It may be a slow news-day story, yet I think it’s doing some good in the end. If at the very least it’s helping raise awareness of the museum, which might do it a lot more good than just money. For instance, as with many I had no idea that the city/museum/aircraft existed, but now that I know it does, I’m adding it to my list of places to visit very soon. So that’s my take anyway.

Now what did I say, and where’s the delete?

hah! I’ll never divulge such things so easily, they’ll follow me to my grave! No no, I was just giving you deserved credit for dousing at least my flames a good bit, good sir.

On an unrelated note, one last message to Baz (Spitfireman) while corresponding with Michael Lane (cousin of Brian mentioned in my piece) he loved the pictures and is adding them and the piece to their family dossier he’s been assembling, so it seems we’ve both been able to add to Lane family history.

Well it’s Thursday, and I return, as promised. Firstly, I really want to thank everyone for all the support that I have gotten for my very first piece. It’s really been a fantastic ride.

Now, I need to address J Boyle. Firstly, I think a lot of miscommunication has been happening. Until your last post I was unaware of what point exactly you were trying to make. For days I’d been dealing with peoples’ appraisals of the entire piece, or very clearly stating the part in question they disliked. It seemed to me your statements were in the former category, which had I realized you were really referring to one particular aspect of the piece my responses would have been drastically different. And if it was clearly stated and in the mix I somehow missed it, then for that I apologize.

At this point I have to take another moment to reiterate a very strong point. This piece was in no way meant to cover the entirety of the pre-Pearl Harbor World War Two or even the entirety of the Battle of Britain. It is meant to inspire strong emotions and increase awareness and encourage pride as well as self-reflection. Things have to be left out, as this was a piece of rhetoric, not a historical document. I put historical information into it, but enough books have been written on the subject I didn’t need to write an entire new one to put down into words the feelings that came to mind as I stared into the face of a very admirable man. Instead I wanted something that would get people to want to know more for themselves, and I think in that I was successful.

Please do not assume as I’m younger than you and may not have studied some things for as long as you in this area that I’m therefore a novice. I actually know a great deal about volunteer Americans in the RAF/RCAF, particularly as individuals, however, the main course of the arguments I’ve been dealing with have been people only focusing on American involvement in the Battle of Britain, which put me into that focus. Had it been made more clear that you were upset that I only made passing mention to the American volunteers who did come after, this would have been a whole different thread. But it leads me back to my other point, I had to pick and choose with this piece. No, I didn’t make that big a deal of the brave Americans who went after, but I assure you it would not have changed the tone of my piece had I put more attention to it. But it isn’t that I didn’t mention them at all either. I stated that the “first squadron” of volunteers didn’t make it into service until February of 1941, which the use of first implies that more came after, not that none joined up until Pearl Harbor. Could I have elaborated on that more, yes, but I suppose I felt that going into things like that in too much more detail would have been a distraction from the main thrust of the piece, and if that’s what offends you, then unfortunately, I don’t really feel that’s my problem. I’m sorry that you don’t like that aspect, but at this point I can’t change it, I wouldn’t even if I could, and as I’ve said before I knew this piece was going to ruffle feathers if anyone else ever read it.

Which is another thing I would like to be understood, this was the first piece I have written that has gotten any attention from an audience of any kind, ever. Until now, no one, not even my friends or family, had ever viewed my page(by which I’m referring to any page of my site, including the main page, all views came from myself). Now less than a week later my page have been viewed over 1,800 times in now at least twenty five countries, probably more. It’s going to be read by an RAF Wing Commander aloud to crowds at an RAF airbase and been read and approved of by some of Britain’s elite. I never intended any of this in writing this piece. As I’ve said to others, the only person I ever figured would read it, and maybe even only person I ever intended it for, was me. Had it been intended for a wider audience, I may have written things differently, gone into a few more details here and there. But at present, this is how it stands, and now that maybe the air is cleared a little, we can make things a bit less hostile as far as the debate goes.

But in the future, J, I would please ask that you do not alter quotations of other people by adding bold marks and underlining to act as stress points or making statements such as “in my 40 years of” to help prove your points, it comes off as rather condescending and rude and does not lead to civil responses and debate. I know that sounds like a bit of a prickly statement, but in my time of studying how best to communicate effectively in the online world with the inherent communication deficiencies therein, those are just a couple tips to keep people from becoming standoffish when you’re trying to debate. It also makes you seem more like you’re actually following your signature and your description “with malice towards none”. Those are the tactics of “trolls”, not educated people.

