldfinger has yet to be surpassed as a Bond film…
“Do you expect me to talk?”
“No Mister Bond, I expect you to die!”
Fantastic!
inkRE: Which countries build the best cars and why?
Deutschland!
Audi, VolksWagen, Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Porsche. If those aren’t the top car manufacturers in the world I’m prepared to eat my shorts.
inkRE: Which countries build the best cars and why?
Deutschland!
Audi, VolksWagen, Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Porsche. If those aren’t the top car manufacturers in the world I’m prepared to eat my shorts.
inkRE: Hostages die in Moscow operation
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 27-10-02 AT 08:36 PM (GMT)]Recent theory I heard on 5 Live (Radio): According to a Russian doctor they interviewed there is a high proportion of heart failure amongst the deceased. Although he couldn’t say exactly why that was the interviewers speculated that the old, infirm and half starved hostages were simply not strong enough to survive all of the stress and the gas may have considerably contributed to this.
Garry, what new Tu-22M5 capability?
inkRE: Hostages die in Moscow operation
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 27-10-02 AT 08:36 PM (GMT)]Recent theory I heard on 5 Live (Radio): According to a Russian doctor they interviewed there is a high proportion of heart failure amongst the deceased. Although he couldn’t say exactly why that was the interviewers speculated that the old, infirm and half starved hostages were simply not strong enough to survive all of the stress and the gas may have considerably contributed to this.
Garry, what new Tu-22M5 capability?
inkRE: Should we interfere in other countries affairs?
Some points I think have been misrepresented:
Norway/Japan: “Its quite important to remember that the world’s largest consumer of whale meat is the United States of America” – Greenpeace, 1996 (sorry, can’t remember the name of the report – only have the cut-out).
Brazil: I’m not entierly sure that Brazil is as much to blame as some have implied. Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t most logging companies in Brazil actually “western” multi-nationals?
I was reading an article in The Guardian a few weeks ago which blasted the Ghanaian govt. for mining so extensively in a region where some endangered bird species thrives. The mining was destroying the bird’s habitat and within a few years it was expected that the species might well be extinct. The article, however, failed to mention that the mining company is actually French and that it pays no tax to the govt of Ghana – in return it offers the govt the land it clears for farming and it employs local people. The mining company gets lots of copper for very small prices (no taxes and cheap labour) and the Ghanaian govt gets the land it would clear anyway cleared for free. Convenient maybe but neither side is therefore accountable for the environmental damage it does. This sort of thing goes on everywhere in Africa and the third world – in a way its like economic colonialisation.
inkRE: Should we interfere in other countries affairs?
Some points I think have been misrepresented:
Norway/Japan: “Its quite important to remember that the world’s largest consumer of whale meat is the United States of America” – Greenpeace, 1996 (sorry, can’t remember the name of the report – only have the cut-out).
Brazil: I’m not entierly sure that Brazil is as much to blame as some have implied. Correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t most logging companies in Brazil actually “western” multi-nationals?
I was reading an article in The Guardian a few weeks ago which blasted the Ghanaian govt. for mining so extensively in a region where some endangered bird species thrives. The mining was destroying the bird’s habitat and within a few years it was expected that the species might well be extinct. The article, however, failed to mention that the mining company is actually French and that it pays no tax to the govt of Ghana – in return it offers the govt the land it clears for farming and it employs local people. The mining company gets lots of copper for very small prices (no taxes and cheap labour) and the Ghanaian govt gets the land it would clear anyway cleared for free. Convenient maybe but neither side is therefore accountable for the environmental damage it does. This sort of thing goes on everywhere in Africa and the third world – in a way its like economic colonialisation.
inkRE: Chechens threaten to kill 700 hostages in Moscow theatre
THIS FROM THE BBC:
Russian security forces have brought a dramatic end to the three-day siege in a Moscow theatre, where about 50 Chechen rebels were holding hundreds of people hostage.
Hundreds of heavily-armed troops stormed the building at about 0600 local time (0200 GMT) after the rebels began executing their captives.
The head of the Russian security service, Nikolai Patrushev, said 34 of the Chechens were killed and several others were arrested. He said none had escaped.
Earlier reports had spoken of concern that some of the Chechen rebels had slipped away undetected.
The group’s leader, Movsar Barayev, was among those who died in the fierce gunbattle.
The bodies of a number of dead hostages are reported to have been brought out of the building.
At least 20 ambulances were seen carrying casualties away from the scene.
But Reuters news agency quoted an Australian diplomat as saying that no more than 10 hostages – none of them foreign to the best of his knowledge – had been killed.
Reports say Russian President Vladimir Putin did not specifically order the operation, but was informed after it began.
The special forces used sleeping gas to subdue the rebels and a number of hostages were brought out unconscious, state-controlled ORT television reported.
About two hours after the raid, the channel showed pictures of the theatre strewn with bodies, some severely mutilated, others with their heads down as if they had passed out.
Booby traps
Some of the hostages began attempting to escape after the rebels shot two of their captives.
In the ensuing panic, the hostages inadvertently set off booby traps laid in the theatre by the rebels.
