RimmerHmmm, not sure why they have the Pilatus PC21 or the Super Tucano down as there stage 1 basic trainers. Really they are stage 2 intermediate and the PC21 can be used as an alternative to the jet stage 3 advanced trainer.
The Grob 115 makes far more sense for that level of training.
Frankly the best solution at the moment would be to slip Indian pilots onto power by the hour contractor training or place them with foreign airforces much like with those trained with the RAF as part of the Hawk contract or even sign up for NFTC in Canada as an interim solution.
If you look at the numbers India needs to traim, then I think NFTC may not be an option…
Rimmeragain, this is flawed. Last time Oman has any trouble was almost 40 years ago…
Yeman is in no position to attack. In fact Omans Jaguars and F-16 are more then enough.
Everyone seems keen on playing the Iranian bogey. Iran has made more threats against Pakistan that actually shares a large land border with Iran, yet Pakistan stations no troops or major airbases near Iran.
Oman managed to remain neutral and unhurt during
1) The Iranian revolution
2) Iran-Iraq war
3) Gulf War 1
4) Gulf War 2
What has changed?
These aircraft are a gift from Oman to Britain in terms of jobs and money. Thats all….
RimmerYou HAVE to be kidding me!? 😮
RimmerThere are accounts that Oman is not pleased with its F-16s. The USA limits the weapons it will sell to Oman, or allow it to integrate with its F-16s (as it does with, e.g., the UAE). e.g. Oman may want to buy Storm Shadow, or a Typhoon-compatible (very easy modification) of the Black Shaheen Scalp/Storm Shadow variant: that is not permitted on its F-16s.
Oman has a similar land area to the UK. 36 fighters is a small number to cover that area. It is part of a regional alliance, & it expected to make a contribution to it if need arises: its proximity to Iran is therefore less significant than the proximity of its allies, but in any case, the capital is only a couple of hundred km from Iran, the most populated region is to the NW of the capital (i.e closer to Iran), & they have a maritime boundary in the Strait of Hormuz.
If you were to suggest that the UAE is over-armed, I would probably agree with you, but Oman? It’s bigger than the UAE, & has more citizens. Will it be over-armed with 20% of the number of modern fighters?
Er…since when did population size or land mass become criteria for fleet size? Poor argument. In which case surely Canada and Indonesia are massively under armed in your weird criteria?
Oman does not really face a major threat from anyone.
Apart from those pesky Bulgerians! 😉
Rimmer.What is behind J-7 hotdog? A poster that makes fun of the Chinese Mig21 (J7) by calling it a hotdog. That same plane is doing 4 decades service with the Indian Airforce. Both the Mig21 and its derivatives have shown impressive records. Even these days the planes is a remarkable one. Anyway back to the topic. It beats me why someone should see the reasons of buying Typhoons by Oman should be relates to Bulgaria or Pakistani harbour called Gwadar. I have seen several posters moving towards good posting but unfortunately some do not follow. I have read Oman buys Insas. Insas is produced by India. I see no reason making strange remarks about that. I hope our friend here moves towards related and informative postings and not the usual anti Pakistan remark.
I think his tongue was firmly in his cheek Insig. It was just a joke.
RimmerInsig put it nicely. The threat from Iran has expanded, Oman has rightly decided to field a new, top of the range fighter. F16’s would be kore cost effective, but then Typhoon would be the stronger option, in this case they obviously feel the need for the stronger weapon. Oman happens to be one of the closest countries to Iran across the Straits which is incredibly important strategically, plus Oman is a close friend of many of the countries Iran dislikes.
And you can’t really ignore that “small piece of land”, it’d be like the US ignoring Alaska during the Cold War. It’s still part of their territory and needs defending. And the rest of Oman’s coast isn’t exactly far away from Iran either. Muscat is about 100 miles from Iranian territory.
As I said, I dont doubt Oman needs kit, but 24 Tyyphoons seems like a governmental to governmentak bailout for BAE rather then an urgent Omani requirment.
You also cannot compare the inventory of 2 frontline NATO states during the cold war to a country that has no land borders with any enemy whatsoever.
In fact, not only will Oman never be invaded by Iran, but if a regional conflict did flare up I imagine the Iranians would have their hands full dealing with everyone else. In addition they have never shown any hostility to Oman.
RimmerVideo of PAF Block 52s first flight courtesy of Pakdef.
Awsome!
RimmerAs Swerve has said, Iran has become the major threat in the region and most of the Gulf states, Oman included seemed to be arming with an eye towards them. It’s bound to happen when Iran sees itself as the leader of the region and no one else really likes it.
In your expert opinion, what should Oman have?
Please, we can do without the sarcasm. I dont claim to be an “expert”.
Oman is geographically not that close to Iran as other states (barring the small piece of land it occupies on the tip of Hormuz)
Its Amraam F-16s are just not for strike nor does it face constant air space violations.
Every nation has a right to defend itself. I just sense this deal if more a case of Oman helping Britain then vice versa.If it was number Oman needed, all it has to do is order 24 more F-16s. A much more cost effective solution c’est na pas?
