Christ was short and swarthy

Can you prove the existence of the laws of logic? Can you see them, can you touch them, can you smell them? No, but you can see their effect, and they do exist. So does God.

So by that same logic you should be able to prove (key word -prove-) to us all that God exists. By the way, simply saying ‘look around you, he created everything you see’ simply isn’t good enough.

The laws of logic tell me if I sit by a bus stop, then logically at some point, a bus will appear. Following this law, logically if I sit outside a church God will appear. Strangely, despite having to spend a lot of my working time in Churches this logical conclusion has not happened.

Except that He did become man and dwell among humans at a set time in history… It’s clearly explained in Scripture that God is not going to just sit down next to you in the park.

Given time, inclination and suitable access to the working of this forum I bet I could trace you and prove your very existence. I’m sure if God has an IP address he could be traced as well.

Well, God’s left traces of His handiwork ALL over the place, and in history as well.

Dinosaurs first appeared 230 Million years ago, existed for 160 million years, and then died out 65 million years ago. Humans have only been roaming the earth for 6 – 7 million years. Do the math !!! Dragons are mythical and only exist in folk law.

Ok, some questions here:
Do you really trust the scientists data about Carbon Dating, assuming everything in this universe is stable? Are they 100% accurate?
Could anything (Else – since I already know you think that creatures have evolved?) have changed over the last 100 million years that would make the scientists data invalid? If dinosaurs and humans evolved, but we have only sketchy (at best) evidence of such, then how are scientists so sure that other things have remained constant?
How come you don’t trust the evidence of past civilizations making pictographs, drawings, cave paintings, and other things representing dinosaur-like creatures, in addition to their “dragon” legends?

You quote the scriptures, read them. You’ll find different accounts of the resurrection, how many people witnessed it, what they saw and how they saw it.

I have read them and they are complimentary, not contradictory.

Ryan

Ryan.

Why is it that I suspect your version of the disciplining of a child involves physical beatings and constant indoctrination? Is beating the crap out of your children until they believe a demonstration of God’s love?

Let’s just say that we non-believers are right, just for a moment. Isn’t it a good thing that when you die you won’t be able to see the astonishing truth of the disappointment of all the empty rhetoric and wasted energy imposed on you by the ‘Church’?

Regards,

kev35

Can you prove the existence of the laws of logic? Can you see them, can you touch them, can you smell them? No, but you can see their effect, and they do exist. So does God.

You seem quite willing to believe that I exist… 😀 You can’t see, hear, or touch me, but you can see my fingerprints all over this thread…

The laws of logic tell me if I sit by a bus stop, then logically at some point, a bus will appear. Following this law, logically if I sit outside a church God will appear. Strangely, despite having to spend a lot of my working time in Churches this logical conclusion has not happened.

Given time, inclination and suitable access to the working of this forum I bet I could trace you and prove your very existence. I’m sure if God has an IP address he could be traced as well.

Well, He told us in Scripture that He created all things – “even the wicked, for the day of evil” – He has a sufficient and just reason for everything He has created. His character demands that He create the world in such a way that ALL of His attributes can be displayed, so we can see justice, mercy, love, etc…

Well that ties it up then, he told us that “he” created everything. Alleluia I’m born again !!!

I created the ever lasting pint of beer. Do you believe me ???

Actually, they were created on the same day… and dinosaurs and humans did live together. You don’t have to look to far, even outside of Scripture to come to that conclusion. There are LOTS of dragon stories in many different cultures over most continents.

Dinosaurs first appeared 230 Million years ago, existed for 160 million years, and then died out 65 million years ago. Humans have only been roaming the earth for 6 – 7 million years. Do the math !!! Dragons are mythical and only exist in folk law.

Because He’s your Creator who deserves it.

I guess my parents would have something to say about this, especially my father.

The resurrection is contradictory, one what basis does he say that?

You quote the scriptures, read them. You’ll find different accounts of the resurrection, how many people witnessed it, what they saw and how they saw it.

Jesus also said that the reason the Old Testament allowed divorce was because of the hardness of their hearts. The OT was MUCH more respectful of women than the surrounding cultures – and Christianity has generally caused women to be much better treated as it’s not Biblical to abuse them.

Also, the children I know who are the best behaved and least likely to cause trouble are the ones that are properly disciplined. Please keep your undisciplined, unruly kids away! It may not be “modern” but it is far superior to train children to behave. Ryan

Liberalism and the will of the people has forced the role of women to be changed and become better treated within western society. Besides this the Churches are still fighting over the role of women in Christianity and the Catholic church still teaches that woman should be subservient to men. It also teaches that penguins were included on the Ark, which is just farcical.

