I would love to see such a marriage…………Could we see the third partner???

Who? Canada?

I think that because the T45’s have no main armament outside of Sea Viper it is more important, not less, to enhance it’s capabilities with the 155mm gun. But that is a personal viewpoint that I doubt we’ll see eye to eye on. Also keep in mind that with the shrinking size of the navy, it may be necessary for the T45’s to join the gunline, as horrible as the thought of putting one in harms way may be.

There are advantages of the 155 over the current gun in that R&D funds from the navy can be combined with those of the army to deliver new and better ammunition types, as opposed to a solely navy effort. It also adds range, which is always useful.

I think you’re looking at the supply chain in the wrong way. Instead of focusing on the navy costs, think of the MoD costs as a whole. These decrease when 2 services are using the same system and will after a period of time, compensate for the cost of switching over from 2 systems. And sicne the support and logistics chain becomes shared, it doesn’t have to be built from scratch as you suggest.

I’m sure the Mk8’s would last through to the end of the T45’s lifespan, but there are many benefits that outweigh that fact that will lead to savings and enhanced capability in the long run.

I agree that the Mk8 offers more capability for C3 than the alternatives, but we can always give ships more capability, we have to draw the line somewhere and I think, for the roles it is required of, that a Mk8 won’t be necessary anymore than the 155 will, since the 155 is effectively a replacement of the same capability (with enhancements).

T45 will probably go within gun range of land if giving AAW support to an ARG conducting a landing. In that situation there is no reason why it could not join the gunline.

Right. There is a fellow around, goes by the name of Campbell, talking about it all the time.
He will tell you it’s not a BLIMP. It’s a Zeppelin (it has an internal structure). And it might be a good strategic solution but to vulnerable for tactical use against a more talented adversary.

Against a “more talented adversary” you would need more then 36 F35’s, besides the current sea kings arent exactly invulnerable. Remember they are unmanned and if they have high enough endurance you can bring a few spares along with you and just leave them floating around somewhere outside the combat zone. 😉

The sky is a big place.

Venator looks perfect for C3, it was my first thought when I heard the Aussies wanted to build a multi-role patrol/mcm type. With the Kiwis new patrol ships going **** up, the Italians eyeing up a similar product, the South Africans talking about new hull numbers, I see a juicy order book if BAE pulled their finger out… why not fund a prototype? Worked with the Hawk.

UK version of LSC, looks complicated and very expensive for something that is supposed to be basically an OPV and MCM rolled ship.

The big problem with AEW based Helicopters. Is the much lower service ceilings………….Thereby, limiting the range of there Radars.

V-22 is not pressurised, it has the same problem with service ceiling. I’m guessing CVF will have Merlin AEW’s supported by long endurance UAV’s.

Wonder if you could make an AEW version of Mantis…….

I know there’s another thread but this one was higher on the list:

My preference is the V22, it’s VTOL and will perform quite well in the Littoral and further out.

To expensive, no real advantage since they are not pressurised.

The problem is that you would effectively need to beef the C-3 up to at least the spec currently mooted for C-2, if not C-1. The fleet needs to be balanced, with high end ships, to escort the carriers (etc…), reasonably capable ships for use in places like the Gulf, and low end for straightforward patrol tasks.

I am in favour of seeing a couple more Type 45s ordered, and pretty capable C-1s built, to complement them. The C-2s could use the same basic hull as C-1, just with a different weapons fit. Ideally, the C-2s should be the spiritual successors to the Type 23’s capabilities, e.g. AShMs, CAMM (at least), and with the ability to take the 2087 sonar from the T23s.

The C-3s should be capable of operating in more than just benign environments, such that we don’t always need to assign C-2s to them, just to let them do their job. Most minesweeping/hunting now is expeditionary, so almost by definition, they will probably be needing to be used in non-benign environments.

Hopefully the C2 will end up being a C1 with more FFBNW in them. 😉

Obi seems to have pretty much nailed C3, like you say, enough deck to land a merlin, enough Hanger to house a Wildcat lynx minimum, though I’d bin the Phalanx and the 114mm gun for 2 twin mount 40mm Dardo’s (deck penetrating forward and zero penetration on the hanger) for use with BAe’s 3p ammo, and run up a versatile launch system in place of the harpoon rack to allow the use of CAMM, Fireshadow and Stingray as well as Harpoon, perhaps in a self contained Mini-VLS (like the american NLOS-LS, the PAM would make a nice replacement for the gun too).

Oh, and swap out the 7.62 crewserves (2x minigun and 2x GPMG) for 2x .50 cal 6 barrel GAU-19s and 2 Brownings.

Umm, the idea is to make this thing cheap but still capable, not to turn it into a UK version of the LSC in terms of cost.

You realise that an OPV with:
-1 x 4.5mm gun (Mk.8)
-1 x RAM or SeaRAM
-Deck and Hanger for Lynx
-2 x 30mm guns in remote mounts along superstructure

would have more firepower and flexibility then one of the Sea Wolf equiped broad beam Leanders.

Harpoons are not needed, the Lynx/Wildcat can do the job with Sea Skua 2 as long as a decent armoury for helicopter launched weapons is included.