We’ll just cut off your cider. 😛
An tis proper coider an all none of yer fizzy* muck
*GASsy 🙂
Between the two isn’t it? With its own lovely railway station.
Stationing their lordships at HMS Properjob in the West Country would certainly seem amusing. But of course a number of them have already retired (on full pay of course to ‘reflect their invaluable experience to be drawn on blah blah blah’) to Dartmouth so that they can keep an eye on the young ‘uns and complain about standards slipping.
Al
Modern fast jets are incredibly strong. They need to be to withstand the loads (that being the definition of strength :)) imposed in flight. There is an oft (mis)quoted example of how many VW Beetles you can put on an Typhie’s wing.
I guess the question is, how destructive are modern SAMs/AAMs? We would usually expect warhead to be in the lead in the constant race between warhead and armour. In order to increase the probability of a hit on fast hard maneuvering targets we don’t tend to use Armour Piercing hittiles against fast jets but a nice HE round to give a big volume of sky which is dangerous for the target.
Al
AFAIK NO. SeaRAM is currently deployed only on LCS-2 Independence.
It was trialled on a T42 but then 911 happened and anything which might be used to defend the US was rapidly taken back.
There is a resistance to arming logistic vessels. (This is certainly the case in UK and may be partly down to Rn v RFA snobbery.)
I think that there is a general concern that weapon systems require integration and thus sensors and personnel which logistic vessels do not have. Partly for effective use of the weapon and partly to avoid blue on blue situations.
Additionally as Grim says, you put weapons on a non-combatant and it may end up taking risks which it has no business taking. Either through crew overconfidence or being tasked inappropriately.
Al
What’s this?
F3?
F3a?
F4a?
F5?
I believe that ‘swing role’ F3 was called EF3
There are consistent rumours of the crabfats being clever and using that big old ‘foxhunter’ antenna for ESM and ECM. Which makes sense it being the biggest antenna on the airframe an all.
AL
The Typhoon IS what the RAF need.
It is not the best plane in the world but it will be able to do what it is asked to and need for the foreseeable future. its only real competators are the Rafale and F-18E as both the F-16 and F-15 are really at the end of their potential growth. Both of the former are excellent platforms whilst the JSF is an unknown quantity until it actually enters service.
+1
Al
A chap I was at university with did some research on a sort of scooped dorsal intake and he claimed that it allowed for good airflow at a wide range of AoA, somewhat counter-intuitively.
Al
When the C1/C2/C3 concepts were first described publicly, the RN said that C3 was envisaged as a minor combatant, summed up by Richard Beedall as –
Thanks for reposting that. Tis the first time that I’ve read it properly.
Lynx OR MCM OR Special Forces
I, in common with many of those posting designs here seemingly, have been assuming helo AND mission deck for MCM
Al
That’s the question I was asking:cool:
Don’t forget most of the rest of the surface fleet are going to be moved there, plus 2 nice big shiny aircraft carriers are going to be located there too.
Sorry, you missed the smartarsery 🙂 I can’t in all good faith refer to current (or recent) RN as a fleet. Flotilla at best.
Although of course our most recent surface units are all big ‘uns.
Al
Would be nice to see her turned into a museum, would there be room enough at Portsmouth with most of the surface fleet being relocated there or would it have to be moved to Devonport?
Would the current flotilla really fill up Pompey dockyards?
Al
Er – the Type 22 design is the same age. Requirement issued 1967, first order placed 1972, first one commissioned 1979 – the same year as the first Georges Leygues. In fact, a few months earlier.
A salutory lesson in reading what is actually there not what one thinks is there. I read T22 as T23!
What lessons have been learned from the T23?
OTMH I have:
Udermanning and necessity to embark extra crew when entering port (or has this been solved?)
The comedy of errors inherent in trying to run C3I by running several disparate C2 systems and integrating them manually (or has this been solved)
The huge weight of ancilliary equipment needed to operate Seawolf (CAMM and (maybe) Artisan will presumably do away with a lot of radar antennae and associated electronics cabinets and power drain)
Would rafting a la submarines allow for removal of complicated drive system in favour of simple diesels?
What are the seakeeping qualities of T23s in service?
Al
What do we know about the seakeeping qualities of the French C70s?
Completely ignoring mine own warnings about assuming that re-engineering a warship is as easy as swapping bits around in a paint programme
C70s have already been fitted with*
Diesels – Cassard sub-type
TAS – George Leygues
Big covered area suitable for deploying MCM – see above
Medium calibre gun up front (albeit 100mm is a bit girly for RN tastes)
Automatic, turretted small calibres amidships – Saudi sub-type
Big deck house on hangar roof (I’m thinking space for CAMM silo here) –
George Leygues
SSM launchers
Hangar and pad for 2 light helos – George Leygues
Nice tall reinforced mast for ripe for Artisan
EO system – Cassard sub-type
Used as the basis for a Stealthy successor (La Fayette)
Al
* and therefore structural calcs and drawings have already been done ……..
As amusing as this game of ‘bait the spams on this forum‘ is.
I think that the limiting factor might not be paper capability but operational availability. All of the European navies have been starved of cash and I suspect that routine, planned maintenance has just not been up to scratch.
Of course in this alternative universe we offer the Mexican/latino population Florida and Texas and an undertaking that the new regime will stop actively scapegoating Spanish speakers for all of their ills. With a monopoly on the underpaid, unqualified* jobs our fifth columnists bring the USA to its knees. We block up the **** and the brain drowns in ****.
Al
*which ain’t the same as unskilled…….
The USN is designed by nature to fight a global war on multiple fronts. Also, the US has vast interests around the world and the Navy provides the brute power to maintain control. Sure a navy half the size would be great for a purely defensive role of the US Mainland. Yet, after WWII that was proven unwise. Also, the sheer size and power of the US Military provides strong deterrence to would be adversaries………….
What the USN does is provide deterrents to countries that would impose there will on weaker nations…………..
That the USN provides a powerful coercive force strategically and tactically I would agree.
That we are all grateful that US in WII intervention means that we aren’t all speaking Russian* I would agree.
That we are all grateful that continued US engagement during the Cold War means that we aren’t all speaking Russian and that State Capitalism in the USSR was bankrupted I would agree.
That the US provided aid in the Falklands conflict and directly prevented even greater loss of UK life I would agree.
That all US foreign policy interventions have been benign and/or on the side of the small guy or the victim I cannot agree.
Al
* most historians and military historians agree that the USSR would have beaten Nazi Germany eventually
Lived most of my life just up the road in Stanstead Abbotts, I was the only child of three not born in Harlow Hospital.
You could of gone for a hattrick and added Waltham Cross; AKA the ghetto of East Herts.
Or why not ‘ghetto‘ or ‘sink estate‘ class
Easterhouse
Leigh Park
Moss Side
Rowner
Southmead
et al
‘I don’t know what they do to the enemy etc etc‘
Personally I think most of the names for the RN fleet in future should come from old Capital ships and cruisers they had all the best names anyway it would be a shame never to use them again.
Oh well if we are resorting to SERIOUS suggestions then you are most certainly correct.
Al