“Actually, I’d argue that it’s nothing short of impossible for you to prove that God doesn’t exist.”

Why would we even want to try? Since there is no proof of his existence there is no requirement to prove the negative. What a bizarre suggestion.

You seem quite willing to believe that I exist… 😀 You can’t see, hear, or touch me, but you can see my fingerprints all over this thread…

I’m not sure God’s a member of this forum, well I’ve not seen any postings by him anyway…

No one has or can prove the existence of god, not even you Ryan. Because as soon as his existence if proven, he then takes a physical form, becomes a fact and not a belief.

Can you prove the existence of the laws of logic? Can you see them, can you touch them, can you smell them? No, but you can see their effect, and they do exist. So does God.

i.e I know that Dogs exist, I see them every day, that is a fact and therefore I can see their faults. I am told that God exists and is pure. But as I can not see him I have to rely on a belief that he exists and their word, but I have no conclusive proof. Other than what I am told and a series of contradicting stories written between 70 and 300 years after the supposed event.

You seem quite willing to believe that I exist… 😀 You can’t see, hear, or touch me, but you can see my fingerprints all over this thread…

If god exists, and is the creator of all things. Why did “he” create the Devil ?

Well, He told us in Scripture that He created all things – “even the wicked, for the day of evil” – He has a sufficient and just reason for everything He has created. His character demands that He create the world in such a way that ALL of His attributes can be displayed, so we can see justice, mercy, love, etc…

He created the earth and all things on it, why did he create dinosaurs first and then wait several million years before creating man ?

Actually, they were created on the same day… and dinosaurs and humans did live together. You don’t have to look to far, even outside of Scripture to come to that conclusion. There are LOTS of dragon stories in many different cultures over most continents.

If god is above ego, why should we worship him ?

Because He’s your Creator who deserves it.

The story of the resurrection is contradicted between whichever account you read. According to a preacher at the church I attended on Sunday, this is conclusive proof of this actually happening and that people who are denying the resurrection are blind to the facts. I would say the same about people who believe whole heartedly in the resurrection that they are not open to an alternative view point.

The resurrection is contradictory, one what basis does he say that?

In the old testament, it advocates subjugation of women, the owning of slaves and the thrashing of children. All good points, but not exactly fitting with modern society.

Jesus also said that the reason the Old Testament allowed divorce was because of the hardness of their hearts. The OT was MUCH more respectful of women than the surrounding cultures – and Christianity has generally caused women to be much better treated as it’s not Biblical to abuse them.
Also, the children I know who are the best behaved and least likely to cause trouble are the ones that are properly disciplined. Please keep your undisciplined, unruly kids away! It may not be “modern” but it is far superior to train children to behave.

Ryan

ps….. If you’re talking about the S.4, it was the Armstrong-Siddeley Python 3.

10 / 10.. although of course Vauxhall’s contribution was’nt a V6 either… it was an inline 4.!

I gave up taking myself seriously years ago,seeing as nobody else did …

We Christians aren’t all a po-faced lot you know.Daughter showed me a tee-shirt in a catalogue yesterday that really cracked me up – it was a portrait of Jesus with His arms stretched out and ” B.R.B ” underneath.

Actually, I’d argue that it’s nothing short of impossible for you to prove that God doesn’t exist.

I’d like to quote from a more believable book than the Bible.

Now it is such a bizarrely improbable coincidence that anything so mindboggingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see it as the final and clinching proof of the non-existence of God.

The argument goes something like this:

`I refuse to prove that I exist, says God, `for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing

But,’ says Man, `The Babel fish is a dead giveaway, isn’t it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don’t. QED.’

`Oh dear,’ says God, `I hadn’t thought of that,’ and promptly vanished in a puff of logic.”

No one has or can prove the existence of god, not even you Ryan. Because as soon as his existence if proven, he then takes a physical form, becomes a fact and not a belief.

i.e I know that Dogs exist, I see them every day, that is a fact and therefore I can see their faults. I am told that God exists and is pure. But as I can not see him I have to rely on a belief that he exists and their word, but I have no conclusive proof. Other than what I am told and a series of contradicting stories written between 70 and 300 years after the supposed event.

A few questions that are never answered.

If god exists, and is the creator of all things. Why did “he” create the Devil ?

He created the earth and all things on it, why did he create dinosaurs first and then wait several million years before creating man ?

If god is above ego, why should we worship him ?

The story of the resurrection is contradicted between whichever account you read. According to a preacher at the church I attended on Sunday, this is conclusive proof of this actually happening and that people who are denying the resurrection are blind to the facts. I would say the same about people who believe whole heartedly in the resurrection that they are not open to an alternative view point.

