@J Boyle;- Give us a break. The issue with Concorde wasn’t about blasting across the continental US at Mach 2. Ever. There were huge organised protests to stop Concorde even LANDING in the US. Were these protests only organised by environmentalists…? Doubtful. Nationalistic sour-grapes – sure – in the US. Bigtime.
Did the problems in the US contribute to other airlines cancellations…? Probably.
Had more Concordes been produced, it would inevitably have been more economic for the manufactures – simple economics. As for the airlines – they charged a lot of money for the tickets and had no shortage of customers. By the time the service ended – the aircraft were old – and in the current climate – uneconomic to replace.
Isn’t it funny that today, there are designs for SST’s – all smaller to make them more ‘economical’…..
The SST never got beyond a wooden mock-up and wasn’t in the same league as Concorde.
It’ll be very interesting to see what the reaction is in the US if Skylon manages to go forward……
As for departures from this forum – what’s a ‘serious and senior member’…? Get real – this is the internet. No one on here has to ‘qualify’ – if they did, it’d be pretty quiet in here..! There are some great posters – and some complete numpties. All part of the landscape. It’s ALL fluff and none of it rally matters. When the screens go black – the real world carries on as before.
I have no idea of the veracity of this, but back in the 1960’s, I was told that ATC Cadets had been having AEF rides in Frightnings during Summer Camp (…and managing to ‘cryaroo’ too..). Did such ‘Air Experience Flights’ really take place I wonder….? Lucky lads if they did…:)
Seems a strange coincidence that all manufacturing equipment and engineering drawings(where known) were quickly destroyed as soon as it was possible after the takeover. Napiers were innovative and the sabre could cause serious damage to the merlin business…rolls needed the income to finance the growing jet arm so to lose anything to the sabre or indeed napiers would have been disastrous.
No conspiracy theory as it was business to rolls….and they were worried by napiers.
I suspect that’s not a wholly fair appraisal. Jets had arrived and the demise of large piston engines in front-line a/c was writ large. The Government had tens of thousands of aircraft engines on it’s hands. With plenty of reliable and trusted Merlins and Griffons etc around – why on earth would they (..or RR..) persevere with an engine that had an established reputation (Rightly or wrongly…) for problems. It’s also worth saying that such were the upheavals of the time, such decisions were natural, no matter how appalling they may seem to enthusiast seventy years later.
If only a few Typhoons had been saved….it a tragedy. Mind you, they might well have needed quite a stash of engines and spares… The only chance now is probably Mr.Weeks’s Tempest – as close as we are likely to get – but it’s a tall order. (I wonder when it was that the very last Sabre ran…? Now there is an engine ripe for a ground-runner.)
It should be said that the Typhoon itself didn’t fail so much as that the requirements moved, perhaps excessively, towards higher altitude operations for which the Sabre was unsuitable. This makes it difficult to see how the Typhoon could have been employed as an interceptor, other than the way that it was. Had the UK been faced with a significant Luftwaffe bomber threat in 1943, the Typhoon would have been capable of dealing with it. but no such threat existed.
Apologies for a slight digression;- Whatever the requirements were – and all designs were subject to these changing – in the early days the Typhoon was very problematic. Whereas the Spitfires wing naturally facilitated significant development and saw it through a doubling of power, the Hurricane had no such potential and as the Typhoon was already in development no attempt was made. Unfortunately, the Hurricane’s greatest Achilles Heel, it’s thick wing, was repeated to a large extent in the Typhoon and no amount of power was able to get around the problems of a low Critical Mach number. (Not a problem confined to the Typhoon, as the P38 suffered the same shortcoming for example.). All this was clear to Hawkers from quite early on. Their response, the Tempest, solved this issue – but not the problems with the Sabre – which never seem to have been fully solved and was doubtless why all the Sabre-engines Typhoons and Tempests were withdrawn and scrapped in very short-order as soon as the war ended. Lack of power was never really the issue with the Sabre. Aerodynamic issues aside, the problems with the Sabre and structural problems with the empenage (Later fixed.) all mitigated against the Typhoons success as a fighter when introduced. The Spitfire’s original wing, never being designed with hardpoints did not lend itself, structurally, to the ground-attack role. Being large and powerful, the Typhoon filled this role by default, despite it’s own shortcomings.