RimmerJ 11 A – License Production
J 11 B – Stealing – Just ask Mr. Pogosyan
Easy, this is off topic for a PAF thread…
Rimmer24 Typhoons and 12 Block 52s.
Why? Thats overkill for Yeman surely and they are not planning to take on Saudi right?
This will increase RAFO capability massively.
Jobs for the (BAE) boys?
RimmerI don’t know the reasons why PAF needs a French avionics and weapons package.
If I’m not mistaken, then the J-10’s KLJ-10 radar was chosen over the Russian Zhemchug radar and a possible Israeli radar also, due to superior performance. KLJ-10 is supposed to be a phased array radar rumoured to be developed from Russia’s NIIP company’s Pero radar.
If KJL-7 is indeed a “watered down” derivative of the KLJ-10, it is likely that it is a phased array radar also, and must be quite good for a smaller fighter like JF-17. I think PAF might specifically want the Mica missile, and hence is asking for avionics from Dassault.
You may very well be completely right.
RimmerSign, you may compare the specs of Tejas Mk.1 with ADA placards at Aero-India 2009 (google image search; or search forum archives for my posts), with Gripen-D’s specs that are given at the official website of Swedish FMW.
Both are near-identical.
I have already posted and compared both specs literally 20-25 times earlier, and from now I’ll just state it.
Comparing specs is one thing, but last time I checked Gripen was in service with several nations and integrated with several AMM and AGM missiles and has an advanced radar.
Specs on paper are one thing, but reality is very different.
I could right a spec sheet for a plane and post it on the internet. Does not mean I will have a F-22 beater in my air force anytime soon….
Ultimately, if Gripen and LCA were similar India would have no need for a MRCA contest.
If we are being honest…..
RimmerF-16A version in clean configuration
RimmerGood questions. I think you gave the only options left. China having problems getting it and Pakistan having no cash. I think the second has the problems of integration. Plug and play is nice but never cheap. And with more nations involved you get delays.
I think it is sometimes impossible to keep these two seprated. JF17 and LCA are, even for crazy people like us, comparable. My impression is that FC20 will become the real block x and JF17 will move more slowly towards a newer block.
Shame we cannot go for Israeli option for this, as they seem to have a nice variety of radars and AAMs ideal size for JF-17. As this market is off limits t us it puts the Europeans in a much stronger position.
RimmerWe pay tribute to Peter Christy, a Pakistani Christian war hero of 1965
We would like to pay high tribute to our Christian Fighter Pilot who served well for our country Pakistan and did not hesitate to risk his life for the cause of our nation.
Peter Christy a fighter pilot, a consummate military professional, a natural, charismatic leader, and a true, heroic servant of our republic he was always committed to flying for his country and taking risks for a national cause and had offered his life for the defense of his country.
Mr. Christy was born in Karachi , Drigh road cant bazaar; in 1937 the son of M.B Christy he initially achieved secondary school education from ST. PATRIC School Saddar, Karachi and passed matriculation with good marks. According to Mr. Christy teachers he always had been very intelligent and clever student who always performed very well in sports while studying.
Football was Mr. Christy favorite sport and he had good reputation in football. after doing Matriculation he joined Pakistan Air Force and gained basic flying training from PAF Academy (Risalpur) and begin his career in 1962 as (Flying Commission Officer) by the passage of time he was promoted to (Flight Officer) and then later to (Flight Lieutenant) due to his great personality, performance and goodwill.
During the war of 1965 when enemy’s of Pakistan attacked on our nation this talented man did not even care of his precious life he was ready to defend his country at any cost he targeted our enemy’s with B-57 BOMBER AIRCRAFT and greatly affected their bad intentions he was victorious in many of his encounters with enemy aircraft. His perseverance as a soldier created a new level of dedication to the country as well as inspired Fighter Pilots in future to come Due to his bravery and honor The Government of Pakistan awarded him special military reward and he continued his road to success and in 1968 he was further promoted to SQUADRON LEADER.
On 4th of December 1971 at 4:00 o’clock in the evening from PAF Base Shah rah-e-Faisal Karachi he was given a special mission to destroy an Indian Air base (JAAM-NAGAR) because missile attack had been increased from the Indian side and their fighter planes were continuously targeting our Flying base and other areas of Karachi.
But in-spite of all these hurdles and danger he had high aims this brave and fearless pilot was going with (DO OR DIE) vision. Mr. Christy successfully completed his mission but his plane became a victim of opposite attack and he therefore martyred for his country and acknowledged his name in the golden history of our martyred Great one’s.
Due to his fearless and great performance The Government of Pakistan awarded him Military Reward (SITAR-E-JURAT) because he had shown bravery and courage in Times of War. Great people like Mr. Christy inspire our young Christians to become a successful, well recognized and courage’s person like them in all walks of their life and Give Glory to the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
“Our thoughts and prayers are with his devoted family as they mourn his loss, a loss we feel as well. Pakistan , our Air Force and Our community are eternally grateful for his leadership and accomplishments, and will remember him always,”
http://www.pakistanchristianpost.com/headlinenewsd.php?hnewsid=1889
Sign In