In the old testament, it advocates subjugation of women, the owning of slaves and the thrashing of children. All good points, but not exactly fitting with modern society.

I’m agnostic, but with a leaning towards atheism more than I will ever to Christianity, because there are just too many inconsistencies and contradictions to make it plausible.

Start a thread on here discussing the dangerous and irresponsible antics of some display pilots (fact) and see how long it lasts before being closed.

Start any off-topic thread in here and see how long it lasts. 😎

Seriously – and I’m not addressing any specific individual here – once words like ‘hypocrisy’ start to be bandied about it is a sure sign that people are either taking what is posted here too personally or taking themselves a tad too seriously.

Words like ‘heat’ and ‘kitchen’ spring to mind.

It’s only a discussion forum on the Internet, for pity’s sake.

Cheers

GA

ps….. If you’re talking about the S.4, it was the Armstrong-Siddeley Python 3.

If I wrote on here or even in a book that the Wyvern was powered by a merlin v6, there would be a flood of replies shooting me down.

To be honest Beejay, if you did say that many on here would’nt question it because they don’t know any better.

As for those so called non believers, just see how many turn to prayer when a loved one, relative or family member is in extreme danger. A prayer to this so called non existent God.. or to his son Jesus Christ… in their darkest hour or deepest need. Now to me that smacks more of hypocrisy than any other argument that has been put forward on here yet.

If those on here do not believe then that is your choice, but why do you take delight in spouting words of venom and ridicule directly and indirectly towards those of us who do… whilst at the same time hiding behind this convenient veil called free speech. Start a thread on here discussing the dangerous and irresponsible antics of some display pilots (fact) and see how long it lasts before being closed.

The church that i am a member of does huge amounts of work for charities, it also helps feed the poor with food hampers, helping the elderly and needy in clearing gardens and tidying up their houses, giving free councelling and advice, giving youngsters and teenagers a different direction in life instead of getting into crime, a community drop in for those who need company and support.. and much much more besides. And all of this is done by Christians through religion with money raised within the Church itself.
Now are you still trying to tell me that nothing good comes from Christianity, and from those who have found solace.. and believe.? Or are these the actions of ‘the scum of the earth’.?

Also i personally have friends who are both Christian and non Christian, and i treat them all with the same kindness and friendship just as they treat me.. and not as kev35 eludes to that as a ‘believer’, i feel superior to those who don’t.

Sure Allah’s more or less person-shaped? Guess you’re thinking of the, er, slightly less than conventional-looking Hindu Gods PeeDee?

Tee hee, lovin’ it!
This is why a lot of forums (Even adult ones which keep the “General” section to password access only) refrain, ney; ban Politics and Religion.
Both these [ahem] professions are littered with the scum of the earth, and in this case they are indeed all tared with the same brush. There is not one of them without an alternative agenda, usually money or odd sexual proclavities.

Jesus was just a bloke, live with it.
Belief comes from a desire to improve, which comes from basic survival instinct.

As an ignorant question, is Jesus the only “Human” version of a God or Son of God? All the other lot seem to have mystical beings created in the mind of an industrial sized Bong user.

I was most amused to read about the bishop who accused the monks who produce Buckfast of betraying christian values. When the bishop prays to Jesus he ought to give him a good telling off for being so irresponsible as to turn water into wine.

http://www.decanter.com/news/293976.html

And the thieving b*stards stole all the decent festivals and holidays.

According to this article ( all right, I know it’s the Daily Mail ) , humans actually have a part of the brain that pre-disposes them to believe in ” something “. Possibly that part’s more developed in some people than others.

The whole point of the article is that the urge to ‘believe’ is primordial – something deep from our evolutionary past. Perhaps we will evolve a little more to cast off that emotional crutch altogether.
Christianity is simply another in a long line of primitive superstitions – just a more streamlined progression from having a cumbersome plethora of different Gods for every occasion.
Maybe it’s my pagan Pictish heritage, but the idea of worshipping sun, fire and water Gods seems slightly less ridiculous to me – at least I know that I would surely die without them…

But because God is not behaving as we think a God should, does not prove that he is not there.

If God doesn’t behave like we think he should, why on earth would you have him around? It’s a bit like asking Ted Bundy to look after your little sister…

According to this article ( all right, I know it’s the Daily Mail ) , humans actually have a part of the brain that pre-disposes them to believe in ” something “. Possibly that part’s more developed in some people than others.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1211511/Why-born-believe-God-Its-wired-brain-says-psychologist.html

Why is it people generally seem to respond to a question with another question when discussing this? Forget the scenario; that’s totally irrelevant and the question is very simple, so again, why doesn’t he sort things out? Surely such a great being shouldn’t need a simple human to tell him what needs doing.