Avionics are again dependent on what the buyer wants . The new engines also greatly reduce the smoke however it still isnt up to the levels of the newer western aircraft from my observation . If a buyer is interested one can do up the Mig-29OVT quite nicely to make it into quite a potent Fighter however where it really looses out to fighters such as rafale , EF , gripen , F-35 is in the area of LO ,say what may but Simple RAM paint isnt going to offer the level of LO as say shaping is . Put in a AESA , some modern Avionics , A a2a,a2g integrated targeting suite and you have quite a potent multi role aircraft in my opinion..

How far is the LO concept going to work when you have weapons and drop tanks hooked up externally? F35 is in a different class altogether vs the EF/Gripen/Rafale. None of the Euro birds have that kind of stealth and are bloody expensive too. You could probly have 2-3 MiG 35s @ the same price. And NO Euro bird is good enough to take on 2 MiG35s A2A. Even 1 on 1 they would be hardpressed, LO notwithstanding.
For the IAF MRCA requirement, this would be one helluva bird: Zhuk MFE/ Bars29/EL 2052?/ZHuk A + French/INdian/Israeli avionics & ECM + TVC. Ya, I would pit it against anything in the neighborhood or even against anything the Euros can put up. The newer RD 33MK engines for the MiG 29k are still being tested aren’t they? So I don’t think the a/c at farnborough or MAKs have/had the newer engines, they are to be smokefree for sure.

Regards,
USS.

Fairly disappointing if the Indian Air Force goes for the Zhuk-ME over the MFE..or even the Zhuk-A in development, last seems remote at this point, and not even the Elta-2052.

The Zhuk ME is a good radar, but not cutting edge. :rolleyes: 😎

Agreed; wonder why the IAF didn’t opt for the phased array variant of the ME? not available for export?

The “Zhuk-MEh” is a multifunctional multimode coherent X-band radar. It can be delivered with a slotted antenna array ((ShchAR)) (four targets each) and a phased antenna array ((FAR)) (8 targets each).

Austin, the IAF losing BVR advantage just because PAF introduces C5 is a little farfetched IMHO. The R77AV is too closely matched with C5 to turn the tide right away. Add to that derby/python (LCA) & Mica (M2k-5) combos and the PAF’s gonna have its back against the wall at all times. Another advantage that IAF has over PAF f16s is ability to combine lighter IRST a/c like MiG 29 backed by heavier a/c like Su 30mki and make snipe attacks.

Regards,
CM.

actually SeaLordLawrence is pretty neutral (even pretty pro-Russian aircraft producer) on matters like this, it seems like you are the one that seems to get upset over nothing.

I’m not so sure about that, SeaLL might be neutral otherwise, but this thread sure does not seem to highlight that neutral tendency of his. Nick pretty much has him on a number of important points:
1) Insisting upon the media reports being completely true despite the fact that the official document is yet to be released. He seems to make his vehemence even stronger since he cannot (has not so far anyway) pointed out any official indian sources, only second/third party sources at best.
2) Falsifying and sanctioning media reports as per his convenience. hence the tendency to ignore the israeli report while taking the indian media reports as gospel.
3) Categorically denying his own comments about India wanting the JSF and being turned down by the U.S. Again SLLis unwilling/unable to backup his claim with any sources.
4) Making slanderous comments such as Britain “owning” india which clearly belie his bias.

And you call him neutral.Riiight.

Regards,
USS.

Blackjacks for India??

Chew on this – The Backfire’s out and the Blackjack seems to be in 😮 Like to see this big boy carry some 6X2 Superbrahmos :diablo:

As posted by Igorr @ BRF:

Tu-160 it flies to India

General of the Army Vladimir Mikhaylov did not exclude by central board VVS RF, that over the long term Moscow sells Delhi strategic bombers. “in the deeper stage of military technical collaboration we can place to India strategic bombers, in particular Tu-160, with the usual forms of armament”, he said by the central board Of “interfaksu-AVN”, commenting on outcomes of the visit into the capital RF of the chief of staff VVS of India the Chief Air Marshal shashindry t’yagi, which passed from 28 May through 4 June. At the same time by central board VVS expressed doubt about the fact that Canada, where the delegation of the Federal Service for military technical collaboration RF conducted the presentation of transport aircraft Il-76 and helicopters Mi-17, can stock up Russian aircraft. http://www.aviaport.ru/news/2006/06/09/106074.html (translation with babelfish)

Source: the newspaper”independent military review”

Pray tell, Mr. USS Novice, what gives you the moral superiority and right to judge the morals of another government? Are you really so high and mighty? Got no sins? I say check your own backyard and the skeletons in your closet before you do. .

