Dave HomewoodFirstly I want to point out I have not used the phrase “No real fighters”. I said “Any real fighters”. 🙂 And I have explained I was talking about replica vs real.
Secondly I fully agree with you that the replica WWI aircraft are very important in helping to keep the history alive, and that yes those aircraft replicate important types from history. But I wasn’t questioning that at all.
I merely asked if any real or any WWII fighters were booked. I now know there is some interesting stuff going along, thanks to DaveM2 and also the Classic Wings website man who has contacted me by email, and that it looks as if it were going to be a very exciting and interesting airshow that covers both World Wars.
I meant no disrespect to the Classic Fighters airshow and their efforts, nor to the history that they are attempting to recreate.
My personal preference is to see the powerful World War Two fighters. They are what attracts me to an airshow. They are simply stunning. Yes WWI replicas are nice too, and interesting, and I certainly don’t ignore them when i get a chance to see them, but my personal preference is for WWII all the way.
I fully respect your stance though Melvyn of trying to bring World War One aviation to the fore so more of us can learn about it. I’d love to see some photos of the Memorial Flight you worked on please. And maybe some interesting true WWI stories.We need more of it on this forum. I tried to get something going a few weeks back by posting about a series of articles I have about a New Zealander who flew in the RNAS during WWI in Greece and had many adventures, but not much interest was shown.
I hope that at the airshow the commentators will highlight the importance of the New Zealanders who served in WWI’s RFC, RAF and RNAS. Most Kiwis would think it were mainly a British vs German air war and not realise we were involved in the air. Some famous Kiwis in WWI aviation inclode Rhodes-Moorehouse VC, Caldwell and even Sir Keith Park.
Good luck to Classic Wings, I’ll get there if I possibly find a way to.
Dave HomewoodErr, Melvyn, I meant ‘real’ as opposed to ‘replica’, which all the WWI fighters are.
I did not mean WWI fighters are not worthy. I have read a bit about WWI action lately actually. Particularly the exploits of Cambridge’s own well-known ace Keith ‘Grid’ Caldwell, who was an awesome WWI fighter pilot. I see oyur point that there is a lot of history there, but I think you misunderstood my message.
Personally I like the 1980’s and 1990’s-built “WWI” replicas, but I don’t find them anywhere near as exciting or interesting as genuine WWII fighters like the Spitfire and Mustang and Kittyhawk They are my real interest. I’d also love to see the Hurricane someday, which never ventures this far north, and the Corsair. I would not make the trip all the way down to Blenheim to see just replicas, that is what I meant.
Dave HomewoodThanks guys. Lovely photos Alex.
Dave, two P51D’s? Has the ex-AFC one not left NZ yet? Or is there a new one in the country? Has Ray Hanna imported his one?
Whose Harvards were those? I take it they were temporary schemes just fr the day? The Italian scheme looks nice.
Dave HomewoodMaybe Skysport did begin this project, but the website states:
“The Westland will be completed by Tony Ditheridge of Hawker Restorations, a leading supplier of high-quality Hurricanes to the world’s collectors of fine aircraft.”
There is no mention of this becoming a dramatic film. The story is totally wrong for a cinematic film, it’d never be funded. It will, I’m certain, be a documentary that’ll be sold to help fund the project.
As for the age of the airframe, the site also states:
“The club’s new Westland fuselage can now be seen at the Shuttleworth
Collection at Old Warden, Bedfordshire.”
This indicates to me that it is either a fairly new build, or this is a different group who have bought the aircraft. So hold off on the typically British pessimism for a while because something might just actually be happening here.
DaveM2, are there collectors involved in this from NZ? I just wondered because of the possibility it may come to NZ.
Dave HomewoodAh, thanks, I missed the bit where they gave it to the Finns. Still an interesting history though, It’ll be interesting to see how the restoration pans out.
Dave HomewoodLovely, especially with the rapeseed backdrop. Why does it have the Olympic logo? Is that a genuine 1936 scheme? Or just some more recent sponsorship thing?
Dave HomewoodF3Hadlow, not meaning to sound like one of those condescending old buggers, but for someone so young as you, you have certainly mastered the art of photography, well done. Those are smashing shots. I love the first one especially, it is amazing, were you standing on the control tower or something? It reminds me a little of that dreamlike sequence in Empire of the Sun when Ray Hanna’s P51D goes by so close and level…
Keep it up, you will go very far (especially on this forum).
Dave HomewoodA big thankyou to whoever first suggested the Battle of Britain movie and insisted they use as many real aircraft as possible, the resulting collection virtually kick started the current warbird movement.
I second that one – in fact all the film makers and film companies that have (even if unwittingly) saved aircraft, and who have also seen to it that their films enlighten several new generations of young people to what these planes did and thus generate new fans for the warbirds movement. I don’t count those film makers who deliberately destroyed good aircraft for a special effect however. That is not on.
Even here in NZ a C47 and a Hudson have been wrecked for films. 😡
Dave HomewoodI also seem to remember some Fireflies stuck in Ethopia, in varying degrees of disrepair, I think.
According to the latest Classic Wings two of the Ethiopian Fireflies are on their way to New Zealand to be restored by AvSpecs Ltd., along with two Sabres, all for one owner, John Sayers.