Russian special forces then rushed to their aid, engaging in a pitched gun battle which lasted more than an hour.
None of the special forces were killed or injured in the operation.
“We succeeded in preventing mass deaths and the collapse of the building which we had been threatened with,” said Russian Deputy Interior Minister Vladimir Vasilyev.
The BBC’s Jonathan Charles, who is at the scene, said the hostages looked shocked and terrified as they emerged.
As troops secured the building, special teams were deployed to disarm mines and explosives planted by the rebels inside the Palace of Culture theatre.
Takeover
The siege started on Wednesday when around 50 Chechen rebels seized control of the theatre, about 4 kilometres (2.7 miles) south-east of the Kremlin.
At least 700 Russians and foreigners were inside, watching a performance of the musical Nord-Ost.
The rebels threatened to shoot the audience and blow up the building if Russian security forces intervened.
They demanded the withdrawal of Russian troops from Chechnya and an end to the war there.
On Friday, the rebels released 19 hostages, but negotiations to release others broke down.
**************************************
This appears to be an astounding victory for the Russian special purpose units involved inspite of the tragic death of some of the hostages.
I wonder what will happen now in Chechnya and the Pankisi Gorge?
inkRE: Chechens threaten to kill 700 hostages in Moscow theatre
THIS FROM THE BBC:
Russian security forces have brought a dramatic end to the three-day siege in a Moscow theatre, where about 50 Chechen rebels were holding hundreds of people hostage.
Hundreds of heavily-armed troops stormed the building at about 0600 local time (0200 GMT) after the rebels began executing their captives.
The head of the Russian security service, Nikolai Patrushev, said 34 of the Chechens were killed and several others were arrested. He said none had escaped.
Earlier reports had spoken of concern that some of the Chechen rebels had slipped away undetected.
The group’s leader, Movsar Barayev, was among those who died in the fierce gunbattle.
The bodies of a number of dead hostages are reported to have been brought out of the building.
At least 20 ambulances were seen carrying casualties away from the scene.
But Reuters news agency quoted an Australian diplomat as saying that no more than 10 hostages – none of them foreign to the best of his knowledge – had been killed.
Reports say Russian President Vladimir Putin did not specifically order the operation, but was informed after it began.
The special forces used sleeping gas to subdue the rebels and a number of hostages were brought out unconscious, state-controlled ORT television reported.
About two hours after the raid, the channel showed pictures of the theatre strewn with bodies, some severely mutilated, others with their heads down as if they had passed out.
Booby traps
Some of the hostages began attempting to escape after the rebels shot two of their captives.
In the ensuing panic, the hostages inadvertently set off booby traps laid in the theatre by the rebels.
Russian special forces then rushed to their aid, engaging in a pitched gun battle which lasted more than an hour.
None of the special forces were killed or injured in the operation.
“We succeeded in preventing mass deaths and the collapse of the building which we had been threatened with,” said Russian Deputy Interior Minister Vladimir Vasilyev.
The BBC’s Jonathan Charles, who is at the scene, said the hostages looked shocked and terrified as they emerged.
As troops secured the building, special teams were deployed to disarm mines and explosives planted by the rebels inside the Palace of Culture theatre.
Takeover
The siege started on Wednesday when around 50 Chechen rebels seized control of the theatre, about 4 kilometres (2.7 miles) south-east of the Kremlin.
At least 700 Russians and foreigners were inside, watching a performance of the musical Nord-Ost.
The rebels threatened to shoot the audience and blow up the building if Russian security forces intervened.
They demanded the withdrawal of Russian troops from Chechnya and an end to the war there.
On Friday, the rebels released 19 hostages, but negotiations to release others broke down.
**************************************
This appears to be an astounding victory for the Russian special purpose units involved inspite of the tragic death of some of the hostages.
I wonder what will happen now in Chechnya and the Pankisi Gorge?
inkRE: Chechens threaten to kill 700 hostages in Moscow theatre
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 24-10-02 AT 10:51 PM (GMT)]SOC,
The trouble is that not all Chechens in Chechnya are anti-Moscow and its a good idea to keep pro-Russian Chechens on side (or at least alive). To be honest there seems no way out – no chance of storming the building (depending on how many terrorists there actually are) and there doesn’t seem a negotiable escape.
I fear the worst but my thoughts and prayers are with the families of those inside (and of course with the hostages themselves).
inkRE: Chechens threaten to kill 700 hostages in Moscow theatre
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 24-10-02 AT 10:51 PM (GMT)]SOC,
The trouble is that not all Chechens in Chechnya are anti-Moscow and its a good idea to keep pro-Russian Chechens on side (or at least alive). To be honest there seems no way out – no chance of storming the building (depending on how many terrorists there actually are) and there doesn’t seem a negotiable escape.
I fear the worst but my thoughts and prayers are with the families of those inside (and of course with the hostages themselves).
inkRE: Russian FAEs (thermobaric weapons)… AGAIN
Curious looking magazine on that AK-74M… hmmm, trick question indeed.
inkRE: Russian FAEs (thermobaric weapons)… AGAIN
Curious looking magazine on that AK-74M… hmmm, trick question indeed.
Sign In