Early in the war, the RAF were somewhat obsessed with high altitude performance. Later in the war, other than for the interception of the occasional German high-altiude PR a/c, much of the action was at medium to low level.
Of course, strictly-speaking, the Typhoon was never a true dive-bomber like the A-36. Was one really needed..? Probably not. I agree with Graham – and the results speak for themselves. Nor would the A-36 have been able to carry the same bomb-load as effectively as the Typhoon.
There is an important aspect of the Typhoon’s ground-attack operations in the ETO that greatly added to it’s effectiveness, namely the ‘Cab-Rank’ system (Perfectly augmented by the introduction of RP’s.). This was effectively a force-multiplier – in much the same way as radar was during the BoB. I may be wrong – but I think that bomb-equiped Spitfires also participated in this system, but the higher bomb-load made the Typhoon far more suited to this type of operation.
It’s also worth stating that, even if the Typhoon had have been a success as an interceptor at higher altitudes, there is no logical reason why it should not also have been used as it actually was, at lower levels, as in fact the Tempest was.
Here’s another one of the crazy ones….
http://uk.screen.yahoo.com/video/playlist/daredevil-stunts/insanely-low-plane-flyby-050000590.html
:stupid:
Awesome. When can we get a ride..!?!?!?! :cool::cool::cool:
Sad to hear. Read many a good article from him. RIP.
@PlaneMike;- Thanks.
As a matter of interest – does anyone happen to know where JM is buried?
I used to bump into GT when I used to do a bit of Hillclimbing best part of forty years ago. GT used to campaign one of those M635CSi ‘Batmobiles’ (I hope I’ve got the nomenclature right.) with great panache. Quite a character. RIP Gerry.
Charites Commision website;-
http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/
Search for ‘Spitfire’;-Charities matching your search …
Your search has found 4 charities which are shown below.
Click on the link provided to view a charity’s details.
Otherwise click New Search to try again or Refine Search for more search options
Registered Number Charity name
298229 ROYAL AIR FORCE MANSTON SPITFIRE AND HURRICANE MEMORIAL TRUST Registered
313855 THE SPITFIRE MITCHELL MEMORIAL FUND Registered
299033 THE SPITFIRE SOCIETY Registered
328658 THE SPITFIRE TRUST Removed
Maybe the TC website needs updating. Alternatively, perhaps it’s some different form of ‘Trust’….?
Website states;-
‘We are already half way to the £1,650,000 needed for an outright purchase.
‘http://www.spitfireheritagetrust.com/#!perranporth/c5wb
They’ve raised £825,000 then. Not bad going apparently.
Heres an Acroduster…watch VERY carefully at 0:59…….and at 2:39…!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IahE6N0h0Xc
Great music from Mr.Stills too…:p
Haha…..give it time…! :angel:
@Propstrike;- Nice period film there in that Link. Correct, I would demure from discussion of specifics on an open forum.
When I started flying, spinning and recovery were a normal part of the syllabus – which hadn’t really changed since the Great War. Today, other, arguably less relevant material for GA (Such as CRM.) has been added, at the expense of vital spin training. In my opinion, simply teaching a student to avoid the incipient spin is next to useless, since, if he/she gets into one in a average GA a/c it’ll have hardly been deliberate…and at that point rather too late to get out the books…! It’ll also probably be at low altitude…. The effects of this backwards step have only been mitigated by the generally very docile characteristics of modern GA a/c.
In general terms, I’d say that if one is going to aerobat any a/c, then practicing spin-recovery – with plenty of air below you – is essential. Most aerobatic a/c are strong and don’t break easily, but they will still spin very well. I haven’t aerobatted a Stearman, but in the Pitts, it’s certainly alarming at first, as being so small & close-coupled, it all happens pretty fast. The height loss is pretty sobering too, especially if one makes a hash of it…. The ground certainly always looks a lot closer when spinning inverted…..