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  • in reply to: X-32 and X-35/F-35 rematch, chosen separately by branch #2086113
    datafuser
    Participant

    When was that image drawn and by which company?

    [ATTACH=JSON]{“data-align”:”none”,”data-size”:”full”,”title”:”22740.jpg”,”data-attachmentid”:3874676}[/ATTACH]

    in reply to: X-32 and X-35/F-35 rematch, chosen separately by branch #2086135
    datafuser
    Participant

    Thats the Falcon 21 AKA F-16U like i mentioned it, the Falcon 21 ++ was an altogether diferent beast, it was described in the documents of a Congress earing in 1991; both the Falcon 21 ++ and the F-15XX (an Eagle with a new wing, new radar, F-119 engines, and some frontal RCS management https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightP…20-%202652.PDF) were alternatives to the ATF program.
    Later LM picked the work done by GD, changed it and called it the “F-16X”.

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]250611[/ATTACH]

    I captured that image from a 1991 Senate hearing back in 2013.

    Yesterday I enlarged it and looked at it again, and the aircraft in it looks like a Falcon 21 with twin tails.

    Its wing is a clipped delta like the Falcon 21 and it looks like the aircraft has both inboard and outboard trailing-edge flaps, at least to my eyes.

    So, the blurry image here might be the Falcon 21++ indeed, IMHO.

    [ATTACH=JSON]{“alt”:”Click image for larger version Name:tFalcon21pp.PNG Views:t0 Size:t12.6 KB ID:t3874639″,”data-align”:”none”,”data-attachmentid”:”3874639″,”data-size”:”full”,”title”:”Falcon21pp.PNG”}[/ATTACH]

    in reply to: Team Tempest Future Fighter from the UK #2134327
    datafuser
    Participant

    The Bank of England electronically created new money worth £435 billion to buy, mostly, UK government bonds in 2008-2016.

    Can the UK government issue bonds in this way again to pay for the development of a new fighter?

    https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/monetary-policy/quantitative-easing

    in reply to: Airwar in the 80s WP vs NATO #2196354
    datafuser
    Participant

    Attached slides show the scenario of a war game conducted from 8 to 10 November 1976 to test the E-3A’s capabilities.

    Three waves of simulated Warsaw Pact aircraft – 85, 93 & 80 – attacked NATO SAM sites, airbases and nuclear storage facilities.

    in reply to: Airwar in the 80s WP vs NATO #2196400
    datafuser
    Participant

    A lot importance is given to the dogfighting capability of fighters in the 70s and 80s
    In airwar like Vietnam it was probably important since there were relatively few enemy fighters , even in the 1991 gulf war enemy airforce put up minimal resistance
    But will it also hold true to the same degree in the hypothetical scenario between masses of aircraft on both sides in a WP NATO clash ?

    I mean aircombat by the 80s esp in such a scenario not as simple as one fighter against another,they are so many other factors which makes individual dogfights less important.

    What would likely be the most common cause of losses amongst fighters and strike planes in a scenario

    1-Shot down by other fighters using WVR weapons cannons/missiles
    2-Shot down by other fighters using BVR weapons
    3-Shot down by SAMs

    Any other thoughts /comments on 80s era air war.Also if anyone can recommend a good source for it ?
    Thanks

    Attached are from a Senate hearing in 1988 and a 1982 AW&ST story.

    in reply to: Boeing and SAAB Look to offer Gripen for USAF's T-X Program #2244361
    datafuser
    Participant

    It’s an idea dating back to 1989.

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]220708[/ATTACH]

    in reply to: F-101 Voodoo pics. #2253517
    datafuser
    Participant

    A rare picture of the F-101A showing its internal weapon bay.[ATTACH=CONFIG]217596[/ATTACH]

    in reply to: Turkish Air Force – News & Discussion #2275250
    datafuser
    Participant

    My question is whether F100/110 is at the same tech level of F414/M88/EJ200 and their proposed developmental variants, or whether it would require significantly more investment from Turkey to bring it up to that level, if that is even possible.

    F135 in its present form would seem foolish given that it is a very different design tailored for F-35B lift system. Might F119 be available?