Nice try at making me look like the hi’nmighty type Mr. Crobato, but calling into question a clearly inhuman act on the part of any govt. does not make me mr. self righteous. Or will you have the audacity to ask the whole world of their misbegotten moral superiority for questioning Hitler/stalin/mao and the like? for all of china’s “progress”, unfortunately it still severly lags behind when it comes to human rights. And in my book that is the first proof of a govt’s character, obviously calling “a spade a spade” is something that is not too palatable for you. So you and your cronies would rather the world just gloss over all of these violations and only look at how china has made progress economically and militarily over the past few years. nice try, but that brings me back to the original point: the world has a slightly different value system – try to to understand it, some call it democracy.

Maybe the Chinese government still sucks in some aspects of human rights, but they still have managed to do something no government in the 20th century has done, which is to lift the lives of over 1.3 billion people from destitute poverty to at least a livable scale, true hope and promise of a better future and now shows the growth of a burgeoning middile class. They got food to eat, a roof over their families, schools to send their children. While the rights are still lacking, but at least the current Chinese state managed to provide and secure all the basics needed for a decent living. You can go talk about human rights of the Tibetans but even now, the Tibetans got something they did not have before—education, roads, modern plumbing, electricity, modern transportation, merchant goods, decent order, telecommunications and even the internet. .

Boy Mr. Crobato, you, plawolf, tinman and chinawhite are all cut from the same cloth aren’t you? So now you want to go so far as to justify chinese imperialism in tibet that too in the name of an education the Tibetans never wanted, roads they did not need, modern plumbing that was again unnecessary? They were fine just the way they were thanks very much and if they wanted these things they could have got them on thier own without being forced to have ’em. it is sad indeed that you guys don’t see that the chinese themselves fought against an imperialistic yoke just about 100 years ago irrespective of the fancy “civilization” that the latter had brought in.

Hooboy, those reds sure do a good job brainwashing, pathetic.

USS.

Exactly. It behooves me to understand how India could end up being only a third as rich as a country held back by such a government.

Try a little harder to understand what democracy means and then perhaps you could differentiate between a political ideology (democracy) and an economic model (capitalism). While china started following the capitalist model (opening up) a lot earlier than india, the latter held on to the “Mixed economy” model until the mid nineties. hence the difference in economies/riches. OTOH, while china still has a single party that makes all critical decisions for the individual (including how many kids to have), it is only natural that its citizens might find it a wee bit difficult to understand the democratic model that India has followed.

In other words, democracy does not guarantee wealth, it does however, safeguard some semblance of human rights for its citizens.

Goldendragon,
Let me ask you a question: while it is obvious that the chinese govt. has a clear edge in terms of riches made, where is their edge when it comes to humane values???? One wonders if all this new found wealth will prevent future episodes similar to Tsqre massacre, cultural revolution, or give some semblance of freedom to poor tibetans etc etc. Or has the ancient, spiritual middle kingdom now embraced capitalism so completely that perhaps wealth is the only new value left for a decrepit system of govt.?

Regards,
USS.

[u]Naval Fulcrum Resurrected[/u]

MiG-29K/KUB is equipped with up rated RD-33MK engines with 9,000-kg thrust with afterburner, a significant increase. The direct benefit is in the area of greater payloads stated to be in the region of 5500-kg something that can be fully exploited if the two Indo-Russian “Super Weapons” under joint development can be accommodated, namely the BrahMos Anti-Ship Cruise Missile (ASCM) and R-172 ultra-long-range Beyond Visual Range Air-to-Air Missile (BVRAAM).

5500kg??? Since when? all commonly available sources point at 4000-4500kg, would be awesome news if true. Makes the MiG35 a true multirole a/c with a superb strike capability.

Regards,
Uss novice.

Hovering (especially at altitudes where radar performance is good) would cut down the already comparatively short endurance of a helo to an inacceptable degree. The only 2 AEW helos I know of (SeaKing and Ka-31) provide 360° coverage anyway, IIRC.

Can’t the flanker with TVC hover as well? Or would that burn too much fuel? But this and Nighthawk’s piece partly answers my question about using a flanker as an AEW platform.

Thanks,

USS.