Crazymainer – Charles D’arby is in fact from New Zealand. I too want to thank him for his part in brining so many wrecks out of PNG and the Pacific, and for also co-started Pacific Aircraft, which is now Pioneer Aero, one of the world’s leading warbird restoration facilities. Also thanks to Garth Hogan for buying the same business and keeping up the great work.
I want to thank the various Air Training Corps squadrons and other groups who located derelict airframes on several farms – being used as chook houses, etc – in the 1980’s. They raised money to buy them, and donated them to the RNZAF for their new museum Without them we’d not have a pristine Hudson or Anson. And I think the world’s only Avro 626 was also returned to that museum with the help of the ATC.
I also want to thank the volunteers at the Museum of Transport and Technology in Auckland, first for creating New Zealand’s first real aviation museum – and for saving the likes of a Sunderland, a beautiful Solent and many other airframes from the scrapman in the 1960’s. Also providing a home to the Lancaster that the French Govt. presented to New Zealand, and the Bomber Command Association for restoring it to pristine wartime condition.
Also, thanks to the Motat people and their friends who collected components from crash sites for things like Hinds, Vildebeests, Vincents, etc that are now allowing the Subritzky family to bring these old beasts back from the dead. And the farmer who kept an absolutely complete Airspeed Oxford secreted away in his barn till the 1990’s when Don Subritzky discovered and bought it.
Best of all those in MoTaT who rescued a number of fighters from the Rukuhia scrapyards. Without those people Ray Hanna and Col Pay would today not have flying P40s, and the same goes for the ex-OFMC Corsair that’s back here in NZ, and several other P40’s that are now getting ready to fly again.
Dave HomewoodI just found this page
http://www.rcwarbirds.com/miscellaneouspage.htm
There are some massive aircraft models on it, most of which are very awesome.
Dave HomewoodI’m a little confused. I saw a little bit of ‘The Colour of War III – The American Story’ when it aired the first time and from memory it had an American narrator though it was still a British programme. It is repeating tonight but the narrator is British actor Patrick Macnee. I looked it up on IMDb and the only thing I can find close to it is something they call “The Color of War” but that was narrated by Peter Coyote. Did they make two versions???
Also IMDb calls the others in the series ‘The Second World War in Colour’ and ‘Briatin at War in Colour’ (these being the John Thaw versions.) We saw them as The Colour of War and The Colour of War – The British Story respectively. It seems they have changed stuff for export markets.
IMDb doesn’t even mention the ‘D Day to VE Day’ episode which screened here last year, nor the ‘The Colour of War – The ANZACs’.
Either way, they are all awesome programmes. Tonight’s (episode one of the US angled one) has loads of aviation in it.
Dave HomewoodHaving looked at these photos against Wellingtons and Hampdens, I’m now of the mind that it most probably is a Wellington. If it were a Hampden I’d imagine that you’d see more of the engine nacelle around the wheel well and oleo area. Plus a Hampden has a straight leading edge with tapered trailing edge, but this wing appears more the shape of a Welliington.
And Moggy, you might be right about that exposed structure being geodetic too.
Dave HomewoodHmmm, I have noticed a lot of little innaccuracies in the Norman Franks book. I am very much looking forward to Colin Hanson’s upcoming book on No. 75 (NZ) Squadron which will surely supercede it because Colin is extremely meticulous with his research.
Dave HomewoodHi Nils,
A bit of extra info on the crew of No. 75 (NZ) Squadron Vickers Wellington III X3282:
Captain: Sergeant JOHN FREDERICK MASSEY PARNHAM 1254725 (English, RAF) Aged 21
2nd Pilot: Flight Sergeant JOHN LUKIES BROWN NZ402534 (New Zealander, RNZAF) Aged 22
Navigator: Sergeant ROBERT McGIBBON 998735 (Scottsh, RAF) Aged 26
Wireless Operator: Sergeant MURRAY ALEXANDER McDONALD 400352(Australian, RAAF) Aged 23
Front Gunner: Flight Sergent CAMPBELL EWIN JUSTIN AITCHISON NZ402974 (New Zealander, RNZAF) Aged 22
Rear Gunner: Flight Sergeant JOSEPH HENRY GODFREY 1378233 (Canadian, RAFVR) Aged ??
“Forever Strong” by Norman Franks lists the Rear Gunner as R.E. Godfrey (Canadian) but CWGC does not bring up a name so this must be innacurate.
The same books states:
“Then it was Kiel – and disaster. Eight aircraft were assigned and they found clear weather over the target – the U-boat yards – after 5/10ths cloud on the way in. They met searchlights and heavy flak, and three aircraft failed to return. As the total losses that night were just five, 75 took the brunt of the missing. The crews of Squadron Leader Kitchen, Flying Officer Sandys, and Sergeant Parnham were all killed.”
So this leave two other aircraft from other squadrons – one of which may have been a Hampden. I cannot see any Geodetic framework on those photos so perhaps it is a Hampden.
There will be more detail on the fate of the three No. 75 Sqn crews in ‘For Your Tomorrow’ by Errol Martyn, but I don’t have those books to hand. Perhaps you should post this query on the RAF Commands forum as Errol reads that forum. It is here:
http://www.rafcommands.com/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?az=list&forum=DCForumID6
Dave HomewoodHmm, sounds pretty extensively damaged. A pity.
Does anyone know what a Stearman in flying condition would be worth in $NZ? I wonder if he’ll repair it or buy a new one.
Sign In