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]216304[/ATTACH]
    From http://www.energy.kth.se/proj/courses/Seminars/KTHlecture2_ulfolsson.pdf

    datafuser
    Participant

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]216235[/ATTACH]

    41 years ago in 1972 over North Vietnam, the F-4J’s ancient radar could lock on to the “stealth” MiG-21 at 25 NM.

    in reply to: Gripen NG vs. PAK-FA? #2276390
    datafuser
    Participant

    My guess: a combination of land-based radars, ship-based radars, and Erieye, all linked in with the Gripens.

    Then it will be broadly similar to the tactics the MiG-21 used when intercepting US formations under GCI guidance over North Vietnam. Note that the MiG-21’s own radar was inferior to the F-4.

    Below is part of a 22 January 1972 report to the then National Security Adviser Henry Kissenger.

    http://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1969-76v08/d3

    The GCI radars are key to the effectiveness of the MIGs operating over NVN/Laos and also play an important role in SAM operations. The GCI radars detect and track our aircraft and this information is passed on to the SAM units as well as to MIG bases. MIGs normally operate under control of the GCI radars which direct them to our aircraft. Since the MIGs have poor radar, without the GCI they are blind except during optimum weather. Thus, knocking out the GCI radars would almost eliminate the MIG threat and reduce the effectiveness of the SAMs.

    There are, however, problems associated with striking the GCI radars:

    – Our anti-radar missiles (e.g., Shrike) are not effective since the enemy knows when we launch them and, by shutting off his radars, can avoid being hit.

    – The radars are a small target. We have not been effective in hitting them in the past using conventional bombs except by using a number of aircraft.

    Radars are easy to repair and in most cases are operational within 48 hours of being hit.

    – Since NVN has overlapping GCI coverage, even if one or two radars are out, the air defense can still operate. Also, since they can be repaired quickly, the Air Force must continue taking precautions (e.g., providing air defense and radar suppression aircraft to protect our B–52s) so hitting the sites does not reduce the diversions of fighter aircraft to the air defense mission.

    in reply to: Indian AMCA and Korean KFX #2279283
    datafuser
    Participant

    This is incorrect.

    Both Boeing and EADS offered to comply with all 53 out of 53 tech transfer/personnel assistance requests. Lockheed offered to comply with only 23 out of 53 and basically got an F in the offset category. This is why the DAPA threatened to disqualify both the Silent Eagle and the F-35 bids if both were offered on FMS terms as originally proposed by the US DoD. The Silent Eagle is offered on the DCS term and thus Boeing can bypass the US DoD and offer whatever the term it sees fit, pending the US congressional approval.

    The issue with Boeing’s offer is not the scope of it(100% compliance); but getting the US congressional approval for said technologies.

    I believe both AW&ST and KIDA are better informed than you.

    Although I know you can’t/won’t, do you care to cite your source?

    in reply to: Indian AMCA and Korean KFX #2279636
    datafuser
    Participant

    South Korea’s KF-X
    KF-X Costs, Prospects Disputed By S. Korean Agencies
    Aviation Week & Space Technology Apr29, 2013 , p. 49
    Bradley Perrett
    Beijing

    South Korean defense agencies clash over KF-X prospects

    Printed headline: Achievable or Not?

    If South Korea builds its proposed KF-X stealth fighter, it will need to export it. So one key question hanging over the much-delayed project is whether the country can build the aircraft cheaply enough and attract adequate demand. Another is whether South Korea can build it at all.

    Following a two-year concept-definition study of the program, the Agency for Defense Development (ADD), the program ‘s chief proponent, says the KF-X could indeed be developed at an affordable cost and carve out a sizable niche in the world fighter market. The other view, held by the Korea Institute for Defense Analysis (KIDA), is that the country is not ready to embark on such an ambitious project.

    Both organizations belong to the defense ministry. Discord between them, bordering on antagonism, is a factor in the 10-year impasse in the project’s decision-making, although KIDA shows signs of relenting, suggesting that South Korea should try to modify a foreign fighter.

    The ADD foresees a cost of 6 trillion won ($5.5 billion) in developing an all-new KF-X with two engines each producing at least 18,000 lb. of thrust. Building 120 units would cost another 8 trillion won, and operating them for 30 years would cost 9 trillion, it told an official seminar in January. KIDA counters the development cost alone would be more than 10 trillion won. It cites estimates by Boeing and EADS . The top of EADS ‘s range was 17 trillion won, almost three times ADD’s figure.