Now for Kev35, I’m sorry for the misunderstanding then, and I do thank you greatly for the kind words. As my first piece, and as it was written with such passion on my part, I admit, I got defensive. You’re right, the missions flown by Bomber Command, particularly in the early days with the very outdated Blenheim were also the work of heroes, and it is an injustice that so little is known about them. And who knows, maybe in the near future I’ll write a piece on that as well. But again, I apologize for mistaking your intentions.

Now for Spitfireman Baz, this news pretty well has me speechless… I’m so flattered by that I really don’t know how to properly say thank you… Well I suppose saying thank you works but it just doesn’t feel like enough. So thank you again and I’m anxiously waiting to hear how it all went.

To PeterAsh, welcome to the board as well, well, welcome to the thread at any rate! And I thank you very kindly for your words.

To Pagen01 and Radpoe Meteor, thank you very much for your support. I really hope someday I get the chance to actually meet so many of you all and thank you face to face.

Now a special thanks too to James K for his kind words in talking me into returning, and identifying some personalities around here to help give me a better understanding of the rest of the crew. I’ll do my best in spite of the rough times to be there in Chino for the handshake and drinks, no promises but to try.

Cheers all! (note, since I’m still trying to take a break this will pry be my only post today, so much to do and so little sleep…)

Interesting indeed, nice to see that good shows like this are going to be available here in the US! Hadn’t heard of the original film, I’ll have to look it up and see if I can find it somewhere. Cheers!

No worries Nathan 🙂

For what it’s worth. I wrote this 11 years ago and a buddy put it up online. When those guys get in your system, it’s easy to get invested in them

http://www.worldwar2pilots.net/b24intro.htm

Very nice piece yourself Dan! That must have been an amazing experience, getting to meet the families of those men and learn their stories. It’s the sort of thing I wish I could do.

My personal experience with the veterans of that war has been limited. One of my old paper-route customers was in both Normandy and was on the flank of the German counter offensive that created the Battle of the Bulge. I would often make him my final customer so that I could stop and listen to his stories and try and absorb his wisdom. Another was my next-door neighbor, who unfortunately passed away about a month after I learned he’d been a waist gunner on a B-17 with the 2nd Bomb Group in North Africa and Italy. I only had one time that I got to actually talk to him about his experiences. My own grandfather had been a naval corpsman with the Marines on Okinawa, but he passed away when I was 9, and we only have one or two stories from him that he passed on to my Uncle, we’re sure there was many many more that he intentionally took with him to the grave. So in light of that, I can only imagine what it felt like for you getting to share all those emotions and stories and connect the dots for those families. That was a very noble deed indeed.

Incidently, on a rather unrelated note, does anyone know of any good postgraduate schools there in the UK? I’m getting tired of my options here in the US and of the US school system in general, so I’m looking at other options. Cheers in advance!

My apologies Nathan if you thought I was arguing your point. I wasn’t asking you to defend your writing. It was more my own curiousity based on your article that got me digging into this stuff, along with it by chance connecting a bit to a personal project on that Yank Beaufighter driver.

It’s safe to say that the US was very much isolationist at the time and Roosevelt was walking a tightrope with an election year and the influences of big name isolationists like Charles Lindbergh among others.

I think what it all shows is that we as a country were not there to help directly as ‘it wasn’t our war’ at the time.

Sorry if it seemed like I was flying off the handle a bit there Dan, and I suppose I was a little. I’ve actually been contemplating writing a sort of apology for my prickly responses lately. Baz was right, I was getting a bit too into it! So I’m sorry for that. And it wasn’t just here either, I’ve put up with the same arguments elsewhere too. I guess I just feel I have a bit of a duty to stand up for my statements, as to my frame of mind how could I ever really look these men who I championed for in the face and go “well, I wrote a very moving piece to inspire people to remember you and learn more about you but some people disagreed with me so I backed down.” So I guess that’s where I’m coming from. but I promise i’ll lighten up from now on. It’s no excuse however for me attacking someone who was doing what my goal was all along, getting curious and trying to learn. So for that, I definitely apologize. Though I hope from past posts maybe some of my frustration can be a little understood… you do sort of feel like you’re “beating a dead horse” after a while as the saying goes. but again, no excuse in your case so i apologize for my harsh response.

@bluenoser352: Eh, that’s not an open-fire sort of question. I was curious about that myself, but apparently from what I’ve read it received a lot of opposition for fear of it being turned into another “yanks save the day” flick, in England in particular, so they probably let it fall by the wayside. But it was a reasonable fear, could you really imagine Hollywood making a film in which the hero of “Tog Gun” doesn’t shoot down a single aircraft? It’s probably where Cruise picked up the Valkyrie project instead. He’s been struggling to get people to see him in a more positive light these days. Sorry Tom old boy… but when plotting and trying to carry out an assassination plot against Hitler can’t even fix your image, I don’t think there’s much hope anymore!