    To assess KF-X’s export potential, ADD sought advice last year from two consultants, IHS Jane’s and Strategic Defense Intelligence (SDI). IHS Jane’s believes that 220 to 676 KF-Xs could be exported to countries such as Indonesia, Turkey, Singapore, Israel, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, India and Finland if the aircraft is priced at $70-90 million per copy, presumably without spares or training. The consultancy estimates the price of the best-selling Lockheed Martin F-16 Block 50 at $70 million and the Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet , Eurofighter Typhoon and Dassault Rafale at $83-132 million. SDI offers slightly lower KF-X sales estimates, while adding five Latin American countries as potential customers.

    KIDA argues that KF-X’s accessible market is only about 500 units and that the consultancies have been unrealistic in their assumptions of the fighter’s potential market share. It sees the T-50 advanced trainer of Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) as an example of a project justified by inflated sales estimates . The think tank says Teal Group, a U.S. consultancy commissioned by KAI, estimated sales of 800 T-50s in a market of 3,000 aircraft. Eight years after putting the T-50 on the market , KAI has so far taken only one order, for 16 aircraft for Indonesia. Jeon Young-hoon, the T-50’s former chief engineer, has also criticized the KF-X target price as unrealistically low, saying the fighter would have no cost advantage over the Super Hornet in materials, labor and overhead.

    Technological readiness is another area where ADD and KIDA sharply disagree. ADD says an independent group of South Korean experts determined that the industry was mature in 89% of 432 technology items required to develop the KF-X. The areas of immaturity included flight control, radar and infrared stealth , data fusion and twin-engine integration. ADD proposes to address these deficiencies by seeking help from the winner of the separate the F-X Phase 3 contest for 60 fighters. The competitors are the Lockheed Martin F-35 , Boeing F-15 Silent Eagle and Eurofighter Typhoon .

    But KIDA notes that Boeing and Lockheed Martin say they can provide assistance in only about half of 48 technology items requested, due to technology transfer restrictions. According to KIDA, the U.S. companies will neither invest nor take a risk in the KF-X, but EADS is willing to consider investment if South Korea buys the Eurofighter .

    Siding with KIDA, Jeon says flight control is an area of unmanageable risk, because South Korean experience in flight control is limited to conversion of an algorithm into a different programming language. Lack of experience in flight control is part of the reason why ADD has prepared two series of designs, one for an aircraft with its horizontal stabilizers aft, which it considers to be a U.S. style, and one for a so-called European fighter, with a canard stabilizer. The origin of the flight-control technology will determine the configuration.

    KIDA proposes modifying an existing fighter such as the Super Hornet or F-16 . ADD concedes that a modified Super Hornet would meet South Korean air force requirements, but stresses that it would not meet other goals, such as exports and aerospace industry development. Neither ADD nor KIDA cites the KF-X ‘s combat effectiveness in future war scenarios in supporting their view . That reflects the South Korean tradition of assessing weapons development industrially instead of militarily.

    in reply to: Indian AMCA and Korean KFX #2279660
    datafuser
    Participant

    The IOC is 2021.

    From the same AW&ST story:

    http://www.aviationweek.com/Article.aspx?id=/article-xml/AW_04_29_2013_p46-571780.xml

    ” First mooted within the government in 1999, and announced as a national objective in 2002, KF-X has been under study for 14 years, repeatedly failing to gain authorization for full-scale development, which it still awaits. Early in the program, the targeted in-service date was 2015; now, it cannot fly before 2021, and therefore cannot be operational until middle 2020s, if it survives powerful opposition (see page 49). “

    in reply to: What does JAS-39 offer over F/A-18 or F-16? #2310615
    datafuser
    Participant

    Gripen A/B RWR (VMS1) has standard deviation of accurancy of 7 degrees.
    Gripen C/D RWR was upgraded with interferometric arrays. Standard deviation of accurancy error 1 degree.

    Gripen E/F will use scattered conformal broadband antennas. Accurancy not public.

    Are these data from an official source?

    If so, I’d appreciate if you could post a link/screen capture or cite the source.

    in reply to: What does JAS-39 offer over F/A-18 or F-16? #2311990
    datafuser
    Participant

    Gripen NG will detect the emissions from form the SU-35 radar a looooong way away… and with triangulation a group of Gripen can even produce a track, without emitting anything 😉

    Any concrete data on the Gripen EW system’s angular error and timing accuracy? What’s the CEP of triangulation?

    Do they triangulate by using the direction of arrival? Or something else?

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 347